Vintage Technics Database
- Thread starter bhaskarcan
- Start date
souravin
Well-Known Member
Thank you Bhaskar da for the pointer. Very helpful.
bhaskarcan
Well-Known Member
@Saket really strange since SL-Q33 is quite a popular model. Then again all the data tabulated there may not be fully correct, so to be used with due diligence.
I found this list very useful for the people who want to get a Technics TT and think that sl1200/1210 is the only one to have. There are many others in the list with very similar specs to 1200's but relatively unknown(i.g. SL-3200/5100). I've heard 5100 and it's very nice TT. These TT's can be found on the bay/local market relatively cheap also as most people search for 1200's. Hence new entrants can use this list to their advantage.
I found this list very useful for the people who want to get a Technics TT and think that sl1200/1210 is the only one to have. There are many others in the list with very similar specs to 1200's but relatively unknown(i.g. SL-3200/5100). I've heard 5100 and it's very nice TT. These TT's can be found on the bay/local market relatively cheap also as most people search for 1200's. Hence new entrants can use this list to their advantage.
reubensm
Well-Known Member
the 3200 is very similar to the servo controlled older 1200s, the key difference is the plinth of course
Agree with the points made by Bhaskar and Reuben.
Panasonic; back then in 1972 called Matsushita electronics never intended to manufacture the 1200s as a DJ tt in the first place. I think they only tried to make it robust and solid. The technical specs of 1200 is very much like many other Technics sibling. Of course, the solid and heavily damped and isolated plinth has a league of its own and due to these features, the enthusiasts made a better use out of this solid TT and the 1200 made its entry into the DJ scene. Probably due to this image of the 1200, its various makes- 6 makes and a few special and limited editions, sold till late 2010 when Panasonic finally decided to pull the plug and hence curtains to Technics as a brand too; ruling the audiophile's world for more than 38 years! Sure, if the convenience and affordibility of digital music was not the issue, these wonderful machines would have been sold still.
Not a 'mere' 3 million units that the 1200 alone clocked!
One of these 3 million, a Technics SL-1200 is still displayed in the London Science Musuem tagged as a piece of technology which shaped the world we live in. Perfect tribute to a machine that turned the night clubbing scene around the world on it's head. Even better tribute paid by the audiophiles who treasure this wonderfull tt.
Panasonic; back then in 1972 called Matsushita electronics never intended to manufacture the 1200s as a DJ tt in the first place. I think they only tried to make it robust and solid. The technical specs of 1200 is very much like many other Technics sibling. Of course, the solid and heavily damped and isolated plinth has a league of its own and due to these features, the enthusiasts made a better use out of this solid TT and the 1200 made its entry into the DJ scene. Probably due to this image of the 1200, its various makes- 6 makes and a few special and limited editions, sold till late 2010 when Panasonic finally decided to pull the plug and hence curtains to Technics as a brand too; ruling the audiophile's world for more than 38 years! Sure, if the convenience and affordibility of digital music was not the issue, these wonderful machines would have been sold still.
Not a 'mere' 3 million units that the 1200 alone clocked!
One of these 3 million, a Technics SL-1200 is still displayed in the London Science Musuem tagged as a piece of technology which shaped the world we live in. Perfect tribute to a machine that turned the night clubbing scene around the world on it's head. Even better tribute paid by the audiophiles who treasure this wonderfull tt.
ghatgepatil
Active Member
Going by pure technical specs, it looks the SL-1100A to possess the best dynamics of all the models featured on the list! .... all except the speed accuracy.
bhaskarcan
Well-Known Member
IMHO & without trying to raise any argument, in our modest home listening setup,any of these Technics machine will perform(obviously with a proper cartridge is installed) very well. I've used 11 TT's of various make and status (frm Garrard301/401 to Sherwood/Aiwa beltdrive and in betweens) and in my setup they all sounded reasonably good. The difference 'due to TT' was never very dramatic. Ok, being it a hobby, I kept on collecting other TT's as and when they came in my way. But SQ wise I think we should not be breaking our head for some particular brand or model. Bcos of all this we stop enjoying the music and become technical maniac. We stop appreciating what our system is giving us and continuously worry about that 1 or 2% extra 'pseudo' performance we could have extracted from the system.
Now if we follow the table closely, it's quite obvious that the performance of most of the tables are very close. Here, also, we have to keep in mind that performance criteria of the TT's are measured using various scopes and not by listening. So I doubt how much that measured performance differences are discernible to our ear. Even people with so called very very.... high end system are always continuously tweaking/upgrading(when they cannot tweak their system anymore, they start tweaking their listening room
). Here sky is the limit.....and we must have our feet firmly grounded.
So finally, as the "popular" vintage TT's are becoming more and more scarce & expensive, one, in need, should look for these lesser known models. They may not be that popular but they are all reasonably good.
Regards
Bhaskar
Now if we follow the table closely, it's quite obvious that the performance of most of the tables are very close. Here, also, we have to keep in mind that performance criteria of the TT's are measured using various scopes and not by listening. So I doubt how much that measured performance differences are discernible to our ear. Even people with so called very very.... high end system are always continuously tweaking/upgrading(when they cannot tweak their system anymore, they start tweaking their listening room
). Here sky is the limit.....and we must have our feet firmly grounded.So finally, as the "popular" vintage TT's are becoming more and more scarce & expensive, one, in need, should look for these lesser known models. They may not be that popular but they are all reasonably good.
