Amp upgrade if required

[dinyaar]

Hi the feedback that i had got was that the 'grown up' B&W paired with the Arcam A28 was too laid back. Then there was a comment of the digital volume and the lack of supposed drive as the volume was reading 54/55 (max 72) and the sound was far from LOUD. My friend Vikas felt that the amp was operating at 'almost' max power and concluded that its grossly underpowered!!!!!!!!! Incidently the protection on these amps did not kick in even when i took the amp to 65 and it was more than blaringly loud.
I asked my friends jokingly if they had carried a what HIFI during the auditions and had come to identical conclusions. The latter is not a problem at all and to prove it to them, i shot off a mail to Arcam and got a detailed prompt, convincing answer which i forwarded to all.

See Pratim i like a few brands and dont think much of most of the others. Cyrus (as u have guessed) falls in the latter and Arcam definately the former category. I had the A38 which is a bit bigger in output power but these amps are not about power, more a warm yet detailed sound. I also feel an Arcam is the better built Brit amp.
Naturally i would expect the Nad and similar to sound grainy, cloudy compared to a cyrus but to my ears the cyrus has a 'tiny' sweet spot and is difficult to pair with anything other than the easiest loads. In your case it seems its the amplifier that will decide the SPL level rather than u which is a frustration when one is in the mood for a session of moderately loud music.
Naturally the other option of replacing speakers is spot on too. I didnt suggest it as i presume u chose the speakers as u liked the signature and hence suggested an amp change. In theory (and almost always in practice too) a 90/91 db speaker will make ur tiny cyrus play loud with ease and i truly doubt the protection will kick in
Am sorry to hear of the attitude of your vendor. Hope things work out well eventually.
Rgds

 

[pratimbayal]

Yes ,Now ,based upon the feed back of the forum, I am also considering the speaker upgrade. It appears that following speaker would work well

ProAc 140s
Dali Ikon 6
( or any other suggestion ??)

both has a sensitivity of 91 and above. Any one any idea about the combo.
However in any of the cases I have to sell the B&W 685.

Another option is to replace the B&W 685 with 684/683 ( 90 dB) from the same dealer . That might stiil be possible .

 

[psychotropic]

now that you have the amp, and it's a nice small little cyrus.....go around to the dealer, and audition the various speakers with the amp, and see which one goes loud enough without triggering the protection, and sounds good enough for you. If the dealer is co-operative as cranky suggested, then try and wangle a home audition as well.

But offloading your 685s you'll lose a few thousand bucks, even if it is almost new, so be mindful of that when you decide.

Yes ,Now ,based upon the feed back of the forum, I am also considering the speaker upgrade. It appears that following speaker would work well

ProAc 140s
Dali Ikon 6
( or any other suggestion ??)

both has a sensitivity of 91 and above. Any one any idea about the combo.
However in any of the cases I have to sell the B&W 685.

Another option is to replace the B&W 685 with 684/683 ( 90 dB) from the same dealer . That might stiil be possible .

 

[dinyaar]

Yes ,Now ,based upon the feed back of the forum, I am also considering the speaker upgrade. It appears that following speaker would work well

ProAc 140s
Dali Ikon 6
( or any other suggestion ??)

both has a sensitivity of 91 and above. Any one any idea about the combo.
However in any of the cases I have to sell the B&W 685.

Another option is to replace the B&W 685 with 684/683 ( 90 dB) from the same dealer . That might stiil be possible .

One question i have. What made u buy the B&W 685? Am not saying its a bad choice in any way rather i just want to know what appealed to u when u first heard the speaker.
I dont like the 683/684 so i cant suggest them to u. At the price that they sell u can surely get far better speakers;
Dali with your cyrus may be too much activity for my taste but u hear it all the same.
I would go with a Pro ac i guess. Have even liked the BS in the studio range though i cant recall the model No. There are better speakers in Pro Ac too.
See the amp is tiny enough for u to carry along and audition at various dealers so that there is minimal scope of heartburn later.
Why not wait for cranky to come over and check out as someone like him will be in a best position to advice u further.
Rgds

 

[psychotropic]

if that's all that's keeping you from moving the setup to a smaller room. THe cheapest option for you would be to buy a mini compo system from LG or Philips or Sony (for 5 - 10k), and use that for your daughter to dance to, and keep your Cyrus + B&W setup in a smaller room, where you can enjoy your hi fi. Don't compromise on your hi fi listening experience in order to facilitate your daughter's dancing. There are much cheaper options for that

And also a 2.5 year old dancing near speakers on stands sounds slightly dangerous.

