Soundstage and Imaging in Recordings.

[jaydreamer]

Dear fellows,
I am not a regular poster here but I follow the articles and posts, as well as trends here all the time. This forum has helped me really well through the years. Though I moved out of country many years back, I always wanted to get myself updated about music and audio scene there, and HFV has been one of the best forum I could find. Apologies in advance if I sound a little bit harsh, but I want to express what I feel, honestly, mainly about our Indian recordings.

I am a big supporter of Studio recordings, covers, albums, and instrumentals. I really love to hear great music in different perspective as well as new experiments. I have subscribed 100s of channels, follow many artists and bands, buy tracks to support them as well as try to leave very honest and constructive comments. One of the biggest let downs I have found in our recordings, at least with many studios or bands, is the absence of a sense of good soundstage and a dynamic presence or 3D feel to the recording which how a well aware end listener would perceive. Many times I have felt that our engineers are only concerned in plain SQ (that is great) and stereo separation than the art of combining the two channels, if you know what I mean. Lately I have been listening to many covers and albums, recorded good otherwise, sung and played by talented artists, but lacking that dynamic feel when you listen. Yes, I agree, the instruments are heard crystal clear, voices are heard well too, but I feel that sense of integration, soundstage and imaging lacking.

With many recordings it feels that the punch of the main voice is less than what is required, added unnecessary instrumental separation, reverbs, echoes, resulting in a flat soundstage and overly separated channel imaging. The hard left and right channel separation is an old thing (where you find something is only on left while others are only on right always). I am not saying it is bad, in fact it is good when done wisely with proper panning, creating a beautiful effect of holographic space, but not typical flat left and right. One other thing I found is that most of the time instruments overlay or dominate voice too much. It feels synthetic when you listen to such recordings, if you pay attention and really try to involve in it.

In a normal listening environment, like a TV, boom box, computer speaker or an average headphone, it might sound fine. But we are a little more than that, aren't we? We try to get the best we can, appreciate the science of best recording and reproduction and enjoy music with it. I am not comparing Tracy Chapman's recordings or Linn Super Audio collection SACD with all of these, but many times I felt why not, at least to a margin. We have got good studios, great artists, talented sound engineers. Then why can't we have wonderful recordings? Again, I am not saying everything is bad. No. I often come across some great recordings from our artists and studios too, but not always. Many times I felt "what an amazing song/cover, instruments, but why not it is making me close my eyes and feel it surrounds me with a space of its own than laying flat in front of me?"

I am not sure how fellows feel here, but I would really love if Studios and Engineers get it, many of them. Every time I listen to "Be Careful Of My Heart" I feel she is right in front of me, or far away from me, letting me forget where my speakers are, what is the shape of my room is, but just be in a transcendental little world of music. It is not synthetic, but lively and soulful.

Thanks
Jay

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I enjoy my music using the best equipment I can have, not the other way around.

 

[Nikhil]

Any specific recordings that you are referring to?

Bollywood recordings are extremely compressed which is my only peeve.
Otherwise technically they are every bit as good as the best I have bought from overseas.

 

[firearm12]

We need good recording and mastering engineers. They don't come cheap and easy. The fact that most people listen to songs in their cars and on TV, don't help either.

 

[bornfi]

Any specific recordings that you are referring to?

Bollywood recordings are extremely compressed which is my only peeve.
Otherwise technically they are every bit as good as the best I have bought from overseas.

Yes, you are correct. Here is my take on this. The digitization of music made it possible to record things without or least amount of noise but it made it extremely difficult to retrieve these and play in original form.

That is the reason why we have tons of DACs in the market and though I have not had chance to listen to best of the DACs but listening to 3-4 different brands convinced me clearly that a good (I mean real good) DAC would reveal something (from the recordings that you may have been listening for years) that you would never have imagined.

See, it is not about just retrieval of details but what matters most is the placement of these in 3D space by bringing out bodies to sounds.

 

[sound_cycle]

Yes, you are correct<snip>See, it is not about just retrieval of details but what matters most is the placement of these in 3D space by bringing out bodies to sounds.

and very careful positioning, treating early reflections, and maybe DRC, for what the artiste and recording engineer intended, the DAC and your transport extracted, to reach your ears for your listening pleasure.

Apparently the multi-bit Schiits really shine with the detail and placement thing, sadly however this is hearsay, (that should be readsay really)

ciao
gr

 

[greenhorn]

I find soundstage and imaging entirely superfluous and something rich "audiophiles" indulge in.

I attend a lot of live performances, and have never bothered about this so called soundstage and imaging.

As long as there is some sort of stereo, good frequency response, and nothing added by the environment, I'm happy

 

[magma]

the first thing to even try and achieve this is SPACE

if you dont have sufficient width and depth around your speakers this is difficult to achieve

the feeling of depth , width , soundstage and imaging etc will come only with space
and in somecases with a lot of trickery and positioning and effort

getting the speakers out at least 1/4 or 1/3rd into the room is a good starting point
BUt then very few have that liberty

 

[amit11]

With many recordings it feels that the punch of the main voice is less than what is required

Very true. In my opinion the fletcher munson curves play a significant role here. Midrange is where the ears are most sensitive and hear MORE compared to other parts of the spectrum. Hence at the time of recording and hearing, it may give an impression that voice/mid-range is enough loud but in fact it is less loud in the mix.

 

[sound_cycle]

the feeling of depth , width , soundstage and imaging etc will come only with space and in somecases with a lot of trickery and positioning and effort

getting the speakers out at least 1/4 or 1/3rd into the room is a good starting point
BUt then very few have that liberty

1/3rd into the room will lead to me being outside, permanently.

I agree completely with the requirement, but my solution has IMHO hugely mitigated the lack of room

ciao
gr