HDD Based Player

[illusion]

Thanks for the additional inputs. I have 160 GB Seagate (SATA). Actually I don't want to disturb my existing system. I will assemble a dedicated HTPC using your inputs and other info given. Regarding Windows Vista HP installation - where can I get? I have Vista Ultimate edition which Iam not installed due to less system config.

Why do U need HP ( Home Premium ) when you already have Ultimate !! However Ultimate is a real resource hogger and you were right for not installing it . You will be needing atleast core 2 duo 2.4 ghz + 3 gb ram + Ati/Nivida Card to support just the OS . Please go in for a dual install of Win Vista and Windows XP(64bit) like I have done on my Dell XPS if you want to play high end games. XP 64 bit utilizes my 4gb ram to the fullest and The jump in fps is phenomenal !!

 

[eummagic]

Why do U need HP ( Home Premium ) when you already have Ultimate !! However Ultimate is a real resource hogger and you were right for not installing it . You will be needing atleast core 2 duo 2.4 ghz + 3 gb ram + Ati/Nivida Card to support just the OS . Please go in for a dual install of Win Vista and Windows XP(64bit) like I have done on my Dell XPS if you want to play high end games. XP 64 bit utilizes my 4gb ram to the fullest and The jump in fps is phenomenal !!

Thanks! Games was been a passion before but now mind has changed. So, will build system based upon full hd playback compatibility. Also, I find in some sites saying that ATI based cards perform better than nVidia particularly in full hd playback. Also, the thread you provided also have mentioned integrated ATI graphics in motherboard with HDMI slot in the recommended part lists. Does IGP provide smooth movie playback or should I go dedicated PCI Xpress card. Which is better ATI or Nvidia in full hd playback?

I know in games nvidia does perform better but pls advise. Regarding CPU does AMD based system can perform on par with Intel in full hd playback.

Sorry for too many questions...

 

[illusion]

Thanks! Games was been a passion before but now mind has changed. So, will build system based upon full hd playback compatibility. Also, I find in some sites saying that ATI based cards perform better than nVidia particularly in full hd playback. Also, the thread you provided also have mentioned integrated ATI graphics in motherboard with HDMI slot in the recommended part lists. Does IGP provide smooth movie playback or should I go dedicated PCI Xpress card. Which is better ATI or Nvidia in full hd playback?

I know in games nvidia does perform better but pls advise. Regarding CPU does AMD based system can perform on par with Intel in full hd playback.

Sorry for too many questions...

For HD playback , indeed ATI is better cause cards like HD 2600 have UVD or Unified Video Decoder inbuilt. The entire processing of HD files is done by the card itself which result in extremely low load on cpu. As a result the cpu is relatively free (Load averages around 10% -17 % during playback) and the HTPC runs cooler . You can also safely go for a passively cooled card as you will not be overclocking the card which many gamers do to extract the most out of the card. So I highly recommend ATI. As you correctly mentioned Nivida has an edge over rival ATI in gaming especially when the AA feature is enabled.


As far as playback is concerned , if you want an amd processor, you may have to go for an equivalent of core 2 duo 2.4 ghz and you will be fine. AMD processors are very powerful and have been recommended in many HTPC forums for their performance and cheaper price as compared to Intel. Hope this helps.


EDIT : Here is one comparison between ATI and Nvidia which I think will be really helpful for you :-

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2007/08/14/radeon_hd_2600_xt_vs_geforce_8600_gt/14

A quote from the site :-

'It's clear that AMD's Unified Video Decoder is doing its job here, as it requires much less CPU load than the other graphics cards in both HD DVD and Blu-ray Disc playback. Nvidia's second generation video processor is also working well in h.264, as it's supposed to, and there's a small performance improvement over the older video processor on Nvidia's GeForce 7900 GS. That said, during our 1080p VC-1 playback test, the GeForce 8600 GT uses more'

 

[eummagic]

................bit-tech.net | Review - Radeon HD 2600 XT vs. GeForce 8600 GT

A quote from the site :-

'It's clear that AMD's Unified Video Decoder is doing its job here, as it requires much less CPU load than the other graphics cards in both HD DVD and Blu-ray Disc playback. Nvidia's second generation video processor is also working well in h.264, as it's supposed to, and there's a small performance improvement over the older video processor on Nvidia's GeForce 7900 GS. That said, during our 1080p VC-1 playback test, the GeForce 8600 GT uses more'

Thanks! for the additional info. I would stick with ATI based GPU. Will soon let you know my config so that you can add value.

