How speaker cables change the sound, Mogami 3104 vs 3082….

[ishmeet73]

I was fortunate to get the Dynaudio SP40 (Anniversary Edition) on loan from a FM to audition with my system. I was auditioning them against the SVS Ultra Towers. The evening I got the speakers I connected them to my system and did a cursory check all sounded good.

The next day I started to A/B the speakers with the same cable, Mogami 3104. The 3104s have been terminated by me, with Furutech lockable Banana Plugs. Compared to the the SVS the SP40s sounded so lack lustre and dead that I was surprised, something didn’t add up here. When I heard them at my friends place they sounded so good. I slept over the issue, the next day I remembered that my friend had said that the speaker cable that he is using were very “Transparent”. That got me thinking. I had bought a pair of Mogami 3082 speaker cables, but hadn’t used them yet, as I was not happy with the termination. I have ordered the Audioquest 300 Banana Plugs which I will only get by the end of Oct 2024. But anyway I did connect the SP40s with the 3082 speaker cables.

The moment the speaker cable changed the SP40s were a different set of speakers, it was as is they had a sour throat and now everything had cleared. THE SOUND DRAMATICALLY CHANGED.
The Mid-range became sweet and mellow, the Highs started to shine and now the speakers came to life.

I had discussed the change of speaker cable with another FM @jigarpatel before doing the cable swap. He thought it would not make Night and Day change to the sound. But, even he was shocked when we did the A/B between the 3104 and 3082 cables.

The chain was the same, the only thing different was the cable. This just goes to show “Synergy” matters. The 3104 works very well with my SVS Ultra Towers, but not with the SP40s. Both cables are made by Mogami. Hopefully the 3082 will give better results once I swap the banana plugs with Audioquest 300 banana plugs.

 

[ishmeet73]

It would be nice if other FMs could add their experiences and knowledge, so as to create a kind of guide for other members.

 

[jigarpatel]

Earlier I had listen to SP40 on his system with Mogami 3104 speaker cable, however SP40 did not impressed me much.
When @ishmeet73 called me and saying exploring SP40 with Mogami 3082 speaker cable, I told him speaker cable does change sound but not day and night. Later he messaged me saying speaker cable made day and night difference and now become curious I had to listen, so I visited his beautiful home in evening.

To my surprise, I must admit "I was wrong, speaker cable change made Day and Night difference".
SP40 sound so good that now I am thinking about upgrading my speakers. Bass and Mids. was more fuller and tonality was right on spot. Treble was detailed but no fatigue even though music was blasting at around 80 Db. Entire sound stage had more air and instrument separation was spot on.

My conclusion: Speaker cable can make day and night difference, In my case I went from SP40 being just another speaker to wanting to buy them.

 

[Saiganesh]

Are you guys dealers, are you into brand marketing or??
Its copper!!
COme on!!
Lets be true to ourself first.
This is outrageous. Already hifi has gone too far from being affordable and this is going to make things crazy and lesser people are going to be pulled in as time goes.
This is India and lets not put a tax on cables too in the name of fidelity.
Though this would initially make huge gains will end up being crazy expensive. Floating more crappy things in market and making people buy those craps to make them want these fidelity named snake oil!

 

[ishmeet73]

.

Are you guys dealers, are you into brand marketing or??
Its copper!!
COme on!!
Lets be true to ourself first.
This is outrageous. Already hifi has gone too far from being affordable and this is going to make things crazy and lesser people are going to be pulled in as time goes.
This is India and lets not put a tax on cables too in the name of fidelity.
Though this would initially make huge gains will end up being crazy expensive. Floating more crappy things in market and making people buy those craps to make them want these fidelity named snake oil!

You may call this outrageous, I am OK with that.

Now let’s get some facts straight. I am not talking about cables that cost a few hundreds of thousands. The Mogami 3104, 2.5 mtrs terminated cable cost ₹12700. Whereas, the Mogami 3082. 2.5 mtrs terminated cable cost ₹5400. So this is not about high end ostentatious cables. More importantly, you have not understood the jist of my post. What I am talking about is Synergy.

I am on the hunt for a new set of speakers, I have started a thread to help me with that too. Here I got these amazing speakers on loan, and I almost blew the opportunity that was given to me. Had I not changed the cable and heard the results, I would have branded the Dynaudio SP40s as not matching with my amplifier (Luxman L505 uxII). And that would have been real injustice.

