FullHD versus HDready

[sun244]

OK guys, This is my basic doubt about Full HD TV benefits. I am looking to buy either 46 or 47" LCD TVs:

1. As I understand, there are few HDTV program channels in India and few are getting announced. We can also watch Full HD movies using Blue Ray player. Each one of these Full HD movies, I hear are expensive to me (around Rs.2000).

Let us say, majority of my use is watching cricket , cartoons, news channels, is there any benefit of me going for Full HD TV now?

2. Our viewing distance is approx 16 to 18 feet, from what I hear-we cannot really appreciate FullHD effect at that viewing distance. On the other hand I need to buy more than 46" because of my viewing distance. If most of my viewing is at a distance of say around 14 feet away from TV, does FullHD makes sense?

3. Does having FullHD help in any way, if you are connecting your PC and use it?

Thank You

Sunder

 

[srikarkav]

Hi,

Hope this helps.


What Size HDTV is Right for My Room?

cheers,
sri

 

[mandeep]

OK guys, This is my basic doubt about Full HD TV benefits. I am looking to buy either 46 or 47" LCD TVs:

1. As I understand, there are few HDTV program channels in India and few are getting announced. We can also watch Full HD movies using Blue Ray player. Each one of these Full HD movies, I hear are expensive to me (around Rs.2000).Prices slowly coming down,yashraj bluray movies now available for Rs 599/699 in various stores.

Let us say, majority of my use is watching cricket , cartoons, news channels, is there any benefit of me going for Full HD TV now? Right, but one must be prepared for the future needs, bluray+full HD Tv=full entertainment/fun/made for each other

2. Our viewing distance is approx 16 to 18 feet, from what I hear-we cannot really appreciate FullHD effect at that viewing distance. On the other hand I need to buy more than 46" because of my viewing distance. If most of my viewing is at a distance of say around 14 feet away from TV, does FullHD makes sense?sometimes bring your chair near to it,and enjoy fullhd,for an occasional REAL MAGICAL EXPERIENCE,will leave u with endless joy

3. Does having FullHD help in any way, if you are connecting your PC and use it?Latest motherboards do have HDMI out, so no worry

Thank You

Sunder

 

[doors666]

get a full HD, otherwise, if not now, an year down the line you are going to regret your decision. Bluray player and media prices are heading south big time, you can also use a htpc or media player for full hd.

 

[madbullram]

at 16 feet viewing distance there is 100% no benefit of Full HD. Search and read the threads where I have explained the difference btw 2 in detail.

May be if you tell u r budget, it can help us tell whats the best option. For viewing distance sheer joy will be through a projector setup

 

[sbg]

If you ever consider hooking up with PC/Game console/BluRay player any time in future - i would suggest full HD for that SIZE -
else you may get entangled later wrt cost of replacement and regrets.

regarding point 3.
PC input can be limited to 1680x1050(depends on brand) using VGA, else DVI and HDMI can thow up full hd( using Graphic card/motherboard ) - this helps a lots - productivity. - if work related - you should be able to see 2 full pages side by side (word,excel etc), multiple applications avlb in your vision/Peripheral vision

 

[sun244]

at 16 feet viewing distance there is 100% no benefit of Full HD. Search and read the threads where I have explained the difference btw 2 in detail.

May be if you tell u r budget, it can help us tell whats the best option. For viewing distance sheer joy will be through a projector setup

Hi Madbullram et al,

Thanks for all the replies. Budget is manageable to around 1.5 Lakhs (can stretch little more). I want to setup the best solution. Please let me know and my sincere Thanks.

Sunder

 

[blwetorch]

Slightly, off-topic.
For all the absence of a regular HD content transmission, we can always create our own HD content, thanks to a Full-HD Camcorder( the Sony model, starts at around Rs.39000/- approx) or a Full HD digital camera( Full HD movies too) for around Rs. 20000/-approx.
The WD TV( Rs.10000/-) is also a good supplement to view your Full-HD content.
Full -HD is certainly the way to go, budget permitting!

 

[sbg]

A good point blwetorch.

 

[BLASTO]

When you are spending like 1.5L, First thing is, You CANNOT get a HD ready TV at that price point. I don't think there are any HD ready TVs available beyond 1L.

You have no other option but to go for a Full HD set. hyeah:

Regarding Blueray, When you are spending like 1.5L on a TV, You should be prepared to pay some amount for the playable content like bulerays also.

Having said that.. Typically for a 50" TV, The effects of a Full HD can be seen only within 8-9 feet.. HD ready TVs do not come in sizes beyond 50". For viewing distance >10 feet, 50 inch FHD vs HD ready does not make a difference.

