DAC around INR 100k

[malvai]

Hi Ranjeet,

I am mostly an analogue (vinyl) kind of guy. I have not really liked 90% of the DACs that I have heard.

I really liked the DCS Scarlatti (who doesn't), but I definitely am not the kind of guy who'd spend that kind of money on a digital component at the moment... what with the tech incrementally bettered every year and also getting cheaper too...

My idea, a couple of months ago was similar to yours. A DAC that costs about a lakh INR and also sounds good enough against my analogue set up.

After listening to a fair amount of DACs including the AP Thyaga DAC, Lampizator, Weiss (minerva, I think), and W4S DAC 2, Berkley DAC1, I decided on the W4S DAC2.

The AP Thyaga was nice, but rawish in comparison to the W4S DAC2. But the Thayaga and DAC2 were good options. Both in terms of the pricing as well as sound. The DAC2 won over because of its pure sonics. Amazingly dynamic, transparent, and very extended on all FQ ranges.

The soundstaging is amazing too.

Another thing is that it is designed by an ace exmodder. Hence its design incorporates a provision for upgrading as the tech changes/ goes up the ladder.

Plus this was the only DAC that sounded as analogue as possible in the 1L range. The DAC that betters it (marginally) is the Playback Designs PD 5. But at over 6L, it really is not real value for money in my books.

I will be getting the W4S DAC 2 on the Delhi Audiophile Meet in Jan and you can sample it there. Or you can come over home on any Sunday to hear it in a more real listening room environment.

 

[ranjeetrain]

Hi Manav,

Good to have your vote for W4S. It is a generally very well spoken about DAC and I am not surprised you liked it. I look forward to get the first taste of it in audiophile meet. Though that would be more like a teaser. Can't really do any critical listening in a meet. Thanks for the invitation. Listening to in a real listening environment would be wonderful.

What model was the Weiss? Are you able to recall? And its price? Was it in India?

I am also keeping in mind Ayre QB-9. It only does one thing but that's the most important thing I am looking for. So if I am satisfied with QB-9, that may win it. Best part is - it is available in India (though no idea of pricing). If you auditioned the Ayre, please share your experience!

 

[ranjeetrain]

You could look at DAC's by AudioNote
Audio Note Home Page

Any specific model suggestion?

 

[CryptBala]

Guys your opinion on cambridge dac ?

 

[odyssey]

Thad
there are other factors one should consider IMO, what you mentioned is among the last (except for RIAA) for me. The RIAA can be used for playback, not necessarily for conversion to digital. The Lyra comes in two version, Lyra 1 and Lyra 2. Lyra 1 does not have coax-in which may be a deal breaker to some. Lyra 1 (not sure about 2) has only 1 set of outputs, so biamping is not possible (if this is a consideration). Biamping with an external crossover can do wonders to the overall sound. The extra difference of even say Rs 5 la spent on a much better DAC will still pale in comparison to the benefits achieved by correction or biamping. Unfortunately, a lot of audiophiles dont consider these paths

cheers

The Lyra is USB: The Orpheus is Firewire.

The Lyra incorporates quite a lot of functionality for studio use: The Orpheus has more (Oh, and RIAA!).

Whilst it is true that reading about them is not the same as hearing them, if Prism are to be believed, the Orpheus is not going to give a much better sound than the Lyra, eitheer DAC or ADC. They say, about the Lyra...


I feel that, the decision between Lyra and Orpheus (finance allowing), in reality, comes down to this: How much do we want to play "Studio?"

In the past, I have wanted to play studios so much that I even have a [very small] mixer. OK, so, at one time I even plugged a mic or two into it but I have never done anything that could not, technically, be done with an on-board sound card --- I just had more knobs to twiddle to achieve it. The mixer now acts as an over-the top switch between tape and TT input to my sound card, and my three (gadget freak? Guilty!) microphones sit in the cupboard.

Am I over this, despite the fact that I never do anything more "studio" than digitising an LP? No way! give me the budget, and I'd spend it with Prism, or RME. Although I now have to ask the dreaded question does it work with Linux? I have not at all lost my fascination for this sort of kit or my belief that the semi-pro/pro suppliers can be expected to give us equipment with transparent sound.

