Onkyo 3300 AVR better than NAD C 326BEE ?

[S.P.KRISHNA]

Let me share my experience . I have onkyo TX SR 576 AVR and I listen to music on sterio mode on wharfedale 9.5. I Bi-Amped the speakers. Of and on I get a feeling that I am doing a mistake of hearing the music on AVR and immediatly I go for auditionong the Int. Amps in the market and all the times I conclude that the AVR I had is performing excellantly on music front also though not 100% to that of dedicated steio Amps but somewhere around 90% and I decide against spending 50k on these amps. My conclusion is that the present generation of AVRs are not lagging far behind the dedicated sterio Amps.

Regards

 

[gdhiraj]

Burn in for amp ?? isnt NAD C 326BEE a solid state amp ? there is no burn in thingy for solid state devices... only speakrs need few hrs or days of burnin to perform at optimum.

 

[ravi_d]

Hey what is this "burn in" people are referring ?

Thanks,
Vikram

Burn in for amp ?? isnt NAD C 326BEE a solid state amp ? there is no burn in thingy for solid state devices... only speakrs need few hrs or days of burnin to perform at optimum.

Like your phone/laptop battery has to undergo few charging cycles to hold the charge well any solid state hi-fi equipment with capacitors need to see such cycles to perform at its optimum. Most hi-fi equipment needs about 50 hours of moderate usage to perform well.

 

[Vijay_s]

Sorry man. Nothing wrong in what you suggested



hahaha:lol:

When you are serious about your hi-fi hobby and have a decent budget you should definitely buy a decent amp and decent speakers to keep you happy for next 4 to 5 years. Or you feel bored quickly and upgrade bug bites you soon.

Sorry, What do you mean? Is it a generic statement or something to do with my initial post?

 

[gdhiraj]

Like your phone/laptop battery has to undergo few charging cycles to hold the charge well any solid state hi-fi equipment with capacitors need to see such cycles to perform at its optimum. Most hi-fi equipment needs about 50 hours of moderate usage to perform well.

Nope its a myth ..capacitors will perform what they were designed for in few seconds of first electrons injections in them, and that happens in factory itself.... battery is a very different story... if burnin for SS devices was such a big deal then most equipment manufacturing companies will perform the burnin in factory to make more satisfied customers .. i belive its more that usr / listener gets use to listening to new eqiupment in his environment and nothing more then that...

I am not sure if manual of any equipment says that one need to burn in ? do they ?

 

[ravi_d]

Sorry, What do you mean? Is it a generic statement or something to do with my initial post?

@svkndv
Your choice was perfect. You did the right thing and you will sure enjoy the set-up for years.

I'm trying to support my argument why small tiny speakers with a 4k INR amp (mentioned in post #16) putting out 7W/ch is not considered an upgrade/improvement moving from a amp putting out 50W/ch with good speakers.

Edit: @svkndv, Nothing wrong with your previous posts. Sorry for the confusion. I'm trying to answer why the cheap class-T/ class-D is not an alternative to the new Nad c326bee/c356bee amps.

 

[psychotropic]

Hey Ravi, are you really under the illusion that it's the number of watts and the size of speakers that matter for good sound? Have you actually listened to a Tripath amp paired with a matching pair of speakers? I used to own an NAD C320BEE and when I got my Tripath amplifier it just blew the NAD out of the water when paired with my then speakers the Usher S520, and they work beautifully with current speakers the Odyssey Epiphony. So I sold off the NAD. Yes, I owned them both, listened to them both and decided that the NAD was thoroughly outperformed in virtually every department.

I agree that you can't pair a low-power amp with any speakers and expect to get great results, but when paired correctly a Tripath amp can outperform several amps that are fare more powerful (and far more reputed).

Don't be under the illusion that the numbers are everything (watts per channel, rupees per amplifier, and such other frivolities). Audio is much more than that. Anyhow I'd love to know where and how you did the comparison of the NAD and the T-amp to arrive at your sweeping conclusions. I'd love to hear the details of the partnering equipment you used, the music you listened to and the basis and parameters on which you arrived at your conclusion.

 

[magma]

sir
how are you defining your bass?

Do you consider the reverbations to be good ?