Regarding your doubts on transmission, HD transmission will be either 720p or 1080i. HD ready sets will be able to play these as good as the FHD sets. The day when 1080p becomes a norm in indian transmission, I will be an old old man having much else to worry other than TVs. Also an uncompressed 720p transmission will anyday beat an 1080p compressed transmission. So the first aim will be to transmit a 720p signal without compression. In a land where SD contents are compressed to aweful amounts, I say this day is far far away. Obviously I might be wrong.

---- For general discussion on the topic ----
HD ready sets display 1080p signals inferior to FHD sets.. Here too there is a catch!!
First, You will not be able to appreciate it beyond 10 feet. (8-9 feet for 50" , 5-6 feet for 42" and <3 feet for 32")
Second, ALL FHD sets DO NOT display 1080 moving lines of resolution as of today. It is typically 600-700 lines for LCD with frame insertions (100Hz, 200Hz etc) and a pathetic 300-400 lines for LCD without frame insertions. Only few plasmas like the Panasonic G10 displays full 1080 movies lines of resolution. Though it is rapidly improving, As of today, when a TV is advertised as FHD, It is really not FHD but just that it has 1080p pixels. It means while the TV displays beautiful 1080p still images, it is handicapped when it comes to displaying motion pictures which has above 720 lines of resolution.

 

[madbullram]

sg & blw: Can I know why would it make sense to buy FHD at 16 feet viewing distance than HDReady? If you are talking about technology yes, FHD is superior for watching BluRay etc ONLY till a certain viewing distance, upto 10 feet, after which even an Eagle cant find a difference between FHD and HDReady.

Like blasto said, beyond 1 lakh u dont have a choice, which is different, just want people to understand FHD is not always the best, it depends on your viewing distance and your requirement. Lot many times we have seen people more happy with HDReady than FHD in Indian Scenario.

Sun: Look for the biggest screen size in your budget, real estate matters the most to you. If you can hold u r purchase for sometime, LED should be in market which will make it a good buy but at what price point is a big question.

 

[sun244]

Madbullram/Blasto/ et al-

Thanks for the replies and guidance.

One question : There was a mention about "in a land where SD content is still in compressed form", does this apply to channels like Discovery and HBO also?

Blasto: Details about current FullHD LCDs, frame insertions, and display lines are news to me :-( Thanks for the details.

Regarding 1.5L is upper limit I also need to fit in Blue Ray, Music system with in that. I am sorry for not mentioning it upfront. Taking one step at a time, can you guys suggest a HDReady (47-50") that will meet my requirements and it is very good?

Thanks again

Sunder

 

[BLASTO]

Madbullram/Blasto/ et al-

Thanks for the replies and guidance.

One question : There was a mention about "in a land where SD content is still in compressed form", does this apply to channels like Discovery and HBO also?

Blasto: Details about current FullHD LCDs, frame insertions, and display lines are news to me :-( Thanks for the details.

Regarding 1.5L is upper limit I also need to fit in Blue Ray, Music system with in that. I am sorry for not mentioning it upfront. Taking one step at a time, can you guys suggest a HDReady (47-50") that will meet my requirements and it is very good?

Thanks again

Sunder

Regarding HD ready plasma sets,

50" Samsung B450 - ~57k. Best VFM.
50" Panasonic C10/X10 - ~80k - Not worth the price of >20k more than samsung B450 as they these cost less than samsung B450 in US/UK.

50" Full HD Panasonic V10 - 1.2L. Can be bargained to 1.1L. Best TV available in india.

I vote B450 as best VFM though you might want to discard it for your budget. For your viewing diatance/usage, V10 (which is an excellent TV in its own right) does not make sense since it is double the amount.

LCDs,
None is HD ready >32" I suppose.

Sony has brought down the rates of LCD drastically in 2010. You can pick one for <1L.
Go for the W series ~90k.
Samsung B650 ~90k.

With LCds comes motion resolution problems and viewing angle issues.

Sony W550 - (Refer table at)Sony KDL40W5500 Bravia LCD Calibration & Benchmark Tests
Motion resolution [Motionflow] "Standard" and "High": 650; "Off": 300
Viewing angle 100"

Samsung B650 - (Refer table at)Samsung LE40B650 LCD HDTV Calibration & Benchmark Tests
Motion resolution [100Hz Motion Plus] "Smooth": 650; "Clear": 600; "Off": 300
Viewing angle 90".

 

[sun244]

Regarding HD ready plasma sets,

50" Samsung B450 - ~57k. Best VFM.
50" Panasonic C10/X10 - ~80k - Not worth the price of >20k more than samsung B450 as they these cost less than samsung B450 in US/UK.

