Best vfm Amp+ bookshelf speakers for 60-70k

[vineetrad]

Posting our research on locations and stores for audition options as of Dec 2nd 2016 for the reference of others now and the future who are looking for bookshelf speakers. Our goal is a smooth non-fatiguing sound with no harshness in the mids and highs.

If anyone with the below speakers would be nice enough to have us over to audition your setup at home it would be great. As we all know speakers sound quite different in an acoustically treated demo room and a normal home setup

Also please feel free to chime in with your thoughts if you own or have heard any of the below speakers.

Prices and notes of speakers being considered:
Polk RTi A3 - 28K - too bright and not smooth enough with Denon amp
Q300 - 48K - smooth mids and better highs than Polk RTi A3 with Denon amp
B&W 685 s2 - 65K -
Q Acoustics 2010 - 19.2K
Q Acoustics 2020i - 25.9K
Q Acoustics 3020 -
Q Acoustics Concept 20 - 43K
USHERV601 - ?
Usher S520 - ?
Wharefdale Diamond 121 -
Wharefdale Diamond 210 - 15.2K
Wharefdale Diamond 220 - 19.2K
Wharefdale Diamond 225 - 27.2K
Dali Zensor 1 - ?
Dali Zensor 3 - ?
Dynaudio Emit M20 - 60K (where to audition?)

Brigade road Area:

Vector Systems: B&W 685 s2, Dali Zensor 1 and 3, Marantz, NAD
No. 97, Brigade Road, Bangalore-25
Ph: +91-80-25543287/ 41128686, Mobile: +919341717966

Babbler Group: Q Acoustic 2020, Concept 20, 3020 speakers
#134, Residency Road,
Ground Floor & Basement,
Diagonally Opp To Bangalore Club,
Bangalore-560025
Phone : +91 080-30644611/22/33/00/99
Off : +91 80-30644644/55/66/88
Mobile: + 91-7483213425, + 91-9845041164; +91-
(Opposite Chancery Pavilion on Residency Road)

Soundglitz: KRK Rokits, Yamaha
2nd Floor, 95, Crescent Eminence,
After Joseph Commerce College, Brigade Road
Bangalore, India
560025
(near Paws on Brigade Road)
Mobile - +91 8971784398 (Aditya)

Profx: KEF Q300, Q500, Q700, and Polk RTi A3
84, Barton Centre, M G Road, Beside Deccan Herald, MG Road,
Shanthala Nagar, Ashok Nagar, Bengaluru, Karnataka 560001
Phone: 080 6563 9334



Whitefield:
Profx Whitefield: KEF Q300, Q500, Q700, and Polk RTi A3
Opposite Phoenix Mall Mahadevpura
Phone 9886642646 open on sundays also

DNI Home Theatre Bellandur: Dali Zensor 1 and 3, NAD, Marantz
K.R.Complex (Opp Bangalore Central),
Bellandur Junction, Maratahalli Outer Ring road,
Bangalore-103.
Ph : -9845283741, 9538893288-99

Uniquesys: Tannoy, Dali, Paradigm, Marantz
No.3, Tubrahalli, Vartur Main Road, Bangalore - 560066
Phone:080-42053468




Jayanagar:
HTStore: Q Acoustics 2020, 3020, Concept 20, Wharfedale 121 and 220, Tannoy, SVS Prime, Mission MX, Polk RTi A1/A3/A5, JBL 270, Marantz PM 6004/6005, PM 5005
The Home Theater Store,
SMR Mansion,#28, 1st Floor,
3rd Cross, Nrupathunga Nagar,
JP Nagar 7th Phase,
Bangalore-560078,
PH:080-26850866,41606384
M:+917022625460 - Lokesh

Music Ranch: Tannoy, Mission, PSB
#1408 (old no 328), 22nd cross, 1st and 3rd block, Jayanagar East, Bangalore-560011
08060504163

Acoustic Portrait: Locally made hifi
+91 98455 17730 - Siva and Jeya
Jayanagar



Palace Cross Road:
S&C AV Integrated Solutions: B&W 685 s2, KEF, Q Acoustics, Marantz
#1, Palace Cross Road, Next
Vishwa Kutumb, Bangalore-560 020
Land Mark: Opp To Bangalore Palace Main Gate
Stephen Gerald : +91 98866 78127
Srikanth Raavi : +91 81477 73190



Frazer Town:
ARN - Usher V601, S520 , Dali Zensor 1 and 3
#66/1, Ground Floor,
Coles Road, Fraser Town
Bangalore 560 005.
Karnataka. India
Telephone:+91 80 41234644

 

[humblebee]

Thanks for keeping us posted

 

[shibashis]

@shibashis
I have some questions regarding your response. I hope you can take it in the right spirit. I do not know you and trust is in short supply in the modern world...but im old fashioned and I hope I gain some of your trust...

