Tube (tubelike) amp for usher mini dancer

[himadri]

The Usher MD-1s (around 87dB) are also relatively easy to drive - relative to the Be-718 but I suspect not as easy as as a fixed resistive load speaker which is say 83 - 84 dB.
cheers

The 30 watt leben CS 600 was reasonably comfortable driving the MD1 at normal SPLs.Whether a 30 watt SET would also be is the issue I guess and hence my trepidations.
Thanks Ranjeet, Bhagwan and Pratim for your suggestions.Shall look into.
Cheers

 

[captrajesh]

if you have two amps (identical in all ways) rated at

100W x 8 ohms
140W x 4 ohms

and

75W x 8 ohms
150W x 4 ohms

which one would you pick and why?

I reckon that the latter is much better designed with much better specs.

 

[Dr.Bass]

If you liked the Leben CS600, you could look at CS300 also. Even though it has lower power than 600, it still has very good control over the drivers with the similar magic. If you listen at medium levels both of them should do it for you, if you go loud, while the 600 may sound more comfortable but it may not be sufficient. So there is a good case for CS300.

If you are looking for other tubelike options, try to get a used Plinius, something like a 8150, 8200, SA-50 or SA-100/102. These are not only very good upgrades over Denon PMA-2000 but also in the same direction as tubes. With these you dont have to worry about power delivery.

 

[jls001]

I reckon that the latter is much better designed with much better specs.

The second has better specced power supply to be able to produce a full doubling of power with halving of load impedance, whereas the first can only produce 1.4x of power increase when load halves.

 

[himadri]

If you liked the Leben CS600, you could look at CS300 also. Even though it has lower power than 600, it still has very good control over the drivers with the similar magic. If you listen at medium levels both of them should do it for you, if you go loud, while the 600 may sound more comfortable but it may not be sufficient. So there is a good case for CS300.

If you are looking for other tubelike options, try to get a used Plinius, something like a 8150, 8200, SA-50 or SA-100/102. These are not only very good upgrades over Denon PMA-2000 but also in the same direction as tubes. With these you dont have to worry about power delivery.

Thanks Dr Bass for your suggestions,
Actually was caught up in the puja times and could not visit the forum.In between I had an interesting experience.On a casual walk-in at the local audio store here, I noticed a big, bulky marantz Pm11s2 lying in a corner .
Carried it home for a few hours and sampled it against the denon with the mini dancers.The marantz sounded warmer and thicker with good lower end presence and control which didn't diminish at higher volumes.The only issue was the upper mids and the top which sounded slightly harsher.As I returned the amp, when I asked , I was told that the amp was a repaired one .
Anyone has heard the marantz pm11s2 and how would they describe the sound especially the top end?
My guess is it is due to faulty repairs or inadequate burn in.
Cheers

 

[corElement]

Denon's sound signature in general I've always found brighter and leaner than most other mass market consumer amps. In comparison marantz and cambridge audio is definitely not as lean.

BTW, if one finds everything ok in the system but highs a little bright, hyperlitz configuration copper cables can help bring down the edge.

 

[square_wave]

If you liked the Leben CS600, you could look at CS300 also. Even though it has lower power than 600, it still has very good control over the drivers with the similar magic. If you listen at medium levels both of them should do it for you, if you go loud, while the 600 may sound more comfortable but it may not be sufficient. So there is a good case for CS300.

If you are looking for other tubelike options, try to get a used Plinius, something like a 8150, 8200, SA-50 or SA-100/102. These are not only very good upgrades over Denon PMA-2000 but also in the same direction as tubes. With these you dont have to worry about power delivery.

Overall the cs 300 is a better amplifier than the cs 600. But the speaker should be a match technically.

 

[himadri]

Thanks Core and Square
Though I havn't heard the Cambridge but yes marantz is definitely warmer than denon in general.Denon Bright? I dont think so.Its just that the denon's smooth top reduces the fatigue a bit for the revealing top of the ushers at below par recordings.
I havn't heard the Plinius and would like to hear one for sure.
Cheers

 

[himadri]

Hi
Had the good fortune to listen to the Usher mini dancer2 speakers/usher r 105 amplifier/ nighthawk phono/gerrard 401 ttwith SME3012 tonearm/denon 103 cart a few days back at my friend's place.The gerrard /SME/denon produced a forceful,detailed and dynamic sound which was different from my earlier limited exposure to thorens and technics (softer variety).The music sounded very real and made me forget that the analogue/digital divide for sometime.
cheers

 

[SatMumbai]

Anyone has heard the marantz pm11s2 and how would they describe the sound especially the top end?
Cheers

I used to own the PM11S1. It was an impulse purchase assuming that ' High end Marantz must sound good'. However I was very much disappointed with the amplifier but hit my best learning curve in this hobby.
1. After a certain level, price has not much correlation to the enjoyment of the equipment
2. Some manufacturer's Neutral becomes clinical to some consumer's ear
3. Colored sound is not bad as long as it is to your liking

I love Pathos amplifiers (The Inpol2 or logos) for their subtle warmth on most music where as Audio Note level of warmth is enjoayble, to me, only on certain type of music. Classe Amplification is very energetic and resolved and a lot more fun

I hope the above gives an idea of what kind of 'colored' sound I like. Given this, I found PM11 to be very clinical to the extent of boring. I was driving the Dynaudio Contou S1.4 and tried with CM9 but either cases the amp did not live up to the expectations.

