2.2 setup upgrade advice

[spaace]

Hi,

I have been running my 2.2 setup with a yamaha DSP A2070 as a preamp + sub out

Off late i have been wanting to upgrade to the hypex nc400 which has balanced inputs, which cant be provided by my Yamaha.

Ofcourse converters are available but iam not sure of the sound with them and iam worried of buying these converters which could be a dead investment.

Coincidentally my dac + source failed too.

So iam in the lookout to upgrade my entire electronics of which only the amp (the hypex kit) + source( raspberry pi based dac, chromecast) seems to be frozen

So iam in the lookout for a good DAC/ preamp

These seem to be my options

1. Dac with volume control + active crossover
2. Direct dac with volume control and with simultaneous outputs which be fed to sub at the same time
3. DAC + Preamp with sub out (emotiva xsp-1?)
4. Preamp with DAC and subout - eg Parasound P6 (good reports but does not measure as well as the emotiva?)
5. DAC + preamp + activecrossover
6. AVR with preout

I was hoping folks here might have tried these experiments out during some of the meets and could help me out, from the listening tests that have been done. I would especially like to know if anyone has tried out an active crossover, so that i can remove the preamp from my equations.

Please do advice which might work out the best for me. I use a pair of KEF R500 with an SVS Sb200 sub. Usage - 90% music.

Thanks
Arun



budget : 1500$

 

[kanna.sridharan]

CA CXN V2

 

[newlash09]

Hi Spaace...you have lot of options out there to achieve your goal. And a lot will depend on how well you can use DSP software's like dirac and REW.

If you are good at rew and sound graphs a minidsp will fit you well .

But the ultimate flexibility will be a dac cum preamp or a dac and separate preamp feeding a external active crossover, with gain and phase controls for different frequency bands. And all driven by a digital source with inbuilt dsp in the music playback software like roon or audirvana or jplay to name a few.

Iam on a similar path like yours, and have just completed my box collection. So will share my impressions come October this year, when I will be free to put it all in place.

 

[spaace]

I am mighty curious to know the cans you have selected ... which is the crossover and preamp you have selected ....also wouldn't all active crossovers have inbuilt dsp on them ?

 

[spaace]

Its become so complicated that i sometimes dream of going back to a regular 2.0 setup with some full range speakers ...if only goldenears speakers had better construction ...i saw some electrostat speakers doing thr same with in built woofers ....

 

[raghupb]

Its become so complicated that i sometimes dream of going back to a regular 2.0 setup with some full range speakers ...if only goldenears speakers had better construction ...i saw some electrostat speakers doing thr same with in built woofers ....

KEFs are good on their own; you also have a sub.
DSP makes it easier to match these to your room and tweak.
But have you given up on just the traditional analog pre solution?
I'm getting a Parasound NC 200Pre in a few days. Will post impressions after hooking up in my rig.
If interested, watch this thread (https://www.hifivision.com/threads/parasound-new-classic-range-any-owners-here.74994/)

Cheers,
Raghu

 

[elangoas]

Please do advice which might work out the best for me. I use a pair of KEF R500 with an SVS Sb200 sub. Usage - 90% music.

An AVR should do it for you as you have passive speakers + active subs..

DAC + preamp + activecrossover

Have never used a standalone active crossover, nor have heard of it.. sorry if it sounds a dumb question.. How would you connect active crossover to your passive speakers?

 

[spaace]

The concern with avr was that good avrs with preouts come at a steeper rate and then too its preamp stage or thd etx is not as good as a dedicated preamp or dac

Active crossover highs woukd go to amp and then to the speakers

Active crossover lows would go to the subs which have an amp built in ofcourse.

I hope thats possible.

 

[spaace]

KEFs are good on their own; you also have a sub.
But have you given up on just the traditional analog pre solution?


Cheers,
Raghu

I am concerned just an anlog pre will limit what i can achieve ....

Having a crossover or dsp will allow me to set more parameters eg higher octave for the low pass, delay, gain, filters etc ....ofcourse its only theory at this point ad iam yet to talk to someone who might have done this. The crossover having a high pass allow one to cut the low frequencies to the towers allowing them to perform better by not exerting themselves ...at least thats what the theory says ....

I would love a good analog pre any day of course but as i mentioned in your other thread, the general consensus seems to be that a good pre should be like a straight wire and digital volume control from dacs seems to give a much cleaner output any day compared to an analog device in between

Additionally the seperates market seems to be overpriced since it targets audiophiles ...