You are right that a good dac, like the one he has will sound OK. But its been mentioned many times that we have sensitive ears that are looking for extra smoothness. Its been emphasized many times in posts.

But no, I'm positive that there are NO cheaper ladder or RtoR dacs at that price point. But i wanted to save him tech jargon and hedaches. And it also has an upsampler. Yes that makes things smoother so more tolerable. But let us know if there is a cheaper one.

It wont open any can of crawling worms because I cant help if I can identify artificiality in digital music. 44.1 makes me uncomfortable actually. It also doesnt help if I remember how my amazing pioneer stereo cassette player used to sound...life like and dynamic...even in pop songs of sadhna sargam.
If its any consolation then I wish my ears were less sensitive.
But then I am thankful also that like this I can help others.
So I guess must be for other people with sensitive ears.
I hope it doesn't become that thing which the western world uses to so quickly compartmentalise people..."oh they are sensitive people with special needs"..thats shallow.

Thats a lot of speakers. Demo already seems difficult. This might seem insurmountable to him thus discouraging him. One or 2 suggestions which we practically know or have researched well should put him at greater ease.

I haven't demoed or researched the spkrs that you mention but I surmise that they (except zensor 3 which is a different category. Others are in higher bracket) will be
- too much for a basic system
- too less for a dynamic system
Thus putting him neither here nor there.. that too when he is limited on budget.

Nice to hear abt NAD being less resolving. All the more better. But a 20k amp ... again neither here nor there...the strategy is not clear here to me.
Also CA is bright amp...pairing with warm spkr will make sound neutral...but we want warm sound.

But I would like to hear your experiences as well.

In good faith...

[Straight out of the left field means??? Hitting a Six on the leg side?]

It is baffling to me how an honest and sincere suggestion can be construed by you as 'discouraging', oh...well I can not know it all.

'In good faith....' one should buy the equipment that will provide the best possible return in their permissible budget. So if I suggest a not absolute entry level setup and advice to look at the used route to get the best possible outcome, it does in no way become 'neither here nor there'. Hope you can appreciate what I mean. Also if you do the math it is easy to find that the suggestions if they were ever to materialize would be in the budget mentioned.

Demo seems difficult, well nothing is easy.
Never buy anything without hearing it yourself first, learned that in the first week here....

In all my time here I have never for once heard anyone utter the phrase 'special needs', especially not when audio and how it sound is so very subjective to each listener. I wonder why it feels so negative to you.

As far as the DACs go, you may have a fair point. I failed to mention and I so hope I will be forgiven, the DACs I was referring to were mostly above the $1000 mark. And I reaffirm with my limited knowledge and from what I have heard a good DAC does not sound harsh if the system is matched right.

So there.....pretty straight forward answer, not out of the left-field at all.

 

[shibashis]

@humblebee: Did you mention demo was difficult? Looks like OP went out and heard a few combinations himself, surely you would agree that is the right way to go.

 

[vineetrad]

Any opinions on the Dynaudio Emit M20? They are selling for 60K INR incl tax in Bangalore and seem to be well reviewed? We are going to audition it later this week but would be interested to hear any opinions from FMs on sound signature, pairing suggestions or anything to be aware of.

I guess one thing that stood out was they are 4 Ohms?

Thanks for the continued help from all who have replied here and PMed.

 

[shibashis]

Have already given you an opinion on Dynaudio Emits, they are the best of the pick among the ones in consideration. They sound delectably delicious with tubes but even with Cambridge Audio they sounded gorgeous.
Sound signature is on the warmer side, fluid, rhythmic and agile without being harsh, at least that is how we found it. They are 4 Ohms and so will require a fairly powerful amp to drive them, that is their only negative side. Price wise they are I will even say conservatively priced given the performance. I think you can get it for less than 60K, I was told 54 at Kolkata, I believe if I took the plunge another couple of thousands could have been discounted.

Do hear them, let us know how you find it, I shall wait!

