Absloute Lack of Authorised Dealerships / Outlets selling Branded HI-fi Separtes

[akd]

Lucky all the stuff I'm interested in is only available abroad

if this is the reality then you belong to a different league as I am talking on behalf of those who earns a small fraction of yours and can't afford to import all the time, moreover importing stuff from abroad also does not change the situation back home to better

 

[akd]

Kolkata till date has no proper dealer in A/V with showroom and its a metropoliton city.........Once I went to a dealer for demo and it was a real circus to experience....
)

now thats not correct, there are lot of dealers in kolkata, obviously not all, what product are you looking for, its a big city and you have to hit the proper chord to get the music

 

[malvai]

if this is the reality then you belong to a different league as I am talking on behalf of those who earns a small fraction of yours and can't afford to import all the time, moreover importing stuff from abroad also does not change the situation back home to better

I do not think it is anything to do with being in a different league.

Its about researching and knowing what you want at the correct price and then sourcing it....

I believe that both Stevie and I don't just spend blindly or even have the kind of spending power that this hobby demands.

But yes, we do our research. Then try and look for good deals...

Both Stevie and I bought our TT's that way... at least in my case, i can tell you for sure that I would not have been able to pay 5L MRP on mine. I sourced it for a LOT less...

Same goes for my speakers...

And none of our acquisitions happened in one shot. it was a slow and excruciating process.

In fact the basic point of being on such a forum is knowledge - even on these aspects.
If you look around you'll get there too.

 

[stevieboy]

if this is the reality then you belong to a different league as I am talking on behalf of those who earns a small fraction of yours and can't afford to import all the time, moreover importing stuff from abroad also does not change the situation back home to better

Akd,

If you read my post again you'll realize I have also posted from an Indian view point too of dealers here. I've also done the rounds in my initial days looking for gear. I can understand that you're frustrated where you are regarding availability. My post addresses that cos I think dealers could reach out to guys like you which in my opinion they are not doing now.

Really don't see where earning power comes into the picture Cos when the stuff you want is available only abroad you either save up and order it or do without. No other choice.

regards

 

[akd]

I do not think it is anything to do with being in a different league.

Its about researching and knowing what you want at the correct price and then sourcing it....

I believe that both Stevie and I don't just spend blindly or even have the kind of spending power that this hobby demands.

But yes, we do our research. Then try and look for good deals...

Both Stevie and I bought our TT's that way... at least in my case, i can tell you for sure that I would not have been able to pay 5L MRP on mine. I sourced it for a LOT less...

Same goes for my speakers...

And none of our acquisitions happened in one shot. it was a slow and excruciating process.

In fact the basic point of being on such a forum is knowledge - even on these aspects.
If you look around you'll get there too.

don't get me wrong, by different league I meant disparate buying capability, I am also learning the functionality from the forum everyday, BTW what is the blessing of technological development where one has to spend a fortune for an equipment? TTs are fairly simple mechanical device which runs on rotational dynamics and balance(flywheel), mechanical friction and picking up low level signals, wonder why companies put a staggering price of 5L - are they made up of 24carat gold?

 

[malvai]

don't get me wrong, by different league I meant disparate buying capability, I am also learning the functionality from the forum everyday, BTW what is the blessing of technological development where one has to spend a fortune for an equipment? TTs are fairly simple mechanical device which runs on rotational dynamics and balance(flywheel), mechanical friction and picking up low level signals, wonder why companies put a staggering price of 5L - are they made up of 24carat gold?

It is the materials that they use... for starters, the Clearaudio Ambient that I have is made of Panzehols material... the stuff that people bulletproof vehicles with.

Then there is a cost to researching the different materials until the designer comes up with his/her envisioned results....

all this costs. You will just have to listen to such gear to believe what its capable of.

 

[akd]

Akd,

If you read my post again you'll realize I have also posted from an Indian view point too of dealers here. I've also done the rounds in my initial days looking for gear. I can understand that you're frustrated where you are regarding availability. My post addresses that cos I think dealers could reach out to guys like you which in my opinion they are not doing now.

Really don't see where earning power comes into the picture Cos when the stuff you want is available only abroad you either save up and order it or do without. No other choice.

regards

my sincere apologies if I hurt you, I simply meant our thinking is on different level, if one earns 25Kpm he will buy Debut III not P3-24 which is obvious and thats where earning power comes, why one gets Mcintosh amp quite regulary in US and not in India? its because earning (read buying) power
BTW am not "frustrated" rather bringing to your notice the difficulties away from metros what you may not feel at all
I repeat I hv no intention other than a spirited discussion, all the time all my best wishes for you.

