I'm looking for an AMP for Hifiman Sundara under ₹20000, using LG G8X for music playback. Suggestions please...

[lithiumnk]

I have a LG G8X , it has an inbuilt quad dac which I'm ok with. Was using Sennheiser HD 599 and loved it's sound. Then I decided to upgrade and got a Hifiman Sundara.
My phone is probably not able to drive the Sundara as the sound is really low.
I would listen with 35 sound levels in HD599 but to get to same level I have to crank it up to full ie 75. Still Sundara sounds like masked.

Maybe a better AMP can solve my problem.
I'm currently looking at ifi Zen CAN and Schiit Magni Heresy.

I love detailed and balanced sound.

Please suggest an AMP around ₹ 20000.

Thank you and regards
Ravikiran

Search for Sapphire v4 DIY amp made by @kartikay in Bangalore. This is a neutral amp & has more than enough current for sundara. Beats many SS amps easily. It drove my Yamaha hp1 ortho with ease. They are 150ohms & 90-92db/mw sensitive.
Amazing amp !

 

[Stormheart]

Hello,

I was not able to give an impression till now, Covid problems in my family. Sorry for the delay…

Here’s my impressions of Hifiman Sundara



First – background.

I am not a serious audophile but I do like to listen to good music.

I have

• Sony MDR XB 950 BT – too much bass which kinda overpowers mids and treble. Don’t like that much.
• Sony WH 900 N – Same, has more base and less mids and treble but definitely better that XB 950, still I am somewhat ok with these.
• Sennheiser HD 599 – Better Mids and Treble. These I like. Eberythis is good and balanced to me. Love them.

With this experience I wanted to upgrade my listening and I started looking for headphones and finally got Hifiman Sundara.



Without Amplification.

The sound seemed distant, very low. On my Phone (LG V40 and G8X) I had to crank up the volume to around 60-65 even after forcing High impedance mode. Even then it seemed something was lacking in the sound. It was as though there was a veil on the sound, like a blanket cover on the entire sound.



Hifiman Sundara + Schiit Magni

Oh my god.!!!! The headphones are alive.!!!! Seriously the sound is phenomenally better. The veil is removed.

These definitely needs amplification, and no, not those portable amplifiers. It is a serious headphone and it needs serious desktop amplification. If someone’s saying otherwise, they’re lying.



Impressions:

With my phone + Shiit Magni

The Sound is amazing. This headphone has amazing clarity, separation and speed. Every detail in songs could be heard. I'm even hearing details in songs I had never heard before. Everything seems so clean and tight.
Soundstage is Ok, nothing to complain.
Bass is definitely acceptable whereas Mids and treble are top notc.

Still it felt something was still missing in the sound. Then came EQ.

I used Wavelet(paid) for eq correction for Hifiman Sundara 2020 version. Now it’s perfect. It is now become what I’ve paid for.

Final Note:

1. Awesome headphones.

2. Definitely needs amplification to unlock its full potential.

3. Needs EQ as well to get complete sound.

4. There’s something with the clamping force I think, I get uncomfortable in my lower jaws after extended use (maybe I’ll get used to this over time).



Thank you all for your suggestions and help. You guys helped me make my choice on amp.



Next is a DAC. I’m thinking of Modi Multibit though not now maybe after a few months.

Take care, stay safe

Regards



Ravikiran.

 

[Stormheart]

Perfectly enjoy the headphone out on Cxa81
But my audiogd has trained my ears to clean quality sound

I've seen polarized views on the net. There are some who swear by AudioGD R2R Dacs yet there are others that call these garbage.

Can you please tell me how these actually sound I was thinking of getting AudioGD R2R 11. Emailed them and got a quote but stopped there because I couldn't decide if they were actually good.

