emotiva?? Audiophile ?? really??

[aminder]

@kapvin

The Emotiva Lounge - Will the new XMC be made by Tonwinner?

p.s. : lonnie is the admin of the emotiva forums , who clearly said yes umc and xmc are both made by tonewinner

 

[aminder]

i have a friend who has links with tonewinner and a group of guys are already in talks with tone winner for selling tonewinner in india by the 1st quater of 2011

 

[anm]

Oh so this is THAT marketing campaign on this forum!

i have a friend who has links with tonewinner and a group of guys are already in talks with tone winner for selling tonewinner in india by the 1st quater of 2011

 

[kapvin]

@kapvin

The Emotiva Lounge - Will the new XMC be made by Tonwinner?

p.s. : lonnie is the admin of the emotiva forums , who clearly said yes umc and xmc are both made by tonewinner

Guys, help me here...

is it just me who seeing heavy sarcasm in the linked post.. or have I missed the "Truth hiding in plain sight".

aminder .. afiak, if you read the entire link you may see that there is rather heavy irony in the posts that follow.

i have a friend who has links with tonewinner and a group of guys are already in talks with tone winner for selling tonewinner in india by the 1st quater of 2011

Is this why the thread was started?

Shameful!!

 

[esanthosh]

is it just me who seeing heavy sarcasm in the linked post.. or have I missed the "Truth hiding in plain sight".

Is this why the thread was started?

Shameful!!

+1 to both.

 

[aminder]

@anm there are people who have been selling tonewinner products under their brandnames in india and i am not here to promote any kind of brands i started this blog just to let everybody know that emotiva / sherbourn etc etc are repackaged products my question in this blog was what is the real worth of these and any other repackaged products thats all i wanted to ask
and to my knowledge the umc 1 is still a controversial product both hardware and software wise and its all over the internet and the emo forums
and this was the reason i started this topic

 

[venkatcr]

i started this blog just to let everybody know that emotiva / sherbourn etc etc are repackaged products my question in this blog was what is the real worth of these and any other repackaged products thats all i wanted to ask and to my knowledge the umc 1 is still a controversial product both hardware and software wise and its all over the internet and the emo forums and this was the reason i started this topic

Please read A Visit to Emotiva Audio in Franklin, Tennessee and you will understand that the game is other way around.

Cheers

 

[subhash]

i have a friend who has links with tonewinner and a group of guys are already in talks with tone winner for selling tonewinner in india by the 1st quater of 2011

i guessed this coming . This thread had to be of some benifit for the op
there are plenty of used avr's on the used mrkt at throw away prices u cud rebadge them too ,cud be of some profit !

 

[psychotropic]

this guy is a troll. Mods, please lock this thread.

 

[Theresa]

I am a big fan of India and beginning to be a fan of Emotiva. Why is manufacture in China so bad? Would India also be bad? I find almost all perfectionist equipment to be way to expensive and cannot afford it. When I was growing up the same things were said about Japanese manufacture and then Korean. I think its a form of xenophobia, fear of the different, that fuels so much hate in the world. Keep up the great discussions and I will try to lay low as a foreigner.

 

[psychotropic]

Hello Theresa, welcome to hifivision. You're right about the perceptions about manufacturing offshore. There are a couple of things here.

(a) people confuse the quality of things that are contract manufactured offshore with the quality of domestic products that may come from that country. So while China produces a lot of homegrown low-quality junk to cater to a particular type of customer, people immediately (and rather stupidly) draw a link between the quality standards there and the quality standards of the components that are contract-manufactured under strict QC norms.

(b) the second problem is a problem with contract-manufacturing itself. A contract manufacturer whether in China, India or the Dominican Republic will not have the same level of commitment to the product as an in-house factory. It is obvious that if you have your factory in your own premises, it is feasible to exercise a greater level of scrutiny and control over quality, and therefore there is sometimes a very slight deficiency in quality in contract-manufactured products. This is once again blamed on the country of origin and not on the system.

Human beings are simple creatures and like simple explanations even if they don't stand up to much scrutiny. And blaming it on another country/community is as simple as it gets.

 

[malvai]

Hi Theresa,
while I whole heartedly agree with Psychotropic above, I have a only one thing thought that differs...