 

[zoony]

Re: HDD Based Player :WD TV? HDMI 1080P

Check out the Western Digital Media Adapter. Its a steal at 100$ US.
Check the below mention link:

WD TV HD Media Player ( WDAVN00 )

Lets hope its available in India soon.

 

[eummagic]

Re: HDD Based Player :WD TV? HDMI 1080P

Check out the Western Digital Media Adapter. Its a steal at 100$ US.
Check the below mention link:

WD TV HD Media Player ( WDAVN00 )

Lets hope its available in India soon.

Thanks for the info. I find Popcorn Hour A-110 having support for more vast number of file formats including True HD for Dolby/DTS and connectivity through LAN. You can go through the link below for additional info.
Welcome To Popcorn Hour

 

[illusion]

Re: HDD Based Player :WD TV? HDMI 1080P

Check out the Western Digital Media Adapter. Its a steal at 100$ US.
Check the below mention link:

WD TV HD Media Player ( WDAVN00 )

Lets hope its available in India soon.

Interesting Product , especially the fact that it can play mkv files !!

 

[Kapz]

These are interesting products. Lacie has also come out with "LaCinema". I do not know if it is capable of churning out mkv or h.264. What I feel is that delay in mass production and hence reduction in prices of BD players is making a number of companies to bring out chip based players, giving users the option to play content from multiple hard drives. Serious competition for BD market I say.

 

[tarshah]

There is this new HDD media player called normus movie cube, launched by a company called kei in India, i think the product is more than fab on the spec sheet, i think it does what the Dvico does plus its got wifi and internet radio and some other stuff. Review by many dealers is that the picture quality is a notch better than the Dvico and some other brands. Looks too are a notch sleeker than Dvico. Has anybody else here heard of this, their site is Welcome to Normus World

 

[tarshah]

check out Welcome to Normus World i hear that its available in india now. It beats the dvico hands down, what i know of it does what the dvico does plus its got wifi and internet radio and something called NAS dunno what that is, but the product looks sweet.

 

[suprateep]

check out Welcome to Normus World i hear that its available in india now. It beats the dvico hands down, what i know of it does what the dvico does plus its got wifi and internet radio and something called NAS dunno what that is, but the product looks sweet.

1. Yes Normus is a new entrant in the Indian market - launched 1-2 months back.
2. On what grounds do you suggest it beats the Dvico (6500 A for ref. here) :

• picture quality
• Audio quality
• Overall Experience
• VFM

Well no where it mentions that it has HMDI 1.3a specifications (the NTS 7500 mentions HDMI 1.1 - that means DTS - True HD audio passthrough HMDI is not allowed nor is high colour)
Audio : FLAC is not supported as of now
Overall experience: It does not have sufficient following like the Popcorn hour A110, Elektron 606, Dvico 6500/7000 or even the dragon tech 100HD (a very new entrant - a clone of the A110 + better specs).
VFM: We dont know the price yet

In india after shipping
the popcorn cor A110 should be around 15-16k (including 3k as customs)
Ditto for the dragon tech 100HD
Dvico 6500 should be around 23-24k, available in India for 26-28k from distributor.

NAS : Network array storage: Its nothing but a terminology that all (TVCIO it requires a lil more effort) network media tanks/players use to connect to other computers/servers/devices in a paritcular network using wifi or normal lan. All of then can connect to the net, view pictures/videos from youtube, picasa etc, watch free services like saya tv. Some of them can add on a digital tuner/receiver and function as a full function dvr.

So on what grounds do you claim that Normus is good - while all of the above i mentioned are manufactured in China as well all of them are decently built and have a great fan following. And though the dvico 6500 is expensive it is very versatile and i have seen the DVICO in action - its good. Though i am yet to see a popcorn hour in action.

PS: Next time you make a statement like this do weigh in the factors that made you make a tall claim such as this.

 

[suprateep]

i hope you take it in a good vein tarshah - i have been planning to buy a HDD based player for the last 2 weeks and have studied extensively on this subject ans also spoken to a couple of people in this regard. Finally i am edging towards the dragontech i100HD (though it cannot downsample DTS 5.1/7.1 to stereo like the popcorn hour) - i presume its a firmware think because its a clone of the popcorn hour.

Normus comes nowhere close to this.

For sasta tikao (VFM) solution - the WD TV is available in mumbai or ebay india between 6.5-8k minus the HDD which is decent. Just one thing it cannot passthough DTS true HD via HDMI so its a drawback if you have a capable receiver.