 

[Doomster69]

Next is a DAC. I’m thinking of Modi Multibit though not now maybe after a few months

I hv the mimby paired with the sundara. Its a good combination considering the mimby adds soundstage depth width and reasonably good image positioning making the sundaras shine! The low end is also improved and with slight eq (suggested by metal571 on YT channel), they really deliver the wow!

Yesterday I passed the signal from mimby through a tube buffer into the headphone amp and I'm shocked by the scale/size of the sound!! Think Il be relishing this for some time to come..

I'm now looking out to upgrade to a better R2R dac.. Something like a Soekris, Bimby V2 or Denafrips II.. Paired with a powerful amp like asgard 3, I can't imagine how good the headphones will sound!!

 

[Amitdubey]

I've seen polarized views on the net. There are some who swear by AudioGD R2R Dacs yet there are others that call these garbage.

Can you please tell me how these actually sound I was thinking of getting AudioGD R2R 11. Emailed them and got a quote but stopped there because I couldn't decide if they were actually good.

Oh man...I don't have their R2R. Not to mention inspite of what people say to you, there's no guarantee your experience will be same as theirs. Specially on headphone products, its about taking a chance. Its usually ASR and their measurements put AudioGD products down. They are great products, with very good specs and excellent support around the clock.

 

[Doomster69]

Oh man...I don't have their R2R. Not to mention inspite of what people say to you, there's no guarantee your experience will be same as theirs. Specially on headphone products, its about taking a chance. Its usually ASR and their measurements put AudioGD products down. They are great products, with very good specs and excellent support around the clock.

Amos at Currawong (YT) did a comparison between the audio gd and schiit multibits.. And he does use the sundaras for testing.

From what I recall, audio GD is softer and more rolled off at both ends, making it a relaxed listen at cost of dynamics. The multibits are more dynamic as per his testing. Some online reviews also rate multibits to be better than audioGd.

Of course as you put it, experiences vary, but with limitations on auditioning, the best source of info would be the words of experienced HFV forum members, followed by SBAF, head-fi, etc. AFA measurements go, I'd take subjective listening experience over measurements anyday

 

[Stormheart]

Oh man...I don't have their R2R. Not to mention inspite of what people say to you, there's no guarantee your experience will be same as theirs. Specially on headphone products, its about taking a chance. Its usually ASR and their measurements put AudioGD products down. They are great products, with very good specs and excellent support around the clock.

Yes, in what I searched, their sound 8s more analogish with less dynamics

 

[Stormheart]

Amos at Currawong (YT) did a comparison between the audio gd and schiit multibits.. And he does use the sundaras for testing.

From what I recall, audio GD is softer and more rolled off at both ends, making it a relaxed listen at cost of dynamics. The multibits are more dynamic as per his testing. Some online reviews also rate multibits to be better than audioGd.

Of course as you put it, experiences vary, but with limitations on auditioning, the best source of info would be the words of experienced HFV forum members, followed by SBAF, head-fi, etc. AFA measurements go, I'd take subjective listening experience over measurements anyday

I'd still go with a Modi Multibit but I have a question. I read somewhere that Mimby needs to be on all the time and it's full potential comes out when its heated, is that true? Did you experience something like that?

 

[Doomster69]

I'd still go with a Modi Multibit but I have a question. I read somewhere that Mimby needs to be on all the time and it's full potential comes out when its heated, is that true? Did you experience something like that?

Well i picked up my unit for an FM - read 4th user so it was well burned in. As for leaving it on, it may be advised since the Schiit product's architecture is such - they perform 'best'/optimally when they are a bit warm ( something to do with optimal thermal temps for components, as i read online). But this is something i've heard in practice - the sound sig. becomes a 'bit smoother' overall after some playback time.

That said, id also mention that it sounds perfectly fine otherwise (freshly started and not left on for a long time).

 

[Stormheart]

Well i picked up my unit for an FM - read 4th user so it was well burned in. As for leaving it on, it may be advised since the Schiit product's architecture is such - they perform 'best'/optimally when they are a bit warm ( something to do with optimal thermal temps for components, as i read online). But this is something i've heard in practice - the sound sig. becomes a 'bit smoother' overall after some playback time.