As I was saying earlier, the treble silkiness, I have only noticed in the KI-Pearl and the Pathos has a sweet midrange. Ofcourse, it depends alot on the speakers and my results of these two amplifiers were with Proac Response D Two.

 

[SatMumbai]

Just in case if this interests you, I am planning to pair Oppo 105 with Odyssey Power amp as my source + Power and hoping to recreate the magic of Pathos Class A amplification and Classe source resolution at a reasonable small level (size and price)
I will write a seperate thread, in case I go ahead with this thought!

 

[himadri]

Hi
An unfortunate breakdown of my JVC qly5f tt has made me change tracks.The Technics entry level tt slbd20 was a really poor substitute and was making me restless.A readily available new rega rp3 with ortofon om10 was too hot to resist and has been installed. Running it in.Preliminary views:
1)The shortcomings of the technics has been removed. the sound is fuller,warmer with enough details and clean bottom end.
2)the jvc/shure had better slam and speed but wasn't as refined as the rega/ortofon tonally across the frequency range.
Guess the amp upgrade has been postponed for now as the budget has been substantially eaten up by the rega, but this source upgrade probably exploits the potential of my other components to the fullest and retains the basic sweet sound signature.
cheers

 

[himadri]

An Update
A visit by an experienced audiophile and forum member to my house and another forum member's house nearby (having usher MD2+usher pre/power+nighthawk+gerrard 401+denon 103+Marantz cd 6003(to be upgraded to Ayon CD2s) proved to be a learning experience.
Learning points:
1)Speaker placement/minor room treatment tweaks gave large benefits.
2)Demo - Biwiring by a high end cable like Siltech tightened /cleaned up the sound amazingly my friend's Usher system.
3)Demo-Upgraded power cable like audio art with good connectors upgraded my system substantially.
4)TT mats can be used to vary the sound signature to your liking.
Overall an enlightening experience.
Now waiting to listen to the Ayon CD2s as soon as it is installed at the friend's place.
Cheers

 

[ranjeetrain]

1)Speaker placement/minor room treatment tweaks gave large benefits.
Cheers

Can't agree more!

Many people who are dissatisfied with their gear rush to upgrade, without trying to get the best out of what they currently have. Speaker placement can make a *day and night* difference, so can room treatment. No two ways about it.

 

[himadri]

Now waiting to listen to the Ayon CD2s as soon as it is installed at the friend's place.

Had a peek at the newly installed Ayon CD2s.Detailed, with a touch of tubes sans any kind of glare common in lower level CD players.Further listening awaited.
cheers

 

[himadri]

Had a peek at the newly installed Ayon CD2s.Detailed, with a touch of tubes sans any kind of glare common in lower level CD players.Further listening awaited.
cheers

We spent an entire evening listening to the CD 2s at the forum member's place.The back end was usher pre/power/mini dancer2.
The CD2s was vastly superior to the entry level marantz cd player and a vintage thorens belt drive with shure cart in all respects.
The final contest was with an equally strong analogue source-gerrard 401/SME 3012/denon 103 cart/nighthawk phono pre.
Even the mighty Ayon could not stand upto the gerrard/nighthawk/denon chain in neutrality, prat and liveliness and sounded a wee bit coloured (not a bad thing really as most of our recordings were redbook ones).Nevertheless it did everything else exceedingly well.
cheers

 

[rajagopal_j]

Hi Himadri,

If you are still looking for a good tube amp to drive your ushers, You can consider the analogue audio's dared amps. Their dared amps paired with many speakers in the Chennai meet were very good. we tried them with cadence, MBLs, KEFs, custom made klipsch, etc. and they were really good.

The crowd favourite was the VP-60 dared integrated amp. which Capt. Rajesh has picked up for his cadence arista.

Personally I liked the VP-300B dared amp.
DARED VP-300B from Analog Audio Labs India //DARED distributors for India//

B Rgds,
Raj.

 

[himadri]

Thanks Raj for the inputs.Read the Chennai meet reports about the Dared and they all seem positive.Shall look into , its just that the new Rega rp3 has set me back for some time.Your Altec build seems to be going strong - keep it up.
cheers

 

[captrajesh]

If you are still looking for a good tube amp to drive your ushers, You can consider the analogue audio's dared amps. Their dared amps paired with many speakers in the Chennai meet were very good. we tried them with cadence, MBLs, KEFs, custom made klipsch, etc. and they were really good.

Ushers with their 4 Ohm impedance are a different kettle of fish. The same VP 60 sounded thin when paired with Sashi's 3-way DIY speakers. I'm not sure if Dared amps would have enough juice in them to drive the power hungry Ushers. May be you should look for a Push-Pull tube amp with KT88 or EL34 valves like Cayin TA30/50.

 

[rajagopal_j]

Ushers with their 4 Ohm impedance are a different kettle of fish. The same VP 60 sounded thin when paired with Sashi's 3-way DIY speakers. I'm not sure if Dared amps would have enough juice in them to drive the power hungry Ushers. May be you should look for a Push-Pull tube amp with KT88 or EL34 valves like Cayin TA30/50.

Captn,
Himadri has the Mini Dancer 1 if I am not wrong they have a nominal impedance of 8 Ohms with 87Db sensitivity, It is the Mini Dancer 2 which has 4 Ohms Impedance. They are power hungry of course no doubt. Himadri wanted to try Lyrita's GM-70, I am just suggesting Analogue Audio as another option.

B Rgds,
Raj.