50" Full HD Panasonic V10 - 1.2L. Can be bargained to 1.1L. Best TV available in india.

I vote B450 as best VFM though you might want to discard it for your budget. For your viewing diatance/usage, V10 (which is an excellent TV in its own right) does not make sense since it is double the amount.

LCDs,
None is HD ready >32" I suppose.

Sony has brought down the rates of LCD drastically in 2010. You can pick one for <1L.
Go for the W series ~90k.
Samsung B650 ~90k.

With LCds comes motion resolution problems and viewing angle issues.

Sony W550 - (Refer table at)Sony KDL40W5500 Bravia LCD Calibration & Benchmark Tests
Motion resolution [Motionflow] "Standard" and "High": 650; "Off": 300
Viewing angle 100"

Samsung B650 - (Refer table at)Samsung LE40B650 LCD HDTV Calibration & Benchmark Tests
Motion resolution [100Hz Motion Plus] "Smooth": 650; "Clear": 600; "Off": 300
Viewing angle 90".

Thanks again.

One complication to this equation is that I have two windows facing TV screens and two behind. I have heard Plasmas may not be good when the room is well lit. Is it addressed in newer models say in B450?

Thank You
Sunder

 

[blwetorch]

sg & blw: Can I know why would it make sense to buy FHD at 16 feet viewing distance than HDReady? If you are talking about technology yes, FHD is superior for watching BluRay etc ONLY till a certain viewing distance, upto 10 feet, after which even an Eagle cant find a difference between FHD and HDReady.

Like blasto said, beyond 1 lakh u dont have a choice, which is different, just want people to understand FHD is not always the best, it depends on your viewing distance and your requirement. Lot many times we have seen people more happy with HDReady than FHD in Indian Scenario.

Sun: Look for the biggest screen size in your budget, real estate matters the most to you. If you can hold u r purchase for sometime, LED should be in market which will make it a good buy but at what price point is a big question.

I agree fully with what you said.
But I believe, going Full-HD is the better option,,,,,better to be future-proof.

Most of the HDTVs today are able to support 720i/720p/1080i/1080p signals. So the single most important spec that we should be looking for when choosing a HDTV is the screen resolution (pixel resolution).
For HD- Ready HDTVs which have screen resolution less than 1920x1080, they are less than ideal. This is because if you feed a 1080i/1080p signal to a HD- Ready HDTV, this HDTV will scale down the signal resolution to fit its smaller screen resolution. That is to say, you will lose resolution if you use a HD -Ready HDTV to display a 1080i/1080p signal.
For Full HD HDTVs, they have screen resolution of 1920x1080, thus, when a 1080i or 1080p signal is feed to it, it is able to display the picture in its full glory at 1920x1080 with no resolution loss.
So it is not difficult to conclude that if money is not a problem, always go for Full HD 1080p HDTVs with 1920x1080 resolution instead of HD Ready 720p HDTVs which has lesser resolution.

The Full HDs are 16: 9 ( aspect ratio)...........and so are many HD-readies. But some HD-readies are also 4:3.
The electronic circuitry of the later have to work harder to cope with the 16:9 format that a number of channels are being broardcast( or likely to come in future) in and what effect that has on the viewing experience.
It goes without saying that the pixel difference is better realized in a 42" or bigger screen for a Full-HD.
I am also taking into consideration the compression factor.

 

[BLASTO]

Thanks again.

One complication to this equation is that I have two windows facing TV screens and two behind. I have heard Plasmas may not be good when the room is well lit. Is it addressed in newer models say in B450?

Thank You
Sunder

The two windows behind the TV are no problem (If anything, It adds to the perceived contrast).

The two windows facing the TV are definitely a problem if you dont have them curtained.

I have a full french window/glass door right accross my plasma but it is always curtained when not in use (the glass door opens to balcony which is used for drying clothes etc). No issues at all.

If you don't have the intension of curtaining the windows, please avoid the plasmas (period). LCDs are good in such areas as they have a non reflective surface and a blacker screen.

But if you can cover the windows with curtains, Nothing like the pleasure of viewing plasmas. Especially the GREAT colours reproduced by B450 in particular (It is an 18 bit panel). The tube light in the room does not affect the picture even if it is directly accross the TV.

If you have doors facing the sun accross the TV location, avoid the plasmas. It will be difficult to control lighting from doors than windows as people keep walking around.

B450 has an effective anti-glare filter but it is effective only with ambient light from tube lights etc. An un-curtained window/door accross the TV will mak it ineffective.

 

[madbullram]

I agree fully with what you said.
But I believe, going Full-HD is the better option,,,,,better to be future-proof.

