Kolkata | Speaker 5.0 or 5.1 for Pioneer VSX 831

[elangoas]

Pardon the stupid question but what is the meaning of matching centre channel. Matching in what terms? Please be kind enough to elaborate on this.

For Ex : If you have a BS from Wharfedale Diamond 220, then it is better to buy a center from the same series of Wharfedale, which is Wharfedale Diamond 220C.. Usually the center channels speakers are prefixed (or) suffixed with letter 'c'..

 

[kajha83]

The member has repeatedly insisted on his max spending on speakers in multiple posts in this thread & the other thread, i think we should be more respectful towards one's budget and suggest products accordingly, and not make him stretch more.

While I would have loved to go for something better (and therefore more expensive - e.g. KEF Q350); you are spot on that I am deciding to stay within a budget of 40-50K for the full setup. Just settling for a pair of front BS (for something over 25-30 K) is not an option as I would like to start small and gradually build. So, immediate spend (Front BS) needs to be around 15K.

I understand @shibashis is suggesting for better Front BS from Audio point of view. But I don't seem to see any other option in the budget.

If you are planning to get any of the BS from UK, then remember you will need to get a matching center channel.

I had not taken this into account. Thanks for highlighting.
If I get the immediate help from friend with something like Dali Zensor 1, I think I will be able to manage Dali Zensor Vokal in next few months again from UK for around 15K. Will update the thread on how it goes.

I understand now that ideally Center Channels should match the Front ones (same brand and model). But if one chooses to mix and match, would it totally go wrong? Just trying to understand...

 

[rpmahale]

Most of the speakers you have mentioned are good to own but putting them in your budget is one of the difficult task. Most of the FM suggested you to go slow and steady so that you can have a good HT and stereo setup in near future. Dali Zenser and Polk RTiA are absolutely great speakers with matching amplifier, I found both little bright with shrill in high frequencies. Now Warfdale and Boston Acoustics are have warmer and little laid back sound signature. Other than Taga, Boston Acoustics A26/A225C/A25 is one of the cheapest option you have within your budget. Don't purchase anything till you audition the last speaker in your list. Give some more time to audition, you will yourself decide which speakers sounds best to you. FM are here to help you to invest your money in good equipments which you can enjoy for longer periods.

 

[kbhuvi]

For Ex : If you have a BS from Wharfedale Diamond 220, then it is better to buy a center from the same series of Wharfedale, which is Wharfedale Diamond 220C.. Usually the center channels speakers are prefixed (or) suffixed with letter 'c'..

I understood that portion. I want to understand the reasons behind it.
Sorry OP. Dont mean to hijack your thread.

 

[kajha83]

Sorry OP. Dont mean to hijack your thread.

No problem. My question too...

I understand now that ideally Center Channels should match the Front ones (same brand and model). But if one chooses to mix and match, would it totally go wrong? Just trying to understand...

 

[elangoas]

So, immediate spend (Front BS) needs to be around 15K.

I had not taken this into account. Thanks for highlighting.
If I get the immediate help from friend with something like Dali Zensor 1, I think I will be able to manage Dali Zensor Vokal in next few months again from UK for around 15K. Will update the thread on how it goes.

Ok great..

I understand now that ideally Center Channels should match the Front ones (same brand and model). But if one chooses to mix and match, would it totally go wrong? Just trying to understand...

I understood that portion. I want to understand the reasons behind it.

It is good to match the center with the fronts, though not mandatory.. Best would be, to put 3 identical speakers for your L-C-R, it would be even better..

Think of a scene in a movie when an object moves (train, car, bus) from left to right of the screen, it would sound seamless (sound signature) when you have identical speakers, also when you have speakers from the same series.. I have been using 5 identical speakers L-C-R-SL-SR (Taga Harmony Platinum LCR-60 SL) on my HT for sometime and it sounds great..

HT is not about how expensive you own, it is about how best you make (optimise) the experience..

 

[raghupb]

If I get the immediate help from friend with something like Dali Zensor 1, I think I will be able to manage Dali Zensor Vokal in next few months again from UK for around 15K. Will update the thread on how it goes.

I understand now that ideally Center Channels should match the Front ones (same brand and model). But if one chooses to mix and match, would it totally go wrong? Just trying to understand...

If you can wing stuff from UK, you will get better pricing and choice. Keep an eye out for clearance/store-demo/open-box items.
Speakers are passives, so the risk is less even if it is used. Eg., I procured my main speakers from UK (store demo units) a couple of years ago.
SevenOaks Sound and Vision, Richer Sounds, Peter Tyson, Home AV Direct, Audio Vision Online, Hi Fi Corner... are usual suspects to check out.

