Here's a chance to sample "Tube Sound"

I have picked this up from @fLUX a few days back. This is a nice little preamp for portable audio and hifi applications.

@captrajesh - Please let the person next on the list know that it is ready for pickup.
 
Sorry for updating the thread late. A friend of mine was coming on a business trip by road from Bangalore. It took me a few days to have it collected and I took it to Krishna's place, even before listening in my set-up. I had mentioned about the "proof of pudding is in eating" in his wanted thread, which he wanted to be closed. And eating of pudding! he did; with whatever he could grab it with.

Due to acute paucity of time, I'll leave the detailed review for later but will just post my impressions for now. @hydrovac you may consider posting your impressions as well.

To say that it bettered the DD Pre in a few aspects speaks volumes about this diminutive little thing. Only, it's bright and a bit unrefined in the upper notes for trained ears.

One thing that's proven completely wrong is that it gets super hot. It barely gets warm. I took a couple of pics on the occasion but unable to share them. I'll do it subsequently.

Whosoever wants to sample this gem of a tube preamp in Hyderabad is welcome to do so.

0_IMG-20210206-WA0005.jpg
The preamp connected to the DD Power Amp.
IMG-20210218-WA0000.jpg
After playing for more than half an hour, it's hardly warm. We could even hold the tube with bare hand.
 
Sorry for updating the thread late. A friend of mine was coming on a business trip by road from Bangalore. It took me a few days to have it collected and took it to Krishna's place; even before listening in my set-up. I had mentioned about the proof of pudding is in eating in his wanted thread, which he waned to be closed. And earing of pudding! he did with whatever he could grab it with.

Due to acute paucity of time, I'll leave the detailed review for later but will just post my impressions for now. @hydrovac you may consider posting your impressions as well.

To say that it bettered the DD Pre in a few aspects speaks volumes about this diminutive little thing. Only, it's bright and a bit unrefined in the upper notes for trained ears.

One thing that's proven completely wrong is that it gets super hot. It barely gets warm. I took a couple of pics on the occasion but unable to share them. I'll do it subsequently.

Whosoever wants to sample this gem of a tube preamp in Hyderabad is welcome to do so.

would love to give it a try.
 

@captrajesh

Thanks for giving me a chance to audition the Bravo Audio Ocean.
And eating the pudding... ain't we both did it with spirit? ;)

Before listening to this charming little one, i was skeptical about the whole tube pre idea. But this baby changed my opinion greatly and i ended up buying a Little Dot MKiv after this audition.

Firstly, the sweet sound of tubes... it has a sound signature you will absolutely love. I say this because it has a very interesting characteristic that is hard to explain. The low end is strong powerful and clear but not overly boomy, mid and upper frequencies are smoother sounding, airy, sparkling with good extension and shine, more detailed with a bigger sound stage. Though, that could also be a minus if you’re adding gear with bright signatures in the chain.

I read users complaining about the unit getting hot, even the chassis. Though we played it for an hour, it was just warm.
That's me in the pic touching the tube, while captrajesh was clicking pics... :cool:

Conclusion: Ocean is an excellent hybrid amp. Build quality is very good, sonic presentation is pleasing. This is a great little amp and is a no-brainer recommendation. I will surely buy one if available.

...
 
Certainly. First, I'll do some serious listening including tube rolling and post my review.

Thereafter, I'll pass it on. Ping me your contact No. & address.
@captrajesh Thanks for this opportunity for Hyderabad FMs as well. Would love to have it as part of my audio chain for sometime.
Please let me know more details.

Regards
 
I ended up buying a Little Dot MKiv after this audition.
Too bad I had gotten too busy on work front. As scheduled, let's do a comparo and some tube rolling this weekend.
@captrajesh Thanks for this opportunity for Hyderabad FMs as well. Would love to have it as part of my audio chain for sometime.
Please let me know more details.
Sure. A comparo with Little Dot and tube rolling session is slated this weekend. Thereafter, it'll go to @blackscorpio and then to you.

Ping me your contact No. & address.
 
Too bad I had gotten too busy on work front. As scheduled, let's do a comparo and some tube rolling this weekend.

Sure. A comparo with Little Dot and tube rolling session is slated this weekend. Thereafter, it'll go to @blackscorpio and then to you.

Ping me your contact No. & address.
Thanks @captrajesh, will wait for my turn :)
I have pinged you my contact details.
Regards
 
Fatman status (in Chennai):

Capt. Rajesh kindly arranged through FM Kannan for the Fatman iTube tube-buffered gainclone to be loaned to me to investigate possible component upgrades.