 

[humblebee]

It is baffling to me how an honest and sincere suggestion can be construed by you as 'discouraging', oh...well I can not know it all.

'In good faith....' one should buy the equipment that will provide the best possible return in their permissible budget. So if I suggest a not absolute entry level setup and advice to look at the used route to get the best possible outcome, it does in no way become 'neither here nor there'. Hope you can appreciate what I mean. Also if you do the math it is easy to find that the suggestions if they were ever to materialize would be in the budget mentioned.

Demo seems difficult, well nothing is easy.
Never buy anything without hearing it yourself first, learned that in the first week here....

In all my time here I have never for once heard anyone utter the phrase 'special needs', especially not when audio and how it sound is so very subjective to each listener. I wonder why it feels so negative to you.

As far as the DACs go, you may have a fair point. I failed to mention and I so hope I will be forgiven, the DACs I was referring to were mostly above the $1000 mark. And I reaffirm with my limited knowledge and from what I have heard a good DAC does not sound harsh if the system is matched right.

So there.....pretty straight forward answer, not out of the left-field at all.

@shibashis
I was just concerned that vineetrad or his friend might be overwhelmed at so many suggestions in one go (essentially all the options for spkrs there are)...but if they manage or you still think its ok..then fine....no hardline here...just asking as I pointed out.

Everyone is free to express opinions and give suggestions. .. and nobody is judging...so no question of forgiving...I really meant to ask when i said "I have some questions regarding your response".

Yes you are right that one should buy best equipment for money & no probs with used one too....so neither here nor there means....
- neither solving all digitization problems...for that would require at least a lakh rupees even with used equipment...so out of budget

I dont believe that emit m20 or spkrs of their category (bmw 685 s2, dali opticon 2, kef q300 etc...in the price range of 50-70k will be able to demonstrate enough dynamics to satisfy, forget about complete 16 bit dynamics and life like timbre). So neither there.

- nor buy new and solve some digitization problems and stay within budget

I have similar opinions on amps and dacs but...I will not express too much...much gets lost in transmission (over the Internet).

Special needs went too far I guess...just making sure...its good to know that its never been heard.

Also...4 ohms means it will require less power...right?

Yes...demo and experience is necessary...somehow from 1st post I concluded that demo was difficult for his friend...
I have mentioned in post that try to demo...but learn some fundas also...knowledge is also imp.

So...all is well...then.
What really matters is ... we help his friend make the most of his money, learn and avoid pitfalls and traps...thats all

 

[Kushanava]

I have not owned the Dynaudio emit , but , with my previous experience with x2 , the real dynaudio flavour is from their contour series and their starting line up is over hyped.
Kef is a very good brand to follow as their Q series is quite good. So are the Ushers.
If you can get an Epos (used) , they are very very good at that price point.

 

[vineetrad]

Some updates from auditions

The Dali Zensor 3 was auditioned with a 130wpc Yamaha avr and then a marantz 6006. Not sure how much it was the room and Acoustics but the Dali did not sound too bad bass wise. The mids were prominent but overall didn't like them as much as the kef q300 which had better imaging for sure. The highs on both the kef and Dali were ok in general but not smooth enough on tracks that have a tendency for sibilance and harshness.

The Zensor 7 floorstander on the other hand had much better imaging and more pleasing fullness and body as to be expected from a much larger speaker. We both felt the Dali was worth it only if going for floors tender else the q300 was preferable to the Zensor 3. The Zensor 1 was auditioned briefly but this definitely needs a sub whatever the size of room and genre of music to be enjoyed.

More as we go forward

 

[Aanuj]

The Usher V601 is better than any bookshelf costing up to a lac. The Usher S520 is good or will beat anything hands down costing Rs 60k+. It does certain things better than most costing upwards if Rs 75k. I liked the Emit 20 but once I heard the Usher V601 let alone the Emit 20 even the Polk Lsi looks overpriced and underwhelming.

 

[vineetrad]

Anyone knows who is the dealer for Usher in Bangalore? I checked with ARN. They said they stopped selling Usher. Also apparently the v601 is a discontinued model per the Usher site?

 

[Aanuj]

V601 is not discontinued perse but Usher is going through some restructuring hence no supply from source. Only few remaining with users collectors or some dealers are available for sale. Anything from Usher is worth their weight in Gold!

 

[vineetrad]

Any nice soul in Bangalore who is willing to let us audition their Usher speakers at their place?