DO you like the bass extensions? the lingering bass filling your room?

if the answer to the above is yes then i would agree that you like the AVR more
theres nothing wrong in that too
thats just your likes and music is subjective

in general an integrated amp (over an AVR) offers more control with higher damping factors and cleaner power
Due to this bass notes are "tighter" but not extended ( which i think you are probably considering "piunchy")
An int amp will "control" the speaker more and hence notes will be crisper and rapid and so will the bass

look for acurate bass not the extended bass
As i tell many in car audio
"Correct bass is more to be felt than to be heard"

 

[soundofmusic]

Hahaha. Even my grandma gets headache listening to just a tv at average volume. For her a T-class amp instead of a proper amp definitely makes sense as her main hi-fi system:lol:

A T-class amp is definitely an option for those on a shoe string budget or those who are not so serious about hi-fi and are considering 10 year old used amps.
A T-class amp is not a replacement for proper stereo amp. I never saw anyone sell their brand new stereo amp and move to a T-class amp.
I don't think it will satisfy or make sense to downgrade for those who have any good marantz, CA or NAD amps.

Dear Ravi.
10 Years old Integrated amp is much better then the latest amps IMO. Try a Sansui 717 or the like and you will come to know what I am talking. I had a NAD C372 and it cant even come close to my Old 3020.Many Older stuff are still a favorite for many Audiophiles including me.

Regards

 

[ravi_d]

Hey Ravi, are you really under the illusion that it's the number of watts and the size of speakers that matter for good sound? Have you actually listened to a Tripath amp paired with a matching pair of speakers? I used to own an NAD C320BEE and when I got my Tripath amplifier it just blew the NAD out of the water when paired with my then speakers the Usher S520, and they work beautifully with current speakers the Odyssey Epiphony. So I sold off the NAD. Yes, I owned them both, listened to them both and decided that the NAD was thoroughly outperformed in virtually every department.

I agree that you can't pair a low-power amp with any speakers and expect to get great results, but when paired correctly a Tripath amp can outperform several amps that are fare more powerful (and far more reputed).

Don't be under the illusion that the numbers are everything (watts per channel, rupees per amplifier, and such other frivolities). Audio is much more than that. Anyhow I'd love to know where and how you did the comparison of the NAD and the T-amp to arrive at your sweeping conclusions. I'd love to hear the details of the partnering equipment you used, the music you listened to and the basis and parameters on which you arrived at your conclusion.

Hi psychotropic, To be frank I'm just trying to comfort the OP who just bought his set-up a week ago with his hard earned money. I have no intention to bash the Topping TP20 or have tried it.
Even though someone suggested the OP that the topping 20 combo can still be the best up to 70k INR on his suggestion thread the OP still went with NAD+PSB combo after auditioning the CA+MS combo and other amps.

Now if the OP is asking something about his set-up I don't think confusing him now with comments like that you should have bought Topping TP20 makes any sense to the purpose of the thread.
Do we have that sought of customer service where we can just return the amp/item with in certain period of time to the seller and get a full refund?
What ever the combo the OP bought I don't think its inferior to any other set-ups.

I tried the Yamaha CD S700 CD-P + Harman/Kardon HK 970 + Mission M32i speakers combo. I didn't like the setup. Felt something was missing the sound was too bright to my taste and the bass was boomy.
Later I tried Yamaha CD S700 CD-P + NAD c356bee + Mission M32i combo. But still not satisfied.
After that I tried Yamaha CD S700 CD-P + NAD c356bee + M-S Mezzo 2 and this combo came close to my taste.
Before to all that I tried the CA Azur 340A + CA S30 speakers and some CD-P. I didn't like that set-up at all.
AFAIK all the products I mentioned above have very good reviews. I have no idea a Topping T20 would satisfy me now? The CA Azur 340A amp an ex display item with 1 year warranty was offered to me for about 70 which is less that 5k INR.

Also my amp and speakers cost me about 50k INR. If you can suggest me a Topping + speakers combo which can beat my set-up may be I'll follow your foot steps in selling my Nad c356bee amp and M-S Mezzo 2 speakers and enjoy better performance for the fraction of the price I spent. I thought that combo is for a secondary hi-fi system. I never knew that will perform well as a primary hi-fi system and can be an alternative for serious hi-fi listening.

I'm saving up for the Audiolab 8200CDQ CD Player. I would like to upgrade my amp too. May be I'll for sure try Topping T20 before considering any other power amp.

