bannana plugs.

musicmypassion said:
pavanai shavam ayi... hope you have heard this in a malayalam movie... lol
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bheja_fry06-2.JPG


Translation please :)
 
manu4panjab said:
so if i buy banana plugs from dac company ,i have to reconnect once a week right
please reply
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that is correct, once a week in jalandhar, and twice a week if you live on the coast.

also read the article which follows in the next post
 
rhythm corner said:
Good quality (Gold plated) bananas always help
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to the contrary-

"Contaminant films may also form by galvanic corrosion of the materials in contact. One of the well-known corrosion mechanisms is pore corrosion in gold-plated surfaces. As suggested by its name, this type of corrosion stems from the presence of tiny pores (usually sub-micron in dimensions) in the gold electroplate used as a finish on many connector surfaces. These pores allow access of corrosive environmental contaminants, such as hydrogen sulfide, sulfur dioxide and chlorides, along with moisture, to the nickel underplate or other substrate materials. Synergistic chemical reactions of the contact materials with the contaminants and water lead to the formation of solid corrosion products that creep out of the pores and spread along the contact surfaces. Examples of these corrosion blooms are shown in Figure 6 [4]. A striking example of the formation of copper sulfide corrosion products generated below a gold electroplate is shown in the cross-section of Figure 7 [5]. Pore corrosion blooms of the type illustrated in Figure 6 and give rise to increases in contact resistance of the magnitude illustrated in Figure 5, and cause severe contact degradation."
 
but most banana plugs you see are gold plated, does that mean we must now hunt for ones that are not?

suri said:
to the contrary-

"Contaminant films may also form by galvanic corrosion of the materials in contact. One of the well-known corrosion mechanisms is pore corrosion in gold-plated surfaces. As suggested by its name, this type of corrosion stems from the presence of tiny pores (usually sub-micron in dimensions) in the gold electroplate used as a finish on many connector surfaces. These pores allow access of corrosive environmental contaminants, such as hydrogen sulfide, sulfur dioxide and chlorides, along with moisture, to the nickel underplate or other substrate materials. Synergistic chemical reactions of the contact materials with the contaminants and water lead to the formation of solid corrosion products that creep out of the pores and spread along the contact surfaces. Examples of these corrosion blooms are shown in Figure 6 [4]. A striking example of the formation of copper sulfide corrosion products generated below a gold electroplate is shown in the cross-section of Figure 7 [5]. Pore corrosion blooms of the type illustrated in Figure 6 and give rise to increases in contact resistance of the magnitude illustrated in Figure 5, and cause severe contact degradation."
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psychotropic said:
but most banana plugs you see are gold plated, does that mean we must now hunt for ones that are not?
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i think it means -"buy the most expensive ones" - there are GP bananas which retail for $0.50 a pair, and others that cost $ 50 a pair. i suppose the costlier ones have a method of gold deposition that is nearer perfection (read lack of pores) than the less expensive ones (read S.E. Asian and MX:))
 
bah, i'll stick with bare wire and save the cash :)

suri said:
i think it means -"buy the most expensive ones" - there are GP bananas which retail for $0.50 a pair, and others that cost $ 50 a pair. i suppose the costlier ones have a method of gold deposition that is nearer perfection (read lack of pores) than the less expensive ones (read S.E. Asian and MX:))
Click to expand...
 
suri said:
i think it means -"buy the most expensive ones" - there are GP bananas which retail for $0.50 a pair, and others that cost $ 50 a pair. i suppose the costlier ones have a method of gold deposition that is nearer perfection (read lack of pores) than the less expensive ones (read S.E. Asian and MX:))
Click to expand...

Great informative posts on this thread!! I can just picture one day - the story of the hopeless audiophile addict melting his wife's jewelery to make pure gold banana plugs :lol:

Cheers
 
I could not digest all the macroscopic mumbo-jumbo about contact points and corrosion completely ... What about pure copper spades that are not plated? If I silver solder the wire to them ...? Please spare a thought for them .... :)

Edit: I mean will a-spots get degraded if corrosion and inferior quality plating is absent? Oxidation can be fixed with brasso periodically right?

TIA
 
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gobble said:
I could not digest all the macroscopic mumbo-jumbo about contact points and corrosion completely ... What about pure copper spades that are not plated? If I silver solder the wire to them ...? Please spare a thought for them .... :)

Edit: I mean will a-spots get degraded if corrosion and inferior quality plating is absent? Oxidation can be fixed with brasso periodically right?

TIA
Click to expand...

pure copper may not be a viable option, because copper (whether OFC or not) will oxidize readily when in contact with atmospheric air; of the resultant two oxides of copper, one is a semiconductor and the other is a conductor.

degradation of contact will occur readily unless the joint is gas-tight (not easily achievable). therefore painful cleaning chores will result if copper is used as such.

that is why connectors are gold plated, (gold does not oxidise, and the oxide of silver is as good a conductor as silver itself), and if connectors are to be used they should have the highest quality gold-plating. the gold-plating should be multi-layer so as to minimise the chance of pores aligning themselves and exposing the plated substrate to atmospheric gases and impurities.

this is the reason WBT connectors command a premium, and here I quote from a cable manufacturer's site-

"We use Canare, Liberty and other superior Pro level speaker cable, which is one of the best in the industry. These are the same cables used by many recording studios and if they are good enough for them, well, let's say no more... Canare cable is a quad design and can be joined together for a 11 gauge equivalent cable or used as a bi-wire on one end. The Ram difference is how we manufacture the assemblies. The single weakest point in the speaker connection is where the wire connects to the amplifier and speaker.
Over time the copper oxidizes and resistance increases.
Connecting bare copper directly to the binding post can break strands and decrease wire capacity.