 

[vineetrad]

Heard the Q Acoustic 3020, concept 20 and the floor stander 3050 at Babbler. It was running through a Music Fidelity amp.

The 3020 didn't really impress honestly. The highs were still harsh on testy songs such as Total eclipse of the heart by Bonnie Tyler and even Somebody to Love by Queen.

The 3050 floorstander obviously had better bass but uses the same tweeter as the 3020 so shared the same failings on the highs as the 3020.

The concept 20 bookshelf speakers were better with dealing with the highs. The better bass response compared to the 3020 also meant a more balanced sound. The imaging also seemed a bit better.

Overall unless one is looking to fill a large room the concept 20 seemed the best sound quality of the bunch and only one worth considering with our specific criteria of over sensitive ears to highs

 

[drkrack]

Heard the Q Acoustic 3020, concept 20 and the floor stander 3050 at Babbler. It was running through a Music Fidelity amp.

The 3020 didn't really impress honestly. The highs were still harsh on testy songs such as Total eclipse of the heart by Bonnie Tyler and even Somebody to Love by Queen.

The 3050 floorstander obviously had better bass but uses the same tweeter as the 3020 so shared the same failings on the highs as the 3020.

The concept 20 bookshelf speakers were better with dealing with the highs. The better bass response compared to the 3020 also meant a more balanced sound. The imaging also seemed a bit better.

Overall unless one is looking to fill a large room the concept 20 seemed the best sound quality of the bunch and only one worth considering with our specific criteria of over sensitive ears to highs

Very good brief reviews there, it is always better to audition with a like minded pal, bring it on.

Kindly share the best offered pricing for the respective speakers and electronics so the thread will be complete in all respects.
Also it'll be easy for other FMs to suggest you, in case of a tie... [emoji23].

 

[Kushanava]

The Usher V601 is better than any bookshelf costing up to a lac. The Usher S520 is good or will beat anything hands down costing Rs 60k+. It does certain things better than most costing upwards if Rs 75k. I liked the Emit 20 but once I heard the Usher V601 let alone the Emit 20 even the Polk Lsi looks overpriced and underwhelming.

Usher v601 with exposure amp was a very good combination when i last heard it in harmonie audio. I was very attracted by how Chris Rea 's voice sounded on those.The baritone voices are very well represented by those speakers.
However it will depend on your tastes. The sound is lot as transparent as Kef's LS50 which for some can sound too harsh but for me they are the king of midrange at that price point.

 

[afj]

for the amp i would go with the acoustic portrait swara 75w eyes closed. it costs about 36k and theres nothing in that price range to beat it. for speakers also check out the kef q series and the monitor audio bronze

 

[vineetrad]

Quick pending review of the Dynaudio Emit M10. Heard them at the dealer Audio Video People on Infantry Road. The M10 was paired with the SR5006. Had gone in with great expectations but the speakers failed to impress. It could be because the Marantz amp was barely able to power the M10 and had to be cranked to over 80% to achieve even reasonably high volume in a small room. Unfortunately they did not have another amp on hand. The sound was detailed, good imaging and bass but highs were again harsher than what we were looking for.

It seems after several auditions everyone is trying to out-shimmer, out-sizzle each other by focusing on maximum detail which can temporarily wow you but with slightly more extended listening get fatiguing. Almost the same as trying to audition TVs where the sales folk try and put on max contrast boosted saturation to "pop" the picture and wow customers.

My friend is okay to extend amp+speaker budget to 1.3L as he feels he can't get the refined highs yet detailed sound he is after with budget bookshelves. Can anyone suggest floorstanders or better bookshelves for this budget?

He is also considering active studio monitors after I checked out genelec monitors for myself on the recommendation from a fellow FM. I found the highs on the genelec 8010 to be the smoothest of all speakers auditioned till now yet with sufficient detail. Really tiny physical size though!

Hope to hear them again, along with the m030, m040 and 8020 models again at the Genelec dealer next week when I have more time.

 

[vineetrad]

for the amp i would go with the acoustic portrait swara 75w eyes closed. it costs about 36k and theres nothing in that price range to beat it. for speakers also check out the kef q series and the monitor audio bronze

Yet to hear anything from Acoustic Portrait. Hopefully will be able to audition the full set at FM Aurobindo's place next week and a visit to Siva. Will do a writeup after that.

 

[Kushanava]

kef r300..or rethm bhava or siva's speakers or buchardt 300