However, I have got sensible enough to realise that all those wonderful ports for mics and instruments and ...stuff are, unused, just entry points for dust, and wasted resource so far as our capital spend is concerned. The ideal for me, is something that just does 2-in/2-out stereo sound, in and out both analogue and digital. A headphone socket is nice. I don't mind if it has midi (who knows, one day I might plug in a keyboard), but I am never going to output multiple digital channels to a digital recording machine, and I'm not likely to plug in mics (and hey, I've got a mixer I can plug them into). This (Echo Audiofire2, now discontinued) currently does that for me, at a fraction of the price, and, doubtless, not quite the same quality, as the stuff we are talking about here.

So, according to me (based on browsing, not listening) the Lyra is overkill, but I'd still love to gaze at one on my desk; the Orpheus, until one has band members to invite round, is over-the-top overkill.

 

[ranjeetrain]

Guys your opinion on cambridge dac ?

It's a good DAC for what it costs. It sets a benchmark for connectivity options at that price point. If you are looking for a DAC around that price, it's a no brainer. A bang for kinda stuff.

 

[malvai]

I agree with Ranjeet... but.... BUT... the RDAC from Arcam is a wee bit better. Its USB has a better implementation.

However, the el cheapo DAC that comes very close in performance to the Benchmark DAC 1 is an Asus... forgetting the exact name... its quite good!

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

Thad
there are other factors one should consider IMO, what you mentioned is among the last (except for RIAA) for me. The RIAA can be used for playback, not necessarily for conversion to digital. The Lyra comes in two version, Lyra 1 and Lyra 2. Lyra 1 does not have coax-in which may be a deal breaker to some. Lyra 1 (not sure about 2) has only 1 set of outputs, so biamping is not possible (if this is a consideration). Biamping with an external crossover can do wonders to the overall sound. The extra difference of even say Rs 5 la spent on a much better DAC will still pale in comparison to the benefits achieved by correction or biamping. Unfortunately, a lot of audiophiles dont consider these paths

cheers

Errr... do we have prices for the Lyra?

The Orpheus (a quick google tells me) is over three thousand UK pounds. Even one lakh, specified, is quite a budget for a DAC. There may be imaginative hifi uses for some of those ins and outs, but isn't it getting a leeeeetle bit expensive here? Especially throwing in two power amplifiers for the biamping. I'm drooling over the Lyra: I think you're getting just a touch too overexcited! :lol:

But ifRanjeetrain's wallet really is that thick, and he's fed up with the weight in his pocket, well, fine! :licklips::licklips:

 

[alphacentury100]

I agree with Ranjeet... but.... BUT... the RDAC from Arcam is a wee bit better. Its USB has a better implementation.

However, the el cheapo DAC that comes very close in performance to the Benchmark DAC 1 is an Asus... forgetting the exact name... its quite good!

Is this the DAC you were talking about "Asus Xonar ESSENCE ONE"
"http://www.deltapage.com/products/Asus-Sound-Card-Xonar%252dESSENCE-ONE.html "

 

[denom]

Heard the Asus Essence 1 quite extensively during the pune meet, did not find any thing that great about it
The Beresford Caiman Gatorised still bettered its performance :indifferent14:

 

[malvai]

Denom, I personally don't believe my own ears about stuff heard at a 'meet'. That's no way to judge stuff.

It's a great way to get a basic flavour at best. At least that's what I have found for meself.

 

[malvai]

And oh! I was comparing the essence 1 to a dacmagic/rcam level DAC.

 

[denom]

Denom, I personally don't believe my own ears about stuff heard at a 'meet'. That's no way to judge stuff.

It's a great way to get a basic flavour at best. At least that's what I have found for meself.

And oh! I was comparing the essence 1 to a dacmagic/rcam level DAC.