You want to call it snake oil, go right ahead, that’s your prerogative. My intention here is to share what I learnt, for the rest, you are all intelligent folks, you can decide for yourselves. I wish you lived close to me, I would have invited you to listen and then make your decision.

 

[Saiganesh]

You may call this outrageous, I am OK with that.

Now let’s get some facts straight. I am not talking about cables that cost a few hundreds of thousands. The Mogami 3104, 2.5 mtrs terminated cable cost ₹12700. Whereas, the Mogami 3082. 2.5 mtrs terminated cable cost ₹5400. So this is not about high end ostentatious cables. More importantly, you have not understood the jist of my post. What I am talking about is Synergy.

I am on the hunt for a new set of speakers, I have started a thread to help me with that too. Here I got these amazing speakers on loan, and I almost blew the opportunity that was given to me. Had I not changed the cable and heard the results, I would have branded the Dynaudio SP40s as not matching with my amplifier (Luxman L505 uxII). And that would have been real injustice.

You want to call it snake oil, go right ahead, that’s your prerogative. My intention here is to share what I learnt, for the rest, you are all intelligent folks, you can decide for yourselves. I wish you lived close to me, I would have invited you to listen and then make your decision.

Hopefully its true. Not trying to offend but offended by how marketing will go ahead with this!
I Have seen evident changes while upgrading from cheap silver cables to copper (ofc) cables. But beyond a certain price its....outrageous!!
May be its the gear that matters with these high end cables!

 

[sachinchavan 15865]

Not debating the improvement in sound. But why’d a less transparent cable make the other speaker sound better? My understanding is the best cable is no cable, ie one that is most transparent, one that doesn’t alter any of the frequencies and doesn’t add any interference. If one of the cables is clearly more transparent than the other, why shouldn’t it work better with any speaker? It’s the amp-speaker synergy you need to ensure. Once that’s done, I feel the most transparent cable would always sound better.

 

[ishmeet73]

Not debating the improvement in sound. But why’d a less transparent cable make the other speaker sound better? My understanding is the best cable is no cable, ie one that is most transparent, one that doesn’t alter any of the frequencies and doesn’t add any interference. If one of the cables is clearly more transparent than the other, why shouldn’t it work better with any speaker? It’s the amp-speaker synergy you need to ensure. Once that’s done, I feel the most transparent cable would always sound better.

The Mogami 3104 is a very popular speaker cable, it has 4 cores of 12 AWG OFC copper. I have been using this cable with my SVS Ultras from over a year now, and they sound good with them. I remember the first time I used them on the SVS, they made a big difference to the bass.

IMHO, I think it’s about the characteristics of the speaker. Some speakers demand a transparent cable, while others work better with a warmer sounding cable. In all honesty, I didn’t know very much about 3082, I found out about it from a video on YouTube. So I bought the cable as an experiment to hear if there was a difference when you change a cable.

The next time I audition a speaker, I will be more aware of the cable being used. At the dealers, the speakers sound great, but when we bring them home they sound different. Yes, the room has a role to play in the that, but now I know, so do the speaker cables.

 

[jigarpatel]

Here is summery in short

• Luxman L505 uxII -> Mogami 3104 cable -> SVS Ultras - this combination provide better synergy compared to 3082 cable.
• Luxman L505 uxII -> Mogami 3082 cable -> SVS Ultras - this combination synergy does not work compared to 3104 cable.
• Luxman L505 uxII -> Mogami 3104 cable -> DynAudio SP40 - this combination synergy does not work compared to 3082 cable.
• Luxman L505 uxII -> Mogami 3082 cable -> DynAudio SP40 - this combination provide better synergy compared to 3104 cable.

 

[spirovious]

Let me add something.
3104 is terminated with banana plug and l guess 3082 isn't. Banana plugs do add certain changes in sound signature.

 

[keith_correa]

I hope that the new banana plugs that you ordered will have "synergy" with the sockets and the wire.

 

[arj]

It would be nice if other FMs could add their experiences and knowledge, so as to create a kind of guide for other members.