Most of the HDTVs today are able to support 720i/720p/1080i/1080p signals. So the single most important spec that we should be looking for when choosing a HDTV is the screen resolution (pixel resolution).
For HD- Ready HDTVs which have screen resolution less than 1920x1080, they are less than ideal. This is because if you feed a 1080i/1080p signal to a HD- Ready HDTV, this HDTV will scale down the signal resolution to fit its smaller screen resolution. That is to say, you will lose resolution if you use a HD -Ready HDTV to display a 1080i/1080p signal.
For Full HD HDTVs, they have screen resolution of 1920x1080, thus, when a 1080i or 1080p signal is feed to it, it is able to display the picture in its full glory at 1920x1080 with no resolution loss.
So it is not difficult to conclude that if money is not a problem, always go for Full HD 1080p HDTVs with 1920x1080 resolution instead of HD Ready 720p HDTVs which has lesser resolution.

The Full HDs are 16: 9 ( aspect ratio)...........and so are many HD-readies. But some HD-readies are also 4:3.
The electronic circuitry of the later have to work harder to cope with the 16:9 format that a number of channels are being broardcast( or likely to come in future) in and what effect that has on the viewing experience.
It goes without saying that the pixel difference is better realized in a 42" or bigger screen for a Full-HD.
I am also taking into consideration the compression factor.

1. Simple answer again is no, it does not make a difference. 6-7 months back, we watched superman 3 in Pana 42 inch plasma one hd ready and other fhd. Both were playing bluray special edition, viewing distance was 11 ft. 0 difference between both.

Just bcos HD Ready downscales a picture to 720p doesnt mean it will be inferior, your viewing distance will ensure that you cannot spot the difference. It makes sense for someone who is gaming, bcos we are always at less that 6 feet not for someone viewing at 10+ feet.

Again, when we did a test on a Sony TV (dont remember the model), we found FHD was better in PQ than HDReady. we were stunned bcos it defied logic. Then after proper comparison we found the panel in the FHD was far better and the price difference btw the model was huge which made sense.

So again I will make it simple, at a similar price point, at a viewing distance of 10+ a 50 inch FHD and HDReady will not make a difference for movie or TV watching. Infact, HDReady is a better bet for regular cable, DTH, and DVD movie watching as it only upscales to 720p.

2. You dont have 4:3 HDReady models in India, at least I am not aware of

3. Even in US though they claim HD telecast, even today not many channels actually beam 1080. Its all a marketing gimmick. Its like Tata and BIg tv saying DVD pictures. ANyway thats a different story all together

 

[sun244]

The two windows behind the TV are no problem (If anything, It adds to the perceived contrast).

The two windows facing the TV are definitely a problem if you dont have them curtained.

I have a full french window/glass door right accross my plasma but it is always curtained when not in use (the glass door opens to balcony which is used for drying clothes etc). No issues at all.

If you don't have the intension of curtaining the windows, please avoid the plasmas (period). LCDs are good in such areas as they have a non reflective surface and a blacker screen.

But if you can cover the windows with curtains, Nothing like the pleasure of viewing plasmas. Especially the GREAT colours reproduced by B450 in particular (It is an 18 bit panel). The tube light in the room does not affect the picture even if it is directly accross the TV.

If you have doors facing the sun accross the TV location, avoid the plasmas. It will be difficult to control lighting from doors than windows as people keep walking around.

B450 has an effective anti-glare filter but it is effective only with ambient light from tube lights etc. An un-curtained window/door accross the TV will mak it ineffective.

Blasto / Madbullram,

You guys are so knowledgable. My sincere thanks.

We can curtain the windows and sunlight is not an issue. Do we need to go for dark colored curtains or if some light sneaks in with light colors-it should not be a problem?


Sunder

 

[ranojoy]

Blasto / Madbullram,

Do we need to go for dark colored curtains or if some light sneaks in with light colors-it should not be a problem?

I faced the same problem with my Pana 42. Theres a (nearly) full-wall glass window right opposite to the screen. To start with, I put heavy drapes to cover it up but during the afternoon, when the sun shines directly on that window, I could see sunlight reflections on my screen. So I doubled the drapes (effectively, 2 sets of curtains - one behind the other) and the problem is no more !! Now there are no annoying reflections even during the peak summer.

 

[BLASTO]

Blasto / Madbullram,

You guys are so knowledgable. My sincere thanks.

We can curtain the windows and sunlight is not an issue. Do we need to go for dark colored curtains or if some light sneaks in with light colors-it should not be a problem?


Sunder

At this point, All I can say is, If you plan to curtain the windows, You will find a curtain which solves the purpose..

The thickness depends on where the window is located, how big it is and whether it is directly facing the sun etc..

If you feel the existing curtain is light, You can always add one behind the existing curtain..