Stereo Setup - Budget 1L-1.5L

[kanna.sridharan]

Sold my whole AVR setup to buy a good Stereo setup. I've done a little homework and I'm at the urge of deciding on what to buy?

Recent auditions

1. Arcam FMJ A19 + Wharfedale 10.7 - after 4 years of listening out of an AVR + bookshelves and sub combo, this setup made me wonder, why didn't I opt for this earlier.

2. Arcam FMJ A19 + Wharfedale 159 - the first thing you notice, the bass is very good and though the dealer says the speaker requires more power, I found it very good. When it comes to the budget aspect, it's just outside

3. Arcam FMJ A19 + Paradigm Studio 60 - really wide sound stage, bright, not really to my taste, would be best suited for HT package.

4. Sonodyne DAC P1 + Opus 2100 (Active speakers) - not really keen on buying bookshelves, so was listening halfheartedly, just because the dealer insisted. It could not go as low as the floor standers.

5. NAIM Nait 5i + Qacoustics 2050i - before I could start playing, I was in the impression these speakers were going to disappoint me, but I was surprised by the way these speakers played, the amount of bass and space it could fill, I had to reconfirm with the dealer whether there was a sub connected to the setup, it was awesome. Sometimes it does get a little boomy, but I tend to like it.

6. NAIM Nait 5i + Revel F12 - never heard of these speakers earlier, but it was the best I've listened to from all the auditions I've been too. The sound stage was excellent, it felt like people where really playing instruments in front of you. Way out my budget...

7. Music Fidelity M3i + Monitor Audio Silver RX 6 - I never liked the way the dealer provided me space for audition, I had people behind my back, who were having their daily marketing meeting, it was annoying. The RX 6, was dull right from the beginning, after hearing a lot of suggestions for MA, I was really disappointed, asked for the current silver line up/

8. Music Fidelity M3i + Monitor Audio Silver 6 - The speaker looked so small, it would fit tight places really well and these speakers gave a lot of life to music. They did not go really low as much as I would've expected, but details were good. Price for these were totally outta reach, I don't know what makes them so special for that price tag.

9. Dealer insisted to listen to the CA 651A connected to the Silver series of speakers, just one song with each speaker
- Silver 6 - sounded good, but I was looking for the next level in amplification
- Silver 8 - you could feel the amp struggle to drive these speakers
- Silver 10 - wooh! I had to ask them to please turn it off before they could do damage to the speakers, the amp just couldn't drive the speakers at any volume level.


It's been a month since I had auditioned all these in Chennai. I was thinking of travelling to Bangalore to audition, but it looks like I'm going to settle in for options available in Chennai.

Right now mind says get the ARCAM FMJ A19 and the QA 2050i, would need some suggestions.. I was really keen on sourcing a Naim from Dubai, dont know if its the right option, the amp is pricey but I feel they do more justice than the ARCAM's.

In all the above auditions, I had my songs play out of the ARCAM irDAC, source my iPhone, not looking for any CD player as my CD collection is bare minimal. At home, I would be using an Airport Express to stream music from my iTunes.

Please help me to decide on what to buy?

Regards,
Kannan

 

[Sawyer]

2. Arcam FMJ A19 + Wharfedale 159 - the first thing you notice, the bass is very good and though the dealer says the speaker requires more power, I found it very good. When it comes to the budget aspect, it's just outside


6. NAIM Nait 5i + Revel F12 - never heard of these speakers earlier, but it was the best I've listened to from all the auditions I've been too. The sound stage was excellent, it felt like people where really playing instruments in front of you. Way out my budget...


It's been a month since I had auditioned all these in Chennai. I was thinking of travelling to Bangalore to audition, but it looks like I'm going to settle in for options available in Chennai.



In all the above auditions, I had my songs play out of the ARCAM irDAC, source my iPhone, not looking for any CD player as my CD collection is bare minimal. At home, I would be using an Airport Express to stream music from my iTunes.

Please help me to decide on what to buy?

If you are doing so much research, you ought to have the time to read:
http://www.hifivision.com/what-should-i-buy/51819-essentials-getting-yourself-good-music-home.html

Seeing that you don't need to spend on source, the budget should be very adequate.