 

[stevieboy]

don't get me wrong, by different league I meant disparate buying capability,

Buddy akd,

Methinks you're jumping to confusions here. Trust me I scrimp and save just like everyone else here. Like Malvai has said, both of us got our TTs second hand. When one has to buy from abroad one has to consider when, what to buy and go through a consider, save buy cycle just like an purchase from India.

regards

 

[akd]

It is the materials that they use... for starters, the Clearaudio Ambient that I have is made of Panzehols material... the stuff that people bulletproof vehicles with.

how better this material is compared to lets say a reasonably built TT of 8-10 Kg weight

Then there is a cost to researching the different materials until the designer comes up with his/her envisioned results....

don't you think same amount of research has gone into developing a Debut III or RP1, they didn't appear all of a sudden and enthrall millions of people w/o a reason

all this costs. You will just have to listen to such gear to believe what its capable of.
will definitely visit your place (obviously if you allow) if comes to Delhi

BTW take it as simple friendly arguments, as I said I really benefit from your posts

 

[stevieboy]

my sincere apologies if I hurt you, I simply meant our thinking is on different level, if one earns 25Kpm he will buy Debut III not P3-24 which is obvious and thats where earning power comes, why one gets Mcintosh amp quite regulary in US and not in India? its because earning (read buying) power
BTW am not "frustrated" rather bringing to your notice the difficulties away from metros what you may not feel at all
I repeat I hv no intention other than a spirited discussion, all the time all my best wishes for you.

No hassles Akd, just wanted to clarify I'm far from what you imagine me to be! Of course I have the advantage of not being married yet or spending money on smoking/drinking Though good food depletes the wallet

Trust me, I quite understand your frustration, rather situation cos I myself had to make a trip to Bombay to get the TT, inspite of Bangalore being bigger/a metro compared to your location. And if you're not frustrated well I used to get that way looking for stuff and dealer reactions/knowledge/availability. So assumed you felt the same way. If one earns 25k pm one can wait what say? I did precisely that, waiting for years to get my amp/speakers/TT rather than buying something I could afford right away

Regards

 

[malvai]

BTW take it as simple friendly arguments, as I said I really benefit from your posts

No offense taken...

but i will say this to you - unless you listen you won't know the difference.

Nothing that I have bought, is ever without listening. If its good, and if i can afford it, I buy!

and yes, you are most welcome to come when in Delhi.

 

[stevieboy]

Akd,

I think the higher one goes in terms of product line, more research is required to create a better sounding product than at the entry level. The differences between competitors lessens and each brand has to struggle more to come up with unique solutions to challenges. Yes, a lot of it is highly overpriced for sure and also pandering to the 'if it costs more it must be better and I must buy it' audience. I'm sure a hell of a lot of products out there could be priced lower and still make decent profits for their maker, but that's another argument sigh.

Regards

 

[Audio Slave]

Guys!

i feel that one can rave, rant on this issue all one wants, but the fact of the matter is that : ONE WILL NEVER HAVE SUCH OUTLETS IN ABUNDANCE.

I say this from purely a business perspective.

The fact is that even showrooms in big cities don't make the kind of money that business projections predict.

look at it from this example:

If I were to put up a showroom with just 2 brands - say B&W + Bryston
just getting their entire range would cost me over 2 Cr (At demo prices).

Then if want even one piece of each gear for sale, I'd need another say 2.5 cr.

Then there are warehousing costs amounting to atleast 50k per month or 6L per year.

Doing up the demo room / showroom would be another 4L.

Then there is rent for the said showroom in a decent place. If you're talking delhi mumbai this will conservatively amount to 75 pm or about 10L per annum.

Plus the staffing cost of (conservatively) Rs 30k pm or about 3.6 L.

Plus electricity and other misc expenses...

Once you add this all up one realises why the showroom charges you more than the MRP abroad.

A thing that is so detested by people here.

It also makes it prohibitive to acquire by the masses.

Hence very few people buy - even in big cities.

Unless, the buying power increases, i doubt that showrooms in smaller cities will ever become a reality. As it is not a realistic business proposition.

malvai

There is no doubt that as a business proposition, selling HI-Fi equipment must be profitable and viable for anyone to invest in it. It is also a question of demand and supply. All over India including smaller cities and towns, you can see plenty of shops selling TV sets, Refrigerators, all in ones and Home Theaters because there is a sizeable demand for these which is not the case for Hi-Fi products (separates). This is to do with public tastes and the affordability factor. This scarcity situation is not likely to change much in the near future or even the next few decades. We in this country do not have the much needed infrastructure such as power supply and good roads what to talk of non-essential goods and services like the Hi-Fi. For Hi-Fi enthusiasts this country is likely to remain a desert for a long long time to come. Particularly so the smaller cities.