Center matching with front is desirable, not mandatory. If possible, choose an MTM config for center, especially if the speaker is going to be horizontal. If you run into terrible "timbre mismatch" there are tricks to tame it using your AVR settings. Chances are you will not run into mismatch.

Cheers,
Raghu

 

[kajha83]

Think of a scene in a movie when an object moves (train, car, bus) from left to right of the screen, it would sound seamless (sound signature) when you have identical speakers

If you can wing stuff from UK, you will get better pricing and choice. Keep an eye out for clearance/store-demo/open-box items.

Thanks for the explainations. Now makes sence.

If I travel myself in near future, then can look for 'clearance/store-demo/open-box items'. However, for now, relying on friends.

 

[raghupb]

If I travel myself in near future, then can look for 'clearance/store-demo/open-box items'. However, for now, relying on friends.

Your friends, if they can visit the store, can call you on whatsapp or something.
Or get the floor manager's number and talk to them direct.
Clearance is usually new items but products that will be phased out.
Store demo is well "used for demo"
Open box is usually returns.

In case of speakers, the only real thing to look for is physical damage.
Otherwise, these boxes are built to last.
I saw some great deals on wharfedale, mission, KEF, Monitor Audio, Q-Acoustics (to name a few)

Cheers,
Raghu

 

[shibashis]

The member has repeatedly insisted on his max spending on speakers in multiple posts in this thread & the other thread, i think we should be more respectful towards one's budget and suggest products accordingly, and not make him stretch more..

The member insists on this point because it is a valid one.
Lessons learned the hard way stays with you, otherwise they just remain as advises. An entire setup at 40-50K leaves much to be desired a few months down the line, at that point one gets into that cycle of selling and upgrading, which makes you pay up much more than the initial allocated budget. That is wastage, that is why the insistence on getting the very best he can afford at the moment.
Please do note that no one is asking him to break FDs and take personal loans to fulfill audio desires, stretch as far as only possible for you.
And @elangoas you can address me by my name and not reduce me to anonymity.

 

[elangoas]

And @elangoas you can address me by my name and not reduce me to anonymity.

Sure @shibashis.. Will do so going forward..

The member insists on this point because it is a valid one.Lessons learned the hard way stays with you, otherwise they just remain as advises. An entire setup at 40-50K leaves much to be desired a few months down the line, at that point one gets into that cycle of selling and upgrading, which makes you pay up much more than the initial allocated budget. That is wastage, that is why the insistence on getting the very best he can afford at the moment.

It is good to suggest the user with options, but only when he can stretch..

I have helped few of my friends & heard the 40 - 50K, 5.0 (Taga TAV series) set-ups in their modest room (200 Sqft) and infact they were more than happy they were able to pull it off with in their budget.. I find them to be fantastic option at that price point with just no competition..

Please do note that no one is asking him to break FDs and take personal loans to fulfill audio desires, stretch as far as only possible for you

Right.. We also don't know how he managed to make this current budget..

 

[raghupb]

To @kajha83 (and others as applicable)

The budget trap conundrum; we all face this.

Coming from old school, here is my advice to anyone setting up HT.
Set yourself a goal and time limit to achieve it.
Goal (what is my eventual desired combination): 5.1, 7.2, 7.2.4, "x.y.z"
Beware, audio formats change very quickly, but it does not mean you need to adopt everything.
Time (how long to reach the goal): one shot, 6 months, 2 years, as long as it takes

Next apply needs, means, opportunities principle.
Do I need, this/that/whatnot? (need is different from want; we want everything under the sun )
Do I have the means to achieve this? (mainly budget)
Do I have the opportunity to implement? (procurement challenges, physical constraints, WAF, etc)

Eg.
Do I need 9.2.4? - If your TV is constantly hijacked for cartoons or news or saas-bahu serials, the answer is most likely, 5.1 at most
Do I the have the means to buy the above? - If yes, go ahead. If no, stop right there. If unsure, take it step by step (most of us are in this category)
Do I have the opportunity to implement?
- Can I procure equipment to satisfy my needs within my budget in the timeline set out by me
- Should I wait and procure from abroad (cheaper) or buy locally (audition, warranty, see, touch and feel)
- Can I host and cohabit with monster towers, washing machine size sub-woofers and speakers creeping up on that ficus my wife loves (without evicting family members; eviction starts with you ), and all the wiring

A practical way to go about this would be, AVR followed by 2.0, 3.0/2.1, 3.1, 5.1, full monty (choose your start point)
Remember, movies are not just about thump, thwack, boom, vroom and whoosh. Background music and dialog are paramount.
In Sholay, you want to hear the music played when Jaya Bhaduri is lighting the evening lamps
In Deewar, you want to whistle when you hear Shashi Kapoor say "mere paas maa hai"
In say Kurosawa movies (before all fancy sound-works happened), you want to hear the rain or storm or boiling water
For all of these, L/R or L/C/R are the ones that makes it happen. Background score is there in all movies; in some movies it's brilliant.