Although I don't know any of the above speakers well, if you have liked 2 or 6 above, in your place, I would look to the used market for amplification that would be a lot cheaper than ones mentioned, and will still work just as well. It would allow you to spend the budget where it will have the most effect on audible sound quality - speakers.

 

[Sawyer]

At home, I would be using an Airport Express to stream music from my iTunes.

Given this, I also suggest you look at:
http://www.hifivision.com/media-streaming-players/51859-sonos-thread.html
While sound quality is a subjective thing, Sonos will take your streaming quality to another level.
In my case I took a fairly large leap of faith in 2011, but I was lucky, it all worked out well.
Knowing Sonos now, making the move to adding a Sonos front end to my Harbeth speakers was easy to do, allowing me to eliminate another slew of audio equipment.
The big barrier is that it is very difficult to audition Sonos. On the other hand, the play 1 that was introduced recently, costs about Rs 15k, and gives a very good way to assess sound quality. I have two units set up to play in stereo in the dining room, and the sound quality from them is quite good. Good enough to make the Rs 30k investment required to make it work an excellent one from my subjective viewpoint. The main system gives better sound, but certainly nowhere near the extent of the price multiple - 10x - it costs over a play 1 pair.

 

[mpw]

whats your room dimension ?

there is a naim xs on sale on this forum and that will leave you with about 60k for a pair of good standmounts..

maybe you may like to go one step at a time and get a good amp or good speakers first.

sometimes there are good deals on audiogon and echoloft if you are open to getting used from abroad.

the arcam you heard is a good amp.. i like it too.

else if you like the arcam + q acoustics a lot.. go for it..

try to see if the dealer gives you a home audition for a small fee.

the exposure 2010s is a good integrated too.

good luck !

preferably buy what you hear.

mpw

 

[grunthos]

If you are considering the Monitor Audio RX6 and QAcoustics 2050, you should try the Paradigm Monitor 7s, PSB Image T6 and the Dali Zensor 7s too. All are available in Chennai

I am using the Dali floorstanders in 2.0 mode (they are awesome ) and the Paradigm Monitor 7s were my second choice. They are in the 70k range. The PSBs are a little higher but have been really recommended by lots of forum members

Audition these before you take a call

Also, now that you mention, I had a brief listen to the Monitor Audio RX6. It was placed badly by the dealer, but even then it was quite disappointing for such an acclaimed speaker. The Monitor Audio BX5s were much better I thought

 

[kanna.sridharan]

Given this, I also suggest you look at:
http://www.hifivision.com/media-streaming-players/51859-sonos-thread.html
While sound quality is a subjective thing, Sonos will take your streaming quality to another level.

Thanks for the information, I'm not giving any serious thoughts in the streaming side as of now, maybe later..

whats your room dimension ?

there is a naim xs on sale on this forum and that will leave you with about 60k for a pair of good standmounts..
the arcam you heard is a good amp.. i like it too.
else if you like the arcam + q acoustics a lot.. go for it..
try to see if the dealer gives you a home audition for a small fee. mpw

I was really tempted for the Naim XS, which is on sale, I was wondering that its already with the 2nd user, moreover I'm planning to keep whatever I buy now for the next 10 years. I've promised my better half - that this is for a long time. Will search for new as of now and then decide.
Standmounts, not really thinking of any - all what I've heard till date requires a sub to play low (haven't heard many though, as the options to demo are limited).
I havent got the opportunity to hear the A19 with the QA 2050i, just going by what I heard at 2 different places & whats best within my budget. (will think over seriously before going this route).
Home audition would be too much to ask, I live 550 kms South of Chennai.

If you are considering the Monitor Audio RX6 and QAcoustics 2050, you should try the Paradigm Monitor 7s, PSB Image T6 and the Dali Zensor 7s too. All are available in Chennai

I got to listen to the Paradigm Studio 60 but not the Monitor series, will ask the dealer next time. The PSB's are no more in Chennai, the DALI dealer in Chennai does not seem to respond to his mail, but will definitely give it a try, heard a lot of positive reviews on the Dali Zensor 7.