Our cables eliminate all of the above. We terminate all speaker cables with WBT gold plated copper crimp ferrules. Why? Properly crimped ferrule are gas-tight and gold does not oxidize. Since, we are a complete wire and harness manufacturer and we know how to terminate. Look at our ferrule terminations and you will see the difference. You now have a solid surface to put a gold plated banana or other connector allowing you to tighten the setscrews, without braking strands. Our banana plugs and spades are gold or silver plated copper. The WBT connectors are the best in the industry. If you want to save a few dollars check out the Viablue or our house banana connectors. Complete assembly are available in any length you need. Most assemblies ship 24 hours after you order. There is no snake oil in our cables."

Or, as psychotropic suggested, "Hang this shit, I will save the cash and use bare unterminated wire"

By the way, brasso is not recommended for cleaning electrical contacts.

what is recommended is the use of iso-propyl alcohol and non abrasive cleaning cloth. if iso-propyl alcohol is not available, 100% methyl alcohol may be used. (methyl alcohol is available with Laboratory suppliers).

And no, Old Spice and Brut should not be used!:)
 
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What about silver solder the wire endings and use without any plugs?

gobble said:
I could not digest all the macroscopic mumbo-jumbo about contact points and corrosion completely ... What about pure copper spades that are not plated? If I silver solder the wire to them ...? Please spare a thought for them .... :)

Edit: I mean will a-spots get degraded if corrosion and inferior quality plating is absent? Oxidation can be fixed with brasso periodically right?

TIA
Click to expand...
 
cranky said:
Spades do *not* need tightening. Both spades and ring connectors are extensively used in high power electrical transmission systems, that need many times the capacity and reliability of a consumer audio system.

If you have had to tighten spades often personally, you have either not done it properly the first time, or (more likely) your binding post does not have the capability of gripping spades with sufficient tension. Spades when properly secured are a lifetime connection. Using spades is illegal in many countries because it's very difficult to properly insulate, and the EU forbids use of any exposed electrical connection, regardless of voltage or current.

Are you suggesting that we put machine oil or other liquids on our wire ends before securing on to a post? And you really believe that advice is safe and effective? Liquids conduct much less efficiently than metal, as you probably know. I am sure you are enjoying your system with any method you may choose to, but I'm not sure it is advice that should be passed around.

Have a nice day :)
Click to expand...
Hi cranky, the cable expert Van Den Hul recommends his own product "Solution"(by thin coating for the metal contact treatment&protection for audio video interconnects&for speaker cable)and I am using the same oil and my system sounds nothing wrong.You may check his article in Van den Hul: New Products. regarding the treatment for cable &connectors. But we should never use grease,vaseline like lubes. Since the 'Solution' is much expensive (30 ml. Rs.1800/),we can apply a thin, water like viscosity of 3 in 1 oil , as film coated.
regards.
 
cranky said:
Bare wire oxidises and loses contact, and poor quality bananas work loose with time. Use single piece bananas (not the ones with the leaf spring contacts on the end) or an expanding type for best long-term fit. Spades offer the best electrical connection and are totally gas-tight, I would use them where long-term stability is a concern. Speaker pins also work very well when used in the slot where bare wire would go.

Crimped connections are better than solder, but normally speaker cables have a large number of very thin strands so crimping may damage the wire and cause loose contact over time. I just prefer solder.

Bare wire should be used only when there is no option of using bananas (solid center posts) and quality spades are not available. Be sure to tighten connections once a few months, and clean off the the wire ends when doing this.

This is not about sound quality (not directly) you are looking at a connection that is airtight and stays locked down. If you don't plan to move your speakers around or change connections very often, bare wire will work fine as long as your binding post ensures it does not work loose. Most posts I've seen require retightening, and oxidise the wire even at the contact point (=not gas-tight).
Click to expand...

having researched this topic thoroughly over the past few days, the consensus (pardon me, if i take this liberty to speak) is this post (cranky's) above.

Trust me, i have read reams and reams of digital material (!), and the way to go is outlined above
 
sunder said:
Hi cranky, the cable expert Van Den Hul recommends his own product "Solution"(by thin coating for the metal contact treatment&protection for audio video interconnects&for speaker cable)and I am using the same oil and my system sounds nothing wrong.You may check his article in Van den Hul: New Products. regarding the treatment for cable &connectors. But we should never use grease,vaseline like lubes. Since the 'Solution' is much expensive (30 ml. Rs.1800/),we can apply a thin, water like viscosity of 3 in 1 oil , as film coated.
regards.
Click to expand...


I have been using isopropyl alcohol to clean all binding posts and plugs every year during Ayudha Puja day. It has kept thing clean and tidy fo r > 10 yrs. I dont want to belittle VDH and its solution offering but there are cheaper alternatives.
 
marsilians said:
I have been using isopropyl alcohol to clean all binding posts and plugs every year during Ayudha Puja day. It has kept thing clean and tidy fo r > 10 yrs.
Click to expand...

Now, i do not know why this did not occur to me. an elegant solution and easy to remember!

i have been keeping my work tools and books for ayudha puja, but cleaning contacts........... very good idea:)
 
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