Or else nothing beats the ps3 - upgrade the HDD to 500 GB (2.5'') and see it rock. Its a great blue ray player cum upscalar. Only problem it cannot pass (will never actually) pass true hd audio through bitstream so that an external receiver can process it. It processes HD audio inside and passes the same as LPCM. Not too much of a diff - but to a audiophile these things matter.:clapping:

 

[illusion]

i hope you take it in a good vein tarshah - i have been planning to buy a HDD based player for the last 2 weeks and have studied extensively on this subject ans also spoken to a couple of people in this regard. Finally i am edging towards the dragontech i100HD (though it cannot downsample DTS 5.1/7.1 to stereo like the popcorn hour) - i presume its a firmware think because its a clone of the popcorn hour.

Normus comes nowhere close to this.

For sasta tikao (VFM) solution - the WD TV is available in mumbai or ebay india between 6.5-8k minus the HDD which is decent. Just one thing it cannot passthough DTS true HD via HDMI so its a drawback if you have a capable receiver.

Or else nothing beats the ps3 - upgrade the HDD to 500 GB (2.5'') and see it rock. Its a great blue ray player cum upscalar. Only problem it cannot pass (will never actually) pass true hd audio through bitstream so that an external receiver can process it. It processes HD audio inside and passes the same as LPCM. Not too much of a diff - but to a audiophile these things matter.:clapping:

Suprateep you really seem to be a TrueHD fan. I think an HTPC setup with a high end graphics card will be perfect for you. You can build a decent htpc if u have a budget around Rs 45 k ( CPU only) with all the bells and whistles such as HDMI 1.3 etc ....... Ever thought of going for a HTPC setup ?

 

[suprateep]

Suprateep you really seem to be a TrueHD fan. I think an HTPC setup with a high end graphics card will be perfect for you. You can build a decent htpc if u have a budget around Rs 45 k ( CPU only) with all the bells and whistles such as HDMI 1.3 etc ....... Ever thought of going for a HTPC setup ?

Oh hell yes !!!

I even started a thread some time back - had a system in mind too (worked around pretty cheap too). Basically thought of this setup only because of the quiet setup this would turn out to be

Gigabyte 78 D2SH ~ 4.5-5k
Ram Transcend 2gb~ 1.4k
Processor: AMD X2 7500 ~3.8k
HDD 1 TB (for the time being) ~ 5.8k
Blue Ray Writer + DVD Writer combo ~11k
Soundcard: ASUS HDAV 1.3 ~ 13k
Cabinet : ROADBLOCK!!!!

All i was getting in Pune was the iball 306/207 - i could have spent 4-5k for a HTPC cabinet but none was to be found here.

Again the HDAV 1.3 is the only card that can bitstream True HD audio via HDMI (problem is the driver is shaky and only works with Arcsoft Theater software which is a particular prop. piece - does not work with other players).

I would have bought a 4200 series cheap display card with HDMI for the cross fire thingy later (am not a gamer anymore - my 3 month kid plays all the games on me - my bloodshot eyes devoid of any sleep are testimony to that).

Plagued by so many problems I decided probably not to go with the HTPC route for the time being - will not be user friendly for clck n watch audience i.e. my wife and parents. Later am definately game for it.

So am going for the i100HD dragontech (specs same as popcorn hour) for the time being.

PS: Though my visit to Mumbai - lamington road this weekend might change that. This is my first visit to LR and the availability of the right stuff there might make me change my mind. I still have time till my Paypal gets activated later into the week.

 

[venkatcr]

Cabinet : ROADBLOCK!!!!

As part of building a HTPC for myself, I have roamed about in Ritchie Street in Chennai extensively and and made a few calls across the country. Conclusion - HTPC cabinets are NOT available in India. Only Antec has a model available and they are very evasive when I speak to them. ITDepot, who are the dealers for Antec have no idea about any HTPC cabinet. I am not sure what is available fro iBall.

There are a couple of companies that make decent HTPC cabinet. Zalman (::: ??? ??? ??? ?? :::) is one but is expensive. Silverstone is another. They have over 15 models ranging in prices. I have shortlisted 4 models

GD01B-R - S$248 (~6000Rs.)
LC13B-E - S$228 (~5500Rs.)
LC17B - S$219 (~5300Rs.)
LC20B-E - S$339 (~8200Rs.)

All these have 8 or 9 bays, 4 to 5 fans/fanbays for cooling, 7 expansion slots, and connection for USB, IEEE, Audio, and MIC. The GD10B-R also has a 52 card reader built in.

Silverstone has four dealers in Singapore, and Prolink Data System have all these models. If you know someone travelling to Singapore, it makes sense to get one of these cabinets. Please check SilverStone Technology Co., Ltd - Designing Inspiration for details about specs and their dealers in Singapore. Most of these models are award winners and would look great in an HT rack.