Would the ARCAM A19 do justice to any of the above suggested speakers? I just want to set right one component, to decide how to spend the rest.

Thanks to all

Regards,
Kannan

 

[kanna.sridharan]

Room Size is 20' X 20' - would be using this setup in my hall, with all other sources connected to the irDAC (Airport Express, Xtreamer Pro, Tatasky HD, Pioneer BDP-450)

 

[oracle1974]

Dali goes very well Arcam is the sense i got when i was auditioning for my speaker purchases four years back. I have not heard the Zensors but. Then I had found the Marantz amps with Dali very bright. But with Arcam i did not find any such issue.

I had recently auditioned the new Silver series from Monitor Audio paired with Arcam A19. They sounded very good.

I would also second MPW's idea of getting a good amp from Audiogon. I purchase CD37 and A38 from the US. It turned out to be a very good deal.

Good luck.

 

[kanna.sridharan]

I would also second MPW's idea of getting a good amp from Audiogon.
Good luck.

I'm really not thinking of the used route as of now..

My mind is set on the ARCAM A19 for the amp, the speakers oscillating between the QA 2050i, Wharf 159.. going to Chennai on the 8th will drive to the Dali dealer mentioned on the website and see what hes got on store, they just dont reply to mails. If there are any other I have to look for, please let me know. Impressions on the MA Silver 6 are lost, didnt like the demo setup and it is too pricey, not planning on going back to that dealer.

As far as the amp, I hope its a good choice, that can power any F/S I throw at it.

Rgds

 

[BLASTO]

I'm really not thinking of the used route as of now..

My mind is set on the ARCAM A19 for the amp, the speakers oscillating between the QA 2050i, Wharf 159.. going to Chennai on the 8th will drive to the Dali dealer mentioned on the website and see what hes got on store, they just dont reply to mails. If there are any other I have to look for, please let me know. Impressions on the MA Silver 6 are lost, didnt like the demo setup and it is too pricey, not planning on going back to that dealer.

As far as the amp, I hope its a good choice, that can power any F/S I throw at it.

Rgds

Though never heard them together, I don't think either of QAcoustics or Wharf will go well with Arcam. Sound will be very dull.

 

[oracle1974]

Don't have information on Chennai dealers.

Arcam is a good amp. But I would rather choose the speakers first and then the select the amp best to drive them. You can add at a later date a power amp to get more out of the speakers. But once a choice of the speakers is made, there can be no tinkering later. You need to live with them or change them.

If you have a 1.5 L budget, i would tend to spend about a lakh on the speakers and the balance of the amp/cables. The idea is give the speakers a priority.

On Audiogon, you often get items as good as new. So you are constrained by budget if you spend more on speakers, audiogon can be a good a choice and will not be a compromise.

 

[Sawyer]

But I would rather choose the speakers first and then the select the amp best to drive them.
If you have a 1.5 L budget, i would tend to spend about a lakh on the speakers and the balance of the amp/cables. The idea is give the speakers a priority.

Very sensible advice.
I would go a step further - If I knew of a decent used solid state integrated amp with the features needed for say Rs 30k, I would allocate 120k for speakers. Speaker cables would be loose change - about Rs 500.
I would look for two things in the speakers - ability to sing with the power output of the amp, and whether I like the way the speakers sound for the music I like, in the room I plan to use them in. I would also be confident that any solid state amp that is in sound condition, and had adequate power to drive said speakers would sound the same in a blind test with precise sound level matching. Or, more correctly, the speakers would sound the same in the above circumstances.
PS: and although this isn't the reason for this approach, there is a nice side benefit. Passive speakers can last for decades with reasonable care, not much in them that can go wrong. I can't say the same about modern day electronic kit. Also, front end tech on the source side will keep changing, CDPs will go the turntable way etc. But there will always be a need for a good pair of speakers that can accept signals from an ever evolving front end. So if one can avoid the upgraditis syndrome, it is an expense that will be more of any investment than any other, second only to a house.