EDIT: I read your Topping thread briefly. I appreciate your efforts you put in trying and coming out with that amazing combo at such a budget.
After all the Nad amp you're comparing has done almost more than 8 years of duty and in that time Nad came out with 325bee and discontinued it and now it came out with 326bee. I don't think in any way the 320 is close to the new 326. I can only understand that someone considering an used amp which have cost 30k INR 7 years ago a Topping can be an alternative.
I'm not an expert though and I'm new to Hi-fi. Out of curiosity I have developed an interest in doing a comparison between the Nad amp I have and marantz pm6003 amp. I would add Topping to the list and promise would post a fair honest review between Nad, marantz and topping soon when I have time.

 

[ravi_d]

Dear Ravi.
10 Years old Integrated amp is much better then the latest amps IMO. Try a Sansui 717 or the like and you will come to know what I am talking. I had a NAD C372 and it cant even come close to my Old 3020.Many Older stuff are still a favorite for many Audiophiles including me.

Regards

Dear soundofmusic,
I'm considering upgrading my set-up in next few months if things go well. I'm considering the speakers PMC TB2i or Dynaudio Focus 140 as an upgrade. If I go with the PMC's I'm thinking to go with a Bryston power amp.
I'll take your suggestion and try Sansui 717 before going with Brystonhyeah:
Thanks for your valuable input. May be it will save me big $$$.
But the only problem with used amps at least in the place I live is if something goes wrong I'll end up paying 50 for to and fro shipping and 50 an hour or more to those inspecting the problem + parts. If nothing works out and I have to dispose it I'll have to spend another 20-30 to take it far away to the place where it can be recycled.

So one trip to the service centre paying for the inspection and to dispose it I will have to spend about 120. Though the 10 year old Sansui amps offer more sound quality than the newer amps the location I'm in forces me to go with the one that has more warranty offering trouble free listening. For the same reason many change their gear as soon as the warranty finishes.
I'm sure the same is the case in India I know people who have trouble getting their AV gear repaired after they finish their warranty period.
In that case the Bryston amps with 20 year transferable warranty is still considered cheap rather than buying and changing budget amps every 3 years.

 

[hemant0285]

Are the PSB IMAGE B6 speakers REAR ported??? or Front Ported... If they are rear ported and if u keep dem close to the wall they will not giv u good performance and would sound boomy.... chek dat too.. and change d positioning of d speakers... abt 3 feet away from d wall

 

[ashishkesarwani]

Are the PSB IMAGE B6 speakers REAR ported??? or Front Ported... If they are rear ported and if u keep dem close to the wall they will not giv u good performance and would sound boomy.... chek dat too.. and change d positioning of d speakers... abt 3 feet away from d wall

PSB Image B6 are rear ported speakers but they don't need a lot of space behind them and they perform well even with 6-8" space at the back, so that even very tight space is not a limiting factor here.

 

[sethu]

SVK, When did you buy the system. Has the system burnt properly. Also check the placement of speakers and also check the connection, the spk may be out of phase.

Hi what is "burnt" properly u mean hours of use continuously?

 

[Vijay_s]

Thought of updating the impressions after 200 hours of use.
Recently I got a pair stands from magma through group buy which I feel contributed to postioning of speakers and their by positively on sound quality.

1. Bass is really tight and punchy. Iam loving it
2. Voice clarity increased further. Loudness of Vocals are clearly above the instruments.
3. Not much improvement in treble department while connected to NAD.
4. Sound quality is far better when NAD in chain while playing Audio CD than through ONkyo receiver.
5. Onkyo 3300 (Speaker B + Stereo mode+Music optimizer ON) is still better when I play MP3,Wav, FLAC from WDTV Live Hub.

One thing still i am not clear is why NAD is sounding too loud at 9'0 clock position eventhough it is underpowered comparison to Onkyo 3300 which is bearable at 12'o clock position. May be my room size 13x15 could be a factor. In my opinion we should be able to use atlest 50% power of the amp which I am not due to the room size or other factors. To any prospective buyer I would only recommend NAD 316 instead of wasting money on unused watts.
I really like the sound signature of PSB so in near team no plan for changing speaker setup. Currently in confusion whether to go for a New AMP or add DAC to improved the sound quality of MP3 played from WDTV.