That said, id also mention that it sounds perfectly fine otherwise (freshly started and not left on for a long time).

The Mimby is out of stock at Headphonezone. I'm waiting for restocking, also I'll look for any used ones. Thank you soo much.!

 

[Doomster69]

The Mimby is out of stock at Headphonezone. I'm waiting for restocking, also I'll look for any used ones. Thank you soo much.!

Well i can tell you for sure, it aint coming back in stock anytime soon. I had been going to and fro with HPZ and even Schiit since last year.. ordered one from Schiit directly and shipping delays were as long as 3 months.. Finally got an older version of mimby from an FM last month and ordered the upgrade ROM from Schiit to bring up the specs of the unit to v2 levels.

btw - there is a Bifrost v1 on sale from @FanaticSankey. Uses the same DAC chip as the v1 mimby, but better power supply (inbuilt). A new mimby from Schiit will cost you around 30K (incl. duties) with a 3 month waiting. HPZ lists the price as 25K which i suspect will go up looking at the pricing for some other products. If you can wait for a used unit, you save some money. Else if you can stretch your budget, you can connect with the FM and get the Bifrost v1 (i think the listing was for 35K).

Good luck!

 

[Doomster69]

The headphone amp section of most speaker amps is an afterthought. Speaker amp manufactures don't even bother to advertise the specs of their HP amp section, and in most cases, they produce less power than a competent HP amp

So I got a reply from Marantz today about the headphone out spec. They only mentioned the output impedance as 400 ohms and did not specify the power ratings. Ideally HP impedance to Amp Output Impedance should be 2.25:1 (acceptable) to 8:1 (optimal). But also read that planars have a flatter impedance so if the amp has sufficent current, there won't be distortion.

I guess the 400 ohms output impedance is not a good thing afterall as compared to significantly lower of dedicated headamps (eg. 0.2 ohms of schiit magni 3+) makes for a technically more capable/much better proposition.

@catalyst360 - you were quite right! Thanks for the insight!

 

[catalyst360]

So I got a reply from Marantz today about the headphone out spec. They only mentioned the output impedance as 400 ohms and did not specify the power ratings. Ideally HP impedance to Amp Output Impedance should be 2.25:1 (acceptable) to 8:1 (optimal). But also read that planars have a flatter impedance so if the amp has sufficent current, there won't be distortion.

I guess the 400 ohms output impedance is not a good thing afterall as compared to significantly lower of dedicated headamps (eg. 0.2 ohms of schiit magni 3+) makes for a technically more capable/much better proposition.

@catalyst360 - you were quite right! Thanks for the insight!

400 ohms output impedance for a SS headphone amp is laughably high. Even tube head amps have impedance in the range of 100-200. I am guessing the power rating would under 50mw, a figure so low that they wont consider mentioning it.

Planar headphones like the Sundara works best with a low impedance high current amplifier. Since you already have the Marantz at hand you can try out its output. But for optimal performance a SS headamp like the L30 or Magni Heresy is recommended.

 

[Doomster69]

400 ohms output impedance for a SS headphone amp is laughably high. Even tube head amps have impedance in the range of 100-200. I am guessing the power rating would under 50mw, a figure so low that they wont consider mentioning it.

Planar headphones like the Sundara works best with a low impedance high current amplifier. Since you already have the Marantz at hand you can try out its output. But for optimal performance a SS headamp like the L30 or Magni Heresy is recommended.

Surprisingly the headphones work pretty well with the amp.. I'm also surprised how... But yes, the dedicated headamp will sound much better

 

[lithiumnk]

You should contact anode acoustics India. They have a SS headphone amp.

 

[lithiumnk]

Solid State HP Amplifier № 2 MKII – Anode Acoustics

anodeacoustics.in