 

[RAAGA]

Then speaker suggestions, Kef LS50, Kef R300, Monitor Audio GX50(in case you you are still keen on MA)...

 

[kanna.sridharan]

Thank you all for the advice, will continue search for speakers first

 

[asliarun]

Please see if you can listen to odyssey speakers and amps. They are in a different league and price may even be less than some of the options you are considering.

But I believe you will have to go to Bangalore.

 

[apk]

+1 to the suggestion to put a larger share of the money into speakers.

If you have limited funds (as most of us do), then try and sort out the speakers first. They (usually) make the biggest difference to sound quality (am being subjective here to some extent, and there will always be exceptions)

Once you have finalized and bought your speakers, you can take it along with you for auditions with different amplifiers, and chose the amplifier that suites you best.

BTW, there are often good used components that come up for sale on the forum. This is a very good way of getting gear which otherwise would be out of your budget.

Best,
APK

 

[aashish351]

I'm going to say something very opposite to the general consensus building in this thread about budget allocation between amplification and speakers. I do this not to confuse you, but I truly believe based on personal experience that there is no alternative to good amplification. And, based on your current situation I would suggest you to buy a good quality amp first.

The split of 100K to 50K or worse still 120K to 30K in favour of speakers will in my opinion be a disaster. Unless you are getting a great deal on a used amp of the same pedigree as the speakers.

On the other hand the reverse would not be a problem at all. You'll just be under utilising your amp but getting the best from the speakers. And future upgrade path is always open. Carrying your decent amp is far easier than speakers to find the match. The opposite to this is a sorry state my friend.

Personal experience: I partnered Dali Ikon 6 which was valued at 70-80k with an amp valued at roughly double. I had never heard those speakers sing as beautifully as they did after that. But my journey started with the usual preset mindset. I tried them with all the star contenders such as NAD, Marantz, Arcam and a few more amps in the logically appropriate 50-60K budget. Just didn't cut it for me. I'm not saying that you can't find a decent match with a 1:1 budget split or around that ratio. But if at all you are thinking of skewing your budget in favour of getting one component of considerably higher quality than the other (2/3:1/3 kind of ratio or higher), it better be in favour of the amplification.

Once again, it's my opinion backed with personal experience.

 

[kanna.sridharan]

I'm going to say something very opposite to the general consensus building in this thread about budget allocation between amplification and speakers. I do this not to confuse you, but I truly believe based on personal experience that there is no alternative to good amplification. And, based on your current situation I would suggest you to buy a good quality amp first.

The split of 100K to 50K or worse still 120K to 30K in favour of speakers will in my opinion be a disaster. Unless you are getting a great deal on a used amp of the same pedigree as the speakers.

On the other hand the reverse would not be a problem at all. You'll just be under utilising your amp but getting the best from the speakers. And future upgrade path is always open. Carrying your decent amp is far easier than speakers to find the match.

+1. I was always under this impression. But I've seen it go wrong both ways (just from my minimal experience ), a good amplifier paired with a avg. speaker play bad and a heavily demanding speaker not able to sing from a considerably good amp.

I've set my mind this time, I'm going to buy only what I hear from and nothing else. Reviews I would take only to guide me and not to be the deciding factor.

Thanks.

 

[oracle1974]

You have heard different schools of thought. You are making the right choice of believing your ears. You cannot go wrong there. Will be keen to know what you have finally chosen.

 

[kanna.sridharan]

Then speaker suggestions, Kef LS50, Kef R300, Monitor Audio GX50(in case you you are still keen on MA)...

In Chennai, got to listen to the KEF Q900, Polk Rti A7 & Cabasse Java powered by the Rotel 1520. Of all the Cabasse was good, though it could not go low as I am expecting. But I found all of the above very tend to be bright in their presentation, the polks highs were screeching the lows were good but the mid bass was lacking, the KEF's vocals were strong, lows very mild (the only let down). The Cabasse had a very good presentation though they did not play low, the strong point was the way the mid's played, it was pleasant to listen to them.

Haven't rcd prices yet for the above, but the Cabasse eats my whole budget.