Regards
Bhaskar
kuruvilajacob
Well-Known Member
I fully agree with Bhaskar that the performance of many similar Tables are very close. I personally feel that our emotional excitement to the sound reproduced should be the criteria overlooking the brand,arm and cartridge etc . But human mind loves to relate products to it;s brand, price, reputation, reviews .
One progression in performance I saw from a mid-fi direct drive to a good belt drive was the dynamics and pace in the belt drive. It sounded alive. By comparison, the direct drive positively sounded lethargic. When one progresses to idler drive, there is more of that "aliveness", a greater sense of urgency in the music. I know, it's all nonsense descriptions
PS: having said the above, I agree in general with Bhaskar's statement. The differences are there, but they're not night and day differences. One should be able to live with any decent turntable (unless you are someone like me and must hear different flavours).
PS: having said the above, I agree in general with Bhaskar's statement. The differences are there, but they're not night and day differences. One should be able to live with any decent turntable (unless you are someone like me and must hear different flavours).
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reubensm
Well-Known Member
my father (who by far is the most knowledgeable turntable man, both from an audio and engineering perspective, who I have come across) used to always say, during our debates on the different types of turntables, "Son, many people spend years together tweeking their turntables to achieve minute differences, the clever people are those who set up a decent turntable and then leave it to focus on the pre-amplification. The differences with effective equalization are much more significant". Unfortunately he never documented his knowledge or we could have had an encyclopedia on the subject. These were the days before the internet.
bhaskarcan
Well-Known Member
+1, We tend to stop enjoying music, which should be our priority. Rather we try to enjoy our system.
Isn't it strange how people are sucked into 'specifications' where they are supposed concentrate on the 'contents'. i.e. the 'mono' jazz pressings of yesteryear are better than the latter 'stereo' version so run after them. The first pressings of Indian film music is better than subsequent release(I agree that 'initial' releases generally had higher gain, but that can be achieved easily by the volume control knob on the preamp) so until unless I get the 'first print' record of my favorite movie I'll never listen to those songs....
. So, as Mr. Kuruvila rightly stated our mind "loves to relate products to it's brand, price, reputation, reviews" , we should identify this drawback of our mind and come out of it to enjoy our music.
Bhaskar
kuruvilajacob
Well-Known Member
Joshua, you are not alone in wanting to hear different flavours. I prefer to listen to country music and similar music on belt drives like Thorens. I like to hear Pink Floyd and similar music on Direct Drives and live performance on Garrards which as you rightly said have that live feeling. There appears to be life in the performance in Garrards and the throw in the music that cannot be there for any other type of drives
reubensm
Well-Known Member
Bottom line is that its all about perception, like sachin tendulkar once said "cricket is a simple game, somebody throws a ball at you and you have to hit it". The objective of using a turntable or cd player is to listen to music. Those who keep it simple, enjoy their music the most. I have a CEO friend who can afford to spend over a crore on audio equipment but still uses an old record player with built in amp to listen to his records. What is important is how you enjoy your music the most.
Rueben you are lucky to hav such a guiding figure in your life.
+1 to that
IMHO & without trying to raise any argument, in our modest home listening setup,any of these Technics machine will perform(obviously with a proper cartridge is installed) very well. I've used 11 TT's of various make and status (frm Garrard301/401 to Sherwood/Aiwa beltdrive and in betweens) and in my setup they all sounded reasonably good. The difference 'due to TT' was never very dramatic. Ok, being it a hobby, I kept on collecting other TT's as and when they came in my way. But SQ wise I think we should not be breaking our head for some particular brand or model. Bcos of all this we stop enjoying the music and become technical maniac. We stop appreciating what our system is giving us and continuously worry about that 1 or 2% extra 'pseudo' performance we could have extracted from the system.
Now if we follow the table closely, it's quite obvious that the performance of most of the tables are very close. Here, also, we have to keep in mind that performance criteria of the TT's are measured using various scopes and not by listening. So I doubt how much that measured performance differences are discernible to our ear. Even people with so called very very.... high end system are always continuously tweaking/upgrading(when they cannot tweak their system anymore, they start tweaking their listening room
So finally, as the "popular" vintage TT's are becoming more and more scarce & expensive, one, in need, should look for these lesser known models. They may not be that popular but they are all reasonably good.
Regards
Bhaskar
Hi Bhaskar, I am also currently battling with the same dilemma. I have been using a Denon DP-37f direct drive turntable with a Denon DL-110 cartridge. This table is brilliant for the money and has absolutely spot on speed control. I have changed and upgraded the remaining of my setup and have dedicated Pre, power and a phono pre amp. All of these are Lyrita Audio products. Could you or others please let me know that if I were to upgrade my Denon TT to a Technics SL-1210 MK2, would it really be an upgrade? I am not looking to upgrade just for the sake of it. I have been really curious to see how changing a turntable in my existing setup can elevate the overall SQ?
I'd request everyone to share their opinions.
Cheers
Kartick
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