So if possible, using Poker terms, don't go "all in" on your first deal.
And once you have achieved your goal, don't let the "keeda" creep in for at least 2-5 years (you know that "keeda" intimately, it's you).

Cheers,
Raghu

 

[kajha83]

Thank you @raghupb for the fantastic explaination...
I think this summary would help any and every newbie.

And of-course, many thanks to @elangoas, @MaSh and @shibashis for your inputs and guidance throughout.

I think I have got enough information. And will keep the thread updated with how I have moved ahead with this journey.

 

[elangoas]

The budget trap conundrum; we all face this.

So if possible, using Poker terms, don't go "all in" on your first deal.

We have to keep in mind that we don't get anything as cheap as US.. So, not possible for everyone

You seem to have used very generic term "all in".. Could you share an example..

Beware, audio formats change very quickly, but it does not mean you need to adopt everything.

Not anytime sooner.. Atmos / Dts X is here to stay for a while, with may be more options of speaker layout..

A practical way to go about this would be, AVR followed by 2.0, 3.0/2.1, 3.1, 5.1, full monty (choose your start point)

I think you are misleading.. If this is your notion of doing a HT set-up, then fine.. Why should other also take this route?.. Not everyone has the same enthusiasm, money, time to build a 5.1 and keep dreaming abt it to complete..

There isn't a need to prolong the build (or) to experience it if one doesn't have the budget..

One can do a HT set-up at any budget, be it a 5.1 (or) the more expansive layout.. it not necessarily have to be prolonged route..

 

[raghupb]

@elangoas
I am not suggesting anyone to take the long winded and slow route.
Please read through again, I only state that goals, time, budget, entry, exit points be decided by the end user.
I have only laid out "a" thought process (which happens to be mine).
It is up to the members who read and accept it or reject it.

@kajha83, who initiated this thread, seems to have got good pointers from the entire discussion.
Happy for him, and hope he gets closure soon.

Cheers,
Raghu

 

[elangoas]

@elangoas
I am not suggesting anyone to take the long winded and slow route.
Please read through again, I only state that goals, time, budget, entry, exit points be decided by the end user.
I have only laid out "a" thought process (which happens to be mine).
It is up to the members who read and accept it or reject it.

Ok.. Just wanted to be sure that someone who is strapped on budget doesn't stumble abt spending in future and not pursue HT build for their budget..

 

[itsharsha]

Thanks @elangoas and @shibashis.

I would order a pair of TAGA Platinum S90SL to start with.
But exploring if my friends can help me get something from UK for the same budget (12-13 K).
Options I am seeing are:

• Mission LX2 (13.5K)
• Dali Zensor 1 (13.5K)
• Q Acoustic 3020 (11K)
• Wharfedale Diamond 220 (11K)

What in your assessment should be the priority among the above ones in terms of sound quality?
Since I could not audition any of these in Kolkata, hence asking.

You can choose between
Dali Zensor 1 (13.5K)
and
Wharfedale Diamond 220 (11K)

 

[MaSh]

And of-course, many thanks to @elangoas, @MaSh and @shibashis for your inputs and guidance throughout.

I think I have got enough information. And will keep the thread updated with how I have moved ahead with this journey.

Hey hi, any updates? Have you picked something ?

MaSh

 

[kajha83]

Thanks to all the members for your patience and all the valuable inputs.
I was able to get help from one of my freinds to get me a pair of Dali Zensor 1. I just got the speakers yesterday, and set it up last night.
The very basic 2.0 system is now set up.

Have still got a few more questions. Would post them in the next message..

Trying to put a couple of pics.
Here is the spec...

Pioneer VSX 831
Dali Zensor 1
Amazon Basic 14 (Oxygen Free) Wire
Nakamitchi Banana Plug

 

[raghupb]

Nice. Mood lighting too; looks "cool"
Congrats on your setup. Enjoy!!
Cheers,
Raghu