To answer Psycotropic - I thought changing the place but believe me that is not possible. My daughter , Two and half year , likes to dance while I play some musial song ( obviously not very loud) in the space availabe . In my small rooms that place is not availabe

 

[pratimbayal]

Hi all

I had a very comfortable sleep last night. My issue has been solved . Cranky again did it for me.

I am changing my speaker and getting BE 718 from Usher audio. Not changing the cyrus- very good for me since I am not loosing the quality of cyrus that at least I had never heard with other amps around the same budget. Once again I repeat that sound quality of Cyrus is excellent.

Yesterday we auditioned Kef IQ 70 at pro fx. This was to test the theory of high sensitivity and low power with limited brands that are available in Kolkata . It did not worked for me . The Cyrus clliped at 11 or 12 0 clock position . However for 90 dB the sound was louder but not abnormal. We tried other model from Kef and Focal but did not yeild the desired result.Lastly Cranky told me to check the Cyrus with his Mini Dancer once again. We did the same. And surprisingly there was no clliping or protection mode at 1 'o clock also. We tried repeatedly and got the same result. At very high volume usual distortion was there but at very high vol and mine is 40 w at the end of the day.


I am getting the BE 718 ( around 140% increase in budget :sad as suggested by Cranky. He also explained the reason behind easy driving Usher BE 718 .I will be selling the B&W 685. Will keep you posted once the repalcement is final

 

[Asit]

I knew something was wrong when we connected a subwoofer and relieved the amp of bass duty. The fact that it was still going into protection mode was worrisome, as this is not an expected result.

Cranky, why do you think the above (i.e., going into protection mode even when used with a sub) happened? I have no idea about subs.

... the BE-718 stays above 6 ohms throughout its range, the Focal Chorus 816 drops to 4.3 at some points (from the JM labs brochure).

This I can understand. I suppose impedance vs freq is something similar for your mini dancers. I worried about the dips of speaker impedance of my Cantons when I was in the process of amp upgrade recently. From the above, we learn that the Cyrus 6 amp cannot cope with loads with low impedance dips. Or do we learn something else or something more?

Regards.

 

[heliumflight]

Pratim by sharing your experiences with us all makes you even more resolute so that others may save their fingers from getting burnt

You are under the guidance/ wisdom of wellwishers and I'm sure you will find the befitting solution.

 

[Bobby]

Hi all

I had a very comfortable sleep last night. My issue has been solved . Cranky again did it for me.

I am changing my speaker and getting BE 718 from Usher audio. Not changing the cyrus- very good for me since I am not loosing the quality of cyrus that at least I had never heard with other amps around the same budget. Once again I repeat that sound quality of Cyrus is excellent.

Yesterday we auditioned Kef IQ 70 at pro fx. This was to test the theory of high sensitivity and low power with limited brands that are available in Kolkata . It did not worked for me . The Cyrus clliped at 11 or 12 0 clock position . However for 90 dB the sound was louder but not abnormal. We tried other model from Kef and Focal but did not yeild the desired result.Lastly Cranky told me to check the Cyrus with his Mini Dancer once again. We did the same. And surprisingly there was no clliping or protection mode at 1 'o clock also. We tried repeatedly and got the same result. At very high volume usual distortion was there but at very high vol and mine is 40 w at the end of the day.


I am getting the BE 718 ( around 140% increase in budget :sad as suggested by Cranky. He also explained the reason behind easy driving Usher BE 718 .I will be selling the B&W 685. Will keep you posted once the repalcement is final

Good going pratimbyal :clapping:
I am having the same Usher be 718 driven by Naim nait 5i which is 50 watts and never clipped even at 2 o clock position, regardless of heavy drums.
i had McCormack DNA 125 too which is 125 watts but liked naim more and living happily with the combo..
I am sure you cant go wrong with Usher even if you are giving 50 watts to it

 

[pratimbayal]

Thanks Bobby

Your feedback gives me more confidence. I am waiting for delivery of BE 718 . Will post the experience

 

[somen24in]

Your feedback gives me more confidence. I am waiting for delivery of BE 718 . Will post the experience

pratim


"confidence"
The man who acquires the ability to take full possession of his own mind may take possession of anything else to which he is justly entitled.
~Andrew Carnegie


SOMEN

we are all waiting for you :clapping:

 

[prasen_b]

For what its worth. I had a chance to listen to the cyrus 6vs model along with Jolida 1501RC paired to Dyn Aud 52. As mentioned the sound with cyrus lacked weight, I am not sure about the detail part since I immediately asked the dealer to switch to the Jolida. After changing the stock tubes in the preamp section of the Jolida it become more detailed with better bass definition.
I don't see many people buying Jolida in india. But I think it is a good option and VFM (around 46K).