So long there is a huge price difference comapred with the international markets combined with low availability and almost zero after sales service, those who travel abroad frequently shall continue to opt for getting the products of there choice form other countries. There is nothing wrong with that. Feelings of patriotism and emotional factors (as some have done here) must not be dragged into the discussion.

 

[Audio Slave]

From many of the comments made here it is quite obvious that these persons have no idea how bad the availability situation is in smaller cities and towns specially if they realize that Hi-Fi products are not meant to be mail-ordered like books or CDs and need to be auditioned first personally.

 

[akd]

malvai

All over India including smaller cities and towns, you can see plenty of shops selling TV sets, Refrigerators, all in ones and Home Theaters because there is a sizeable demand for these which is not the case for Hi-Fi products (separates). This is to do with public tastes and the affordability factor.

taking the cue from here aren't ppl buying HTiB around 20K? they want good sound, ease of operation and endurance, when they go to shops they only see Sony and Philips, don't you think at that range (20K) you can get DENON,ONKYO,POLK HTiB which are if not a big leap ahead but definitely quality products, so if the common audience never get to even hear the names in the shops where they are supposed to be how these equips will ever become popular, selling them from a few fancy showrooms in Metros don't make them worthwhile

 

[akd]

From many of the comments made here it is quite obvious Hi-Fi products are not meant to be mail-ordered like books or CDs and need to be auditioned first personally.

well, if you have options
1.Buy a Wharfedale speaker (around 17K) online without auditioning
2.Wait for a shop to come up which will let you audition them (if those speakers still remain in the market), and you very well know with best optimism its not going to happen for at least 5 years
3.Audition them in the nearby city/metro and bring them with you which will add another 3-4K (lets travel by train) and hassle if carrying big packets of weight over 15 Kg

which one will you pick up? you may chose #3 but you can't claim it to be the best one, can you?

yes, ppl from big cities will never understand unless they go through the same pain
I myself hv struggled with hundreds of records stashed in trolleys and nearly broke my neck a number of times because records are only avbl in metros and if you don't buy from there just forget about it!! I request any of these members to carry 50-60 records for a distance of 1500 Km only once and they will get the music

unfortunately it appeared that I am "frustrated", well if this is how you feel about your fellow friends who is not sitting pretty in a goldmine then its only adds to the pain, no offense taken, I understand only a sufferer can feel the pain of suffering!!

 

[akd]

please read this to have an idea where we actually stand

I want to buy Onkyo HTS 3400 in Guwahati

mailed at [email protected] given in the Onkyo India website ONKYO INDIA, no reply came in 24 hours

contacted over phone at what they have mentioned as "Indian Distributor" in Chennai, then I was given another number in Chennai who can help me more authoritatively, I contacted the person, he was nice and gentle and here is what he has to say

There is no support in Guwahati, if you want to buy you should have an audition with installation demo (you will have to install everything) in Kolkata (contact given), and then carry it with you as your personal belongings, the box dimension and weight are 16.3 x 21.1 x 29.6 inches; 25 Kg

I wonder purchase of a quality product can't be easier than that!!

 

[malvai]

I request any of these members to carry 50-60 records for a distance of 1500 Km only once and they will get the music

unfortunately it appeared that I am "frustrated", well if this is how you feel about your fellow friends who is not sitting pretty in a goldmine then its only adds to the pain, no offense taken, I understand only a sufferer can feel the pain of suffering!!

Buddy, I do this regularly...

I even get friends to do this on a regular basis and I have done the same for my friends.... the last 2 years I have been shuttling between delhi and mumbai and only very recently have stationed myself permanently in delhi.

all my record seller contacts are in mumbai and every time I go back to mumbai, i come back with a haul of 50 -100 LPs!

I understand your pain. despite being a habitant of big cities... and believe me until 10 years ago even we guys were in a similar situation.

so, whatever I or other people have written is NOT devoid of empathy. you can be sure of that.

 

[akd]

Buddy, I do this regularly...
all my record seller contacts are in mumbai and every time I go back to mumbai, i come back with a haul of 50 -100 LPs!

Delhi is also a significant place for records, I know about HFM, not western, now at least you have the access of it. The funny thing is I have never purchased a record where I have lived, every purchase of mine has been associated with a travel and guess what the number of records have shoot up better I don't mention, Oh! abt your record carrying from Mumbai-Delhi, keep it up, I know how much pleasure you will get when you spin them, going to Kolkata first week of July, will definitely bring sizeable amount of LPs which I already have in multiple copies :yahoo:

 

[malvai]

@AKD: Am not much into HFM... all the great classicals and classical based HFM i have already inherited from my father-in-law....!

Don't think I'll be adding on to that, as that in itself is enuff to qell my limted appetite for that genre... about 150 odd LPs...