This is similar to the Dared MP-5, but with dual line-level inputs, instead of a built-in DAC as in the Dared MP-5:

https://6moons.com/industryfeatures/dared/dared.html

It seems to be the same 6N1P tube and ST TDA7265 gainclone stages in both, as well as a 6E2 magic eye as the VU meter. The tubes are NOS Voskhod 6N1P, also available from diyaudiocart in Chennai, so it's relatively easy to find spares for now:

https://diyaudiocart.com/Voskhod-Factory-6N1P-Vacuum-Tube

It arrived in the late last evening, so I was just able to unbox and do a brief auditioning yesterday.

For preliminary auditioning, I used my ~20 year old AD-500B DVD player (with the analog signal-path heavily modded to use my LF03c dual discrete opamp) to play Redbook Audio CDs. Speakers are generic 2-way bass-reflex bookshelves which I built with imported drivers about a decade ago. First impressions - the Fatman is warm, full-bodied and transparent sounding, but a little bass-shy and has some glare/brightness in the upper-mids compared to my reference MiniRef 1875 nested gainclone.

Some simple upgrades of passives may be sufficient to tame the glare - it has generic 1/2W CFRs and generic Chinese electrolytics everywhere. The volume control is a cheap A100K dual-gang pot, which could be substituted with something better like a Panasonic or Alps.

It nevertheless sounds great as a small bookshelf / study setup. A fairly remarkable amp for its price point - Dared introduced it way back in 2005, very soon after the introduction of the iPod and the concept of iPod docking - probably way ahead of its time, and maybe destined to be a timeless classic. The use of the 6E2/EM87 magic eye as the VU meter is a brilliant nod to vintage-tube aesthetics.

Possible approaches to cloning it: perhaps a E180F tube-buffered MiniRef with NOS BEL EM84 as the VU meter. It's hard to match the production finish of the original Dared/Fatman, though - bright chrome-plated panels, heavy-gauge construction, heavy mains trafo, etc. The Dared version also apparently used premium passives including Allen-Bradley carbon-composition resistors and Japanese electrolytics, some of which will be hard to find locally today.

If anybody plans to get one of these, I'd advise going with the Dared- or Fatman-branded version with the through-hole mounted components on the SMOBC PCB with yellowish solder mask. The through-hole version is easier to mod. The newer versions of this unit use a green solder-masked PCB with SMD components, and that will be harder to mod (no idea how it sounds, though - the reviews seem to indicate that the Dared version is the best-sounding of the lot). The original MP-5 had a built-in DAC, while the current MP-5BT has both a DAC and Bluetooth input. The Fatman iTube has no DAC or BT, but 2 line-level inputs, which is actually the most useful for me (for A-B comparisons of sources, etc.)

Thanks again to Capt. Rajesh and FM Kannan.

(End of Part 1. )
 
(Part 2.)

As noted earlier, it had a slight glare/brightness in the upper-mids, fairly common in chipamps/gainclones. So I looked for clues to tame that and make it more neutral-sounding. Removed the tubes carefully, opened up the bottom plate. Almost all the resistors were carbon film, which don't usually contribute to glare, though they're less linear than the best metal films and wire-wounds. The electrolytics (chipamp rail bypasses and tube B+ rail bypasses) were generic Chinese TL brand, so they were the first candidates to be replaced:

3x 2200uF/35V TL -> 3x 2200uF/35V Elna RKD (chipamp and auxiliary rail bypasses)
1x 47uF/400V TL -> 1x 33uF/450V Rubycon YK (B+ for magic eye display, not critical)
1x 100uF/250V TL -> 1x 100uF/400V Rubycon AXW (B+ for 6N1P cathode follower, critical for audio)

The 100uF/400V is taller by ~4mm, but it was the only good Japanese cap in that value that I had lying around, so I used it anyway.

Next came the interstage coupling cap - rated 1uF/200v/10%, it looked like a generic blue Vishay or Philips MKT type. I wasn't sure, but I had an excellent 1uF/250V/5% Asahi Kassei MKP in my spares, so I swapped the 2x coupling caps as a matter of precaution.

2x 1uF/200V/10% -> 2x 1uF/250V/5% Asahi Kassei MKP metallized polypropylene film.

Finally, the critical resistors - one at the grid input of each tube:

2x 10K/0.5W/5% generic CFR -> 2x 10k/0.25W/1% PRP (Precision Resistor Products) MFR

Another set is the feedback network of the TDA7265 chipamp - the lower resistor is more critical to sonics:

2x 560E/0.5W/5% generic CFR -> 2x 510E/1W/1% Vishay/Dale wirewound.

The replacement is slightly lower in value, so the default gain of the chipamp section is about 10% higher, which is not an issue. It can easily be compensated out using the volume pot. I left the A100k volume pot alone for the moment, but may replace it later if I get a suitable branded pot that fits exactly.

Carefully assembled everything back, and found that the bottom plate would not sit exactly due to the taller 100uF/400V Rubycon AXW capacitor. I used 2x fibre washers as spacers to lift the bottom plate by about ~1.5mm, and it sits fine.