Its a controversial topic. There are those who have tried it and not felt a difference and then there are those who have never tried it and believe it does not make a difference. The former may have a valid view but the issue ( if any) could lie anywhere from system to how they listen ..the latter opinion does not matter as usually they are the ones who are the most outraged and vociferous as well

So take views with a pinch of salt since there are also many who have tried it and found a difference ( ignore those who have not tried but believe It makes a difference since that is also based on belief)

So if you have heard the difference, then there is no guide for cables other than (putting something quickly form top of the mind)

1. Price does not matter but quality does. Configuration, copper purity, AWG, coating all make a difference
2. connectors matter..copper, brass are better and strange ones Like Rubinium are worst. Bare wire is the best despite inconvenience and spade next followed by banana
3. They are very dependent on the system and what works for one may not for the other..so there is never a "best cable"
4. Cable does not improve sound..it is a conduit and it just brings the system closer to its real sound of the system. Hence playing with it comes After 1. Room placement and 2a. Source optimization 2b . right amplification 3. clean power.
5. Order of cables are ICs starting from the sources then speaker cables. i am not going into power cables...but Better power >> "Better" power cables

One common experience -Tin coated cables are do the best midrange and unless its a high end system will give you very good sound and are usually reasonably priced. if this cable makes your sound "Bright" the problem is somewhere else and usually Room or Source.

Not debating the improvement in sound. But why’d a less transparent cable make the other speaker sound better? My understanding is the best cable is no cable, ie one that is most transparent, one that doesn’t alter any of the frequencies and doesn’t add any interference. If one of the cables is clearly more transparent than the other, why shouldn’t it work better with any speaker? It’s the amp-speaker synergy you need to ensure. Once that’s done, I feel the most transparent cable would always sound better.

+1

 

[ishmeet73]

Let me add something.
3104 is terminated with banana plug and l guess 3082 isn't. Banana plugs do add certain changes in sound signature.

The 3104s are terminated with Furutech FP-202(G) Banana Plugs whereas the 3082 are terminated with generic Chinese Banana Plugs.

I hope that the new banana plugs that you ordered will have "synergy" with the sockets and the wire.

Keith I don't know about the Synergy part, but I do believe in using decent quality plugs and not the Generic Chinese plugs. So I have ordered AudioQuest 300 (G) plugs. I hope they pass muster in your eyes.

 

[arj]

Hopefully its true. Not trying to offend but offended by how marketing will go ahead with this!
I Have seen evident changes while upgrading from cheap silver cables to copper (ofc) cables. But beyond a certain price its....outrageous!!
May be its the gear that matters with these high end cables!

On that note, dont the buyers decides whats value to them ? cables at least have some utility compared to THIS

Considering the origin of snake oil IS Snake oil. there are suckers and those who get suckered..but if you are happy and the money is worth the happiness why is a 3rd party concerned who has neither spent the money nor been forced with the "happiness" . there are still people who chug down a 20K USD bottle of wine which goes into the You-Know-What pot anyway..but if they feel that money is worth the happiness it should be fine.

 

[ishmeet73]

One common experience -Tin coated cables are do the best midrange and unless its a high end system will give you very good sound and are usually reasonably priced. if this cable makes your sound "Bright" the problem is somewhere else and usually Room or Source.

Here the problem was not making the sound Bright, it was making the sound muddy and dull. The source was the same, the room was the same, the only change was the cable.

 

[Saiganesh]

The elephant in the room.
We all know how apple changed the pricing of mobile phones.
Samsung wanted to proove their brand worthy and increased their pricing as well.

Gone are the eras where in 10k budget we got a snnapdragon 6xx series mobile at 10k (redmi note series)

Competetion generally reduces the pricing but mobile scenario its otherwise.

Hope this doesnt happen here in HT gears and cable is the basic nerve and if this kind of pricing competetion starts here....!!!!

Giving 5start to product hurts me back on my next cycle of purchase. Manufacturers too would gain only from one cycle and immediately after their vendors too change the pricing and...inflation!!!

 

[arj]

As long as it's not made compulsory its ok.
Folks who want the brand value or unique extra features pay for it and those who look at it as utilitarian look for other brands
Both are fine, everyone who is clear on needs is happy

 

[reignofchaos]

3103/3104 is a fantastic cable for ATC. If you are looking for a pair of good bookshelves, listen to the SCM 19.