So thats why iam hesitant about a dedicated pre. I liked the emotiva xsp 1 gen 2 and parasound jcp 2 specs but parasound seems over priced. But going witha pre will free my hand in changing my dacs willy nilly without worrying about its volume control ...yet it vexes me that there is another device in between for all the reasons above .....

 

[elangoas]

The concern with avr was that good avrs with preouts come at a steeper rate and then too its preamp stage or thd etx is not as good as a dedicated preamp or dac

But it would simplify the connections, also has bass management to integrate one or more subs..

An AVR with Audyssey XT32, can handle dual subs.. It has Sub EQ HT feature.. Since you requirement is only for music, you may consider pre-owned flagship models than the brand new ones, which would cost a bomb..

Active crossover highs woukd go to amp and then to the speakers

The speaker already has passive crossover in it..

Active crossover lows would go to the subs which have an amp built in ofcourse. I hope thats possible.

Am not so sure.. But integrating active crossover with passive speakers seem complex..

Anyways if you have figured out the connectivity already, then fine..

 

[spaace]

The speaker already has passive crossover in it

Anyways if you have figured out the connectivity already, then fine..

Yes i do understand that passive crossovers are there ....it splits the signal.n way between its own multiple speakers ....however it does not have a cut off ...so if i ever wanted to ensure my floorstanders does not have to even see the extreme low end (which it is unable to reproduce properly) i guess it wouldnt be possible with the passive crossovers ...

the theory seems to be that it would make the amplification easier if the woofers are operating only upto the frequencies they can reproduce and not much distortions either ....some folks even go so far as disabling the built in passive crossovers ....

But all thats too far away for.me ...All that i want to achieve is to get the low end of the source signal split for my subwoofers in a most future proof manner possible ....


And of course i dont have it all figured out ...iam just regurgitating what i read elsewhere in the hope of someone correcting me ....

ps : my current setup has an avr performing these duties ...i was hoping to maybe improve upon what i already have ?

 

[raghupb]

Yes i do understand that passive crossovers are there ....it splits the signal.n way between its own multiple speakers ....however it does not have a cut off ...so if i ever wanted to ensure my floorstanders does not have to even see the extreme low end (which it is unable to reproduce properly) i guess it wouldnt be possible with the passive crossovers ...

the theory seems to be that it would make the amplification easier if the woofers are operating only upto the frequencies they can reproduce and not much distortions either ....some folks even go so far as disabling the built in passive crossovers ....

But all thats too far away for.me ...All that i want to achieve is to get the low end of the source signal split for my subwoofers in a most future proof manner possible ....


And of course i dont have it all figured out ...iam just regurgitating what i read elsewhere in the hope of someone correcting me ....

ps : my current setup has an avr performing these duties ...i was hoping to maybe improve upon what i already have ?

The Parasound NC 200Pre, I have chosen has this hi-pass function on the main L+R preouts (Off and between 20-140Hz)
It also has a full range summed L+R single preout that may be passed to an active sub, that is theoretically dialed into the system/room.
This is what I want to try out in my music chain. In HT bypass, this does not apply; AVR decides it what goes where.
Will let you know how these experiments go. Right now, as you stated correctly, it is theory.
Cheers,
Raghu

 

[RajithKumar]

Hi,

I have been running my 2.2 setup with a yamaha DSP A2070 as a preamp + sub out

Off late i have been wanting to upgrade to the hypex nc400 which has balanced inputs, which cant be provided by my Yamaha.

Ofcourse converters are available but iam not sure of the sound with them and iam worried of buying these converters which could be a dead investment.

Coincidentally my dac + source failed too.

So iam in the lookout to upgrade my entire electronics of which only the amp (the hypex kit) + source( raspberry pi based dac, chromecast) seems to be frozen

So iam in the lookout for a good DAC/ preamp

These seem to be my options

1. Dac with volume control + active crossover
2. Direct dac with volume control and with simultaneous outputs which be fed to sub at the same time
3. DAC + Preamp with sub out (emotiva xsp-1?)
4. Preamp with DAC and subout - eg Parasound P6 (good reports but does not measure as well as the emotiva?)
5. DAC + preamp + activecrossover
6. AVR with preout

I was hoping folks here might have tried these experiments out during some of the meets and could help me out, from the listening tests that have been done. I would especially like to know if anyone has tried out an active crossover, so that i can remove the preamp from my equations.