Yea bro, I agree, but leave it also to one's own perception, if 1 has a gut feel that is strong enough. I gave my point of view, yours of course may vary. BTW, I was in the 'thick' of things during the meet & I stand by my opinion, period!
PS: I'd not go for the the other 2 you've mentioned either
My 100 Rs. :indifferent14:

 

[ranjeetrain]

I agree with Ranjeet... but.... BUT... the RDAC from Arcam is a wee bit better. Its USB has a better implementation.

Agree! Arcam rDac is better for sure. Another good contender in that price bracket -- Rega DAC. Rega hardly ever makes a bad equipment

Errr... do we have prices for the Lyra?

The Orpheus (a quick google tells me) is over three thousand UK pounds. Even one lakh, specified, is quite a budget for a DAC. There may be imaginative hifi uses for some of those ins and outs, but isn't it getting a leeeeetle bit expensive here? Especially throwing in two power amplifiers for the biamping. I'm drooling over the Lyra: I think you're getting just a touch too overexcited! :lol:

But ifRanjeetrain's wallet really is that thick, and he's fed up with the weight in his pocket, well, fine! :licklips::licklips:

Hehehh touch!!

I was talking to Prem in the other thread. I don't think any "serious" DAC is going to fit inside my estimated 100k. Jesus, music playback has become so expensive

 

[ranjeetrain]

My 100 Rs. :indifferent14:

That's a 5000% inflation from conventional "my two paise" :lol:

 

[ranjeetrain]

Thad
there are other factors one should consider IMO, what you mentioned is among the last (except for RIAA) for me. The RIAA can be used for playback, not necessarily for conversion to digital. The Lyra comes in two version, Lyra 1 and Lyra 2. Lyra 1 does not have coax-in which may be a deal breaker to some. Lyra 1 (not sure about 2) has only 1 set of outputs, so biamping is not possible (if this is a consideration). Biamping with an external crossover can do wonders to the overall sound. The extra difference of even say Rs 5 la spent on a much better DAC will still pale in comparison to the benefits achieved by correction or biamping. Unfortunately, a lot of audiophiles dont consider these paths

cheers

Biamping is totally dependent on the speaker and it's crossover design. Some manufacturers (such as Tannoy) encourage bi-amping, whereas others (such as Thiel) completely do away from. It's more of a trial and error on a case-by-case I suppose (assuming the speakers are designed for bi/multi amping).

 

[arj]

I would second the metrum products.. The octave will fall into your budget including shipping while the hex is close to 1.5l without the duty..

The AP thiyaga is also a great option. Just heard it last week at sivas house and the amount of detail it was able to bring out on HD content was really great. I may consider selling my reimyo and go for that In the future..


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

...I don't think any "serious" DAC is going to fit inside my estimated 100k. Jesus, music playback has become so expensive

The ODAC. You can buy five or six

It might have got mentioned before, but for your need of varied inputs ruling out a USB-only DAC.

But... just where is the diminishing-returns point in this pricing? I think it comes in fairly low in the scale. One of Ethan Winer's interesting demos is a comparison of a basic soundcard with a fancy piece of studio kit, and the basic soundcard performed a lot better than any of us might expect. Sure, that doesn't mean that all the studios will be buying soundblasters from now on, but with stuff like the Prism kit one is paying for so much more than a DAC.

 

[ranjeetrain]

Value and Point of diminishing returns. These are so subjective, and so personal. I am aghast thinking about those.

I had thought USD 2000 will represent a good point for diminishing return for me. Let's see how does it go. What do I end-up with.

My current shortlist is:

• Prism DA-2/Lyra-2/Lyra-1
• Metrum Octave/Quad/Hex
• Wyred4Sound DAC2
• Ayre QB-9
• PS Audio PerfectWave
• Wadia 121

Next few weeks/months will go in auditioning as many of them as possible.

 

[ranjeetrain]

I would second the metrum products.. The octave will fall into your budget including shipping while the hex is close to 1.5l without the duty..

The AP thiyaga is also a great option. Just heard it last week at sivas house and the amount of detail it was able to bring out on HD content was really great. I may consider selling my reimyo and go for that In the future..


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Octave surely represents a sweet spot for me. Unfortunately, it will be a completely blind buy. And somehow I am falling short of taking that step, though it does seem to be a well sorted DAC.