A re-badged product in China is after all just a re-badge... Whether it is good or bad becomes secondary to me. Because, the company in question has not designed it. For me, I buy the design philosophy as much as I buy the product. It like, in fashion terms, buying a dress off the rack and buying a designer's line.

When one buys a designed product one is sure of getting what the designer promised. In Emotiva's case one is buying the foibles of a very moody mass production line in China.

At first, in the 50s, Japan was like that, but they quickly caught on and really started designing innovations and also started looking into quality. By the mid-70's they not only caught on but were sometimes even better than the countries who were considered at the cutting edge - US, UK & Germany.

Then throughout the 80s, 'Made In Taiwan' was a label any discerning buyer would shun... But today, nobody smirks at reading that.

The last 15 years, China has taken on this 'beginner' mantle. The products manufactured there are unbeatable in price. But, quality is a far cry - yet.

But, if I read the trends right, and also, to be fair, the chinese are catching on. Hoepfully, we'll see some real, original engineering from them soon. Till then they are cheap imitators.

The Koreans, are the next in line to the Chinese...

I hope you get the picture.

 

[venkatcr]

I don't think it is that simple to compare Taiwan, Japan, and China. There are huge cultural differences as well as political hegemony.

The issue with a Chinese factory is that they take an order for, say, 500,000 pieces, and actually manufacture 750,000 pieces. The additional 250,000 pieces get sold under a fictitious brand name. The issue is that when you don't care about the quality of the 1/3rd of your production, the same quality issues creep into the whole production. As you grow bigger, you start feeling that the buyer is under your control, and you start taking shortcuts. Then you feel what is the big deal about the design? I can do it myself. That is when you start making mistakes.

The other issue is called 'quality fade'. In the initial stages, you quote low prices to stay competitive. Then when you start production, you slowly start cutting corners to improve your margins.

Then of course, you move into using poisonous materials in your production to further cut costs.

As a buyer, US and European companies get carried away by the low prices you get. I also think that US and European look at Chinese manufacture from their own cultural perspective which is incorrect. With Chinese manufacture. you cannot do random quality control. Every unit has to be checked. And that increases costs. I have seen Chinese shop keepers in Singapore switching products after the billing has been completed and payment taken.

Quality and design capabilities are ingrained in the Japanese culture. Actually quality is an obsession with them. In Taiwan, we have seen a few companies reach global position by being ahead of the whole world in design and quality. Today, you would not hesitate to buy an Asus or Gigabyte product.

Can we say the same of any Chinese product?

Cheers

 

[psychotropic]

venkat, all these countries go through the same evolutionary cycle. There was a time when Japanese goods were of the same rubbish quality that some of the Chinese goods these days are. And let me tell you that Indian contract manufacturers are as bad if not worse than their Chinese counterparts. So this is certainly not a Chinese problem alone.

Chinese products - Lenovo, Huawei, ZTE are all well regarded names in their respective fields. It's only a matter of time before more names join this list.

 

[KonfuSed]

Chinese products - Lenovo, Huawei, ZTE are all well regarded names in their respective fields. It's only a matter of time before more names join this list.

OT: Lesser said about Huawei is better :lol::lol:

 

[psychotropic]

Huawei and ZTE make the USB modems that most of us use with our laptops while on the move. I don't recall anyone having any issues with them. I do appreciate that Huawei doesnt' quite over-engineer their products like an Ericsson or a Nokia-Siemens, but along with the kind of support that they offer, they present an excellent value proposition to telecom operators and it's no wonder they're the 2nd biggest player in the global market right now.

 

[santhosh]

Interesting posts pyscho and venkatcr....very informative. But I think what Teresa is trying to point out is with attitude like the one shown by a stall at the recent Rocky Mountain Audio Fest:

OT: Lesser said about Huawei is better :lol::lol:

You work for Huawei don't you? :clapping:

 

[sud98]

You work for Huawei don't you? :clapping:

Konfused will kill you for that

 

[iaudio]

santhosh, I saw that too, quite insulting!

 

[captrajesh]

santhosh, I saw that too, quite insulting!

Why do you say that? Going by all the controversies surrounding Chinese products, from toys to milk powder, that label is quite justified.