Cheers

 

[noking]

hi you could have a look at Western Digital WD TV it doesn't has a HDD but with a external usb hdd it rocks and supports most of the newest formats and is available for 6500 to 7500 also available in ebay india have a look its just great at the price

 

[suprateep]

hi you could have a look at Western Digital WD TV it doesn't has a HDD but with a external usb hdd it rocks and supports most of the newest formats and is available for 6500 to 7500 also available in ebay india have a look its just great at the price

for ppl with a HDTV without a receiver the WD TV is a great solution.

The problem is it does not/cannot process True HD audio/Bluerat Audio or even pass it through HDMI as bitstream for processing. What is HD without proper audio technology at play - after all a Transformer movie minus the HD audio is just about 60% of the experience.

Believe me i am in a dilemma - HTPC or a media box.

Dvico 6500 is excellent - but expensive. 400 USD (26k in Inida)
Popcorn hour A110 is elusive.
Dragon tech i100HD is a popcorn killer - priced same. around 215 USD (+ shipping + customs)

At 15k though the popcorn or the i100HD is actually a good buy.

 

[venkatcr]

Again the HDAV 1.3 is the only card that can bitstream True HD audio via HDMI (problem is the driver is shaky and only works with Arcsoft Theater software which is a particular prop. piece - does not work with other players).

As you say, Asus seems to be only company that has made a card with these capabilities, though I expect Creative and Turtle Beach to jum in quickly.

For about 25K (player + card), one can have a full blown Blu-Ray player in addition to processing all DVDs.

I have two questions:

1. Can you elaborate on the driver being shaky?
2. Would there be any problem in using Arcsoft?

Cheers

 

[suprateep]

As you say, Asus seems to be only company that has made a card with these capabilities, though I expect Creative and Turtle Beach to jum in quickly.

For about 25K (player + card), one can have a full blown Blu-Ray player in addition to processing all DVDs.

I have two questions:

1. Can you elaborate on the driver being shaky?
2. Would there be any problem in using Arcsoft?

Cheers

problem is when you shell out 13k for a card at least it should deliver on what it promises right?

problem 1.
It can bitstream only through HDMI when playing a Blueray disc or a bueray rip through Arcsoft. You will not get the feature when using any other software or even the normal version of Arcsoft. The arc soft bundled(or maybe it has to be downloaded from the website) only works with the HDAV Asus and bitstreams true HD audio etc

problem 2.
there was a firmware upgrade needed for card manufactured before Sept-Oct 2008 that enabled it to play 24p properly (is not a big issue - but anyone with a capable LCD/plasma has 24p and would like to make good use of it - even my panny pv8 has the 24p feature)

problem 3.
Overall there has been a lot of glitches with this card workign properly - though is claims to make the video better (when a HDMI out from a graphics card is routed through it - so that it can pass both audio video together through its HMDI out) - there have been glitches - though some forum posts claim the item has been fixed.

problem 4
Well any other card can do 7.1 audio - why spend a fortune (nearly a third of the entire HTPC budget) on a card that does not do what it promises.

Thats why i decided against it.

PS: Believe me a popcorn hour A110/Dragontech i100HD is a better buy for normal needs though it offers less flexibilty. Believe me your wife/gf will thank you using these media players. A HTPC is good if music is your primary choice - a Xonar Dx (3.5-4k) is a excellent buy and you can get a HTPC around 20k.

BTW there is a new kid on the block - nvidia ion (with a really small formfactor) - can output great HD video and 7.1 audio through LPCM. Looks like system builders have a new hill to climb.

My take is full blown HTPCs are still a couple of years away - till then a 12-15k investment on a media box is the right way to go.

 

[venkatcr]

problem is when you shell out 13k for a card at least it should deliver on what it promises right?

problem 1.
It can bitstream only through HDMI when playing a Blueray disc or a bueray rip through Arcsoft. You will not get the feature when using any other software or even the normal version of Arcsoft. The arc soft bundled(or maybe it has to be downloaded from the website) only works with the HDAV Asus and bitstreams true HD audio etc

This particular problem may be more due to IP protection rather than a glitch.

In any case, by the end of the year, when I plan to install a Blu-Ray player in my HTPC, I am sure there will be cards available that will decode HD audio well and work with Blu-Ray discs. Till then I will be happy to use my HTPC for storing and playing FLAC files. I don't intend to add one more factor in my system such as WDTV or a Popcorn. My HT/Audio path is quite clear in my mind.

Thanks for the input.

Cheers