Please do advice which might work out the best for me. I use a pair of KEF R500 with an SVS Sb200 sub. Usage - 90% music.

Thanks
Arun



budget : 1500$

I'm not sure but A miniDSP 2*4 HD can be tried ,it has active crossovers and an inbuilt DAC which may serve your purpose.

 

[spaace]

I'm not sure but A miniDSP 2*4 HD can be tried ,it has active crossovers and an inbuilt DAC which may serve your purpose.

the 2*4 HD DAC was not rated very well in audiosciencereivews. Their SHD solution has it all. (DAC + preamp + room EQ + crossover).
It seems to be an excellent value for money. However i am not sure in general how reliable chinese products are (i have one which failed)

Are there many miniDSP users here? How good is the reliability?

I have seen a lot of mentions of it in DIY forums but mainly as a cheap crossover mechanism, that beats any complicated and tiresome passive crossover implementation.

 

[RajithKumar]

the 2*4 HD DAC was not rated very well in audiosciencereivews. Their SHD solution has it all. (DAC + preamp + room EQ + crossover).
It seems to be an excellent value for money. However i am not sure in general how reliable chinese products are (i have one which failed)

Are there many miniDSP users here? How good is the reliability?

I have seen a lot of mentions of it in DIY forums but mainly as a cheap crossover mechanism, that beats any complicated and tiresome passive crossover implementation.

I'm having one ,but not yet started using it.But I have seen it functionality ,its very user friendly.

 

[newlash09]

the 2*4 HD DAC was not rated very well in audiosciencereivews. Their SHD solution has it all. (DAC + preamp + room EQ + crossover).
It seems to be an excellent value for money. However i am not sure in general how reliable chinese products are (i have one which failed)

Are there many miniDSP users here? How good is the reliability?

I have seen a lot of mentions of it in DIY forums but mainly as a cheap crossover mechanism, that beats any complicated and tiresome passive crossover implementation.

The mini DSP is not a Chinese product. It is a cutting edge box, designed and made in Hong Kong. Lots of folks are using mini DSP products in active setups, and no one has any issues with the performance of the mini DSP units, including the quality of its inbuilt dac. If you'd rather prefer your own dac, then there are digital in and digital out versions of mini DSP as well. All in all, it is a very robust, high quality and flexible system.

Integrating a sub into a 2 channel setup is not easy. The tone of bass at the point of cross over has to be the same between the speaker and the sub. The distance from the listener to the sub, has to be the same as the main speakers. If this is not achievable, then you want the active crossover to have a time delay function. Next the phase at the crossover on both the speaker and sub has to be the same. Next the driver speed has to be same.

Considering all the above, the mini DSP has phase, time delay, and crossover functions. Along with parametric equalization and filters . So it is a good option, if you want to add subs. All the best

 

[newlash09]

Subwoofer Integration with a miniDSP 2x4 HD

Just before Easter I took a punt on a BK Monolith subwoofer that was being sold cheaply locally to me. I'm very glad I did :) . Had I simply relied on the adjustments on the sub to integrate it with my main speakers I don't think I'd be using it for anything more than TV/movies though, but...

hifiwigwam.com

The above article might be of interest to you. All the best again Spaace

 

[spaace]

Subwoofer Integration with a miniDSP 2x4 HD

Just before Easter I took a punt on a BK Monolith subwoofer that was being sold cheaply locally to me. I'm very glad I did :) . Had I simply relied on the adjustments on the sub to integrate it with my main speakers I don't think I'd be using it for anything more than TV/movies though, but...

hifiwigwam.com

The above article might be of interest to you. All the best again Spaace

Oh thats useful. Thank you.

 

[spaace]

The mini DSP is not a Chinese product. It is a cutting edge box, designed and made in Hong Kong.

Considering all the above, the mini DSP has phase, time delay, and crossover functions. Along with parametric equalization and filters . So it is a good option, if you want to add subs. All the best

Oh i was going by only this review - https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...urements-and-minidsp-2x4-hd-dsp-and-dac.2674/

But their SHD version seems to be much better - https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...nts-of-minidsp-shd-dac-dsp-and-streamer.4286/

My only concern was about how well these products are made. I clubbed hongkong in general with China, since well they are technically now chinese. Its good to know the brand is respected. I guess that makes me more comfortable about ordering the SHD.

Thanks