Checked everything, plugged in the tubes, kept my fingers crossed and powered up. Everything worked fine, and the glare is gone. The main contributor was probably the chipamp rail electrolytics, but all the upgrades seem to have a helped a bit in making everything more linear. A bit of the top-end sparkle is gone, but that's fine - I prefer neutrality, and can boost the highs if required with a tone control in a preamp. There's absolutely no listening fatigue now.

(End of part 2. Some pics to follow in due course)
 
That's quick work Siva and a great beginning. May be you can dig a bit deeper to unearth more details out of the music.

BTW, didn't know that the Fatman was a Dared product. Having owned their flagship Integrated Amp earlier, not difficult to imagine how it would be sounding now.
 
@Kannan: Great, I'm ready for an A-B auditioning. I'll clean and set up my listening room and maybe wait for my 2nd dose of the vaccine early-April - that's the show-stopper for now. I have a Nakamichi MB-10 CD changer as a primary source, and several sets of DIY as well commercial speakers - Probably a Technics 3-way reflex may work best for auditioning. You're welcome to bring any source player and music that you're familiar with.

@captrajesh: I gained a great deal of respect for Dared after listening to your Dared 845 (?) through your Cadence Aristas (?) about a decade ago - truly an eye-opener. Hence, I figured Dared would have done an excellent job on their entry-level products also - it has sold more than ~100,000 units worldwide in 15 years, making it probably the largest-selling contemporary tube amplifier in the world. It appears that their own-brand Dared MP-5 uses premium components, while their OEM offerings through Fatman and others, use generic components to cut costs as well as differentiate the two in the market.

No problem either way - the Fatman can be upgraded with premium components almost to Dared standards if required. The Russian Voskhod 6N1P are as good, if not better than the Shuguangs that Dared uses on their own-brand MP-5. It would be great if we have access to a Dared MP-5 to check out all the component and/or other differences.

(The Fatman iTube is so addictive and non-fatiguing now that I fell asleep last night leaving it on playing Music for the Soul by Pt. Vishwa Mohan Bhatt. This is a great bedroom/study/library/living-room tube setup with very modest maintenance costs, thanks to the ready supply of Russian tubes. We may not be ready to risk leaving a big 845 setup powered on all the time, but it can be safely done with the Fatman/Dared MP-5. The speakers can be disconnected, swapped, etc. while it's on - it's only the chipamp that sees the speaker load.)
 
(Part 3 - Pic of upgraded Fatman circuit board)

1615641847798.png

The Elna RKDs (C10, C11 & C12) are at bottom right, Rubycons at left centre, green Asahi Kasseis (C1 & C2) above the Rubycons, red PRP 10k resistors (R1 & R2) at center, and grey Vishay/Dale 510E wirewounds at left top (slightly obscured by the selector switch). Everything else has been left untouched for now, though the A100k dual-gang volume pot (top centre-right above wire bumdle) may also be replaced in the future.

(End of Part 3.)
 
Hello Moderator and others. I am Bhooshan. Staying in bangalore Sarjapur road side. I have a couple of speaker systems with which I am doing experiments. I am also looking to add another speaker system - bookshelf specifically. It would be great if I can get a chance to try the tube amps. I will be happy to pick up and drop. Thanks.
 
Hello Moderator and others. I am Bhooshan. Staying in bangalore Sarjapur road side. I have a couple of speaker systems with which I am doing experiments. I am also looking to add another speaker system - bookshelf specifically. It would be great if I can get a chance to try the tube amps. I will be happy to pick up and drop. Thanks.
Please read the first post for checking eligibility: https://www.hifivision.com/threads/heres-a-chance-to-sample-tube-sound.80684/

Secondly, the amp, Fatman is in Chennai at FM @linuxguru. Someone who's eligible and whom you know can pick it from him.

BTW, the Bravo Audio Pre cum HP Amp with me.

2nd wave of Wuhan flu had put a check on the chain. I'll handover the preamp to @blackscorpio who's next in line shortly.
 
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Please read the first post for checking eligibility: https://www.hifivision.com/threads/heres-a-chance-to-sample-tube-sound.80684/

Secondly, the amp, Fatman is in Chennai at FM @linuxguru. Someone who's eligible and whom you know can pick it from him.

BTW, the Bravo Audio Pre cum HP Amp with me.

2nd wave of Wuhan flu had put a check on the chain. I'll handover the preamp to @blackscorpio who's next in line shortly.
Thanks captain. I read the first post. I had reached out to @Analogous to know if I can buy one such fatman tube amp and he recommended I speak to you and it was also mentioned I shd post in this thread by yourself. It was in conflict with the eligibility mentioned in the first post - yes I did notice that and ended up posting this response. If there is a cause for selling the fatman tube, i would be interested. Else I shall continue to bide my time. If you would like to talk to me, i am on dm. Shall share my number too.

Thanks, Bhooshan
 
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