My proposed HT in my living room - A casual discussion

[ssf]

We have booked a small apartment under construction , the occupancy of which might be sometime next year. We are at the moment looking at electrical points, HT placements etc. I was a bit hesitant to start a thread on this as asking for solutions implies my ability to implement layout suggestions offered but such is not the case. The layout of my living room has more or less been freezed by my wife after going through numerous options and discussions among ourselves and with our interior designers and am not brave enough to come out with layout changes at this stage. :lol: She has approved the first layout design where the TV is placed on the wall left to the door and opposite the French Window. The layout designs (1) and (2) are not showing the attached bathrooms which are shown in the 3D drawing. (pictures taken to post 2)

The TV that I would like to buy:

Samsung Plasma D8000 64" or similar.

Experience the Plasma + 1 difference. - PS64D8000FR - Plasma TV - Television | SAMSUNG

With a TV this big, placement options are going to be limited. The two options that we thought are manageable are shown in the PP Designs. Although the second design is a little better with regard to audio placement, we are going with the first.

To start a discussion on this, I need to ask, how bad is the placement ? :lol:

The wall on which the TV is going to be mounted is about 6 feet wide (72") and the width of the TV is around 58" which gives just about a feet for placement of the right floorstander. I can place the right floorstander a bit away from the back wall but not much from the right wall as it will intrude into the TV space. I will be placing a wooden (Plywood) book rack of around 12 feet wide and 7 feet high on the long wall towards which the right speaker will be firing. The floors will probably be hardwood and there won't be any carpets placed on the floor. I am thinking of placing low wooden tables at reflection points on the floors.

The right speaker has a bit of room to breath but has its own problems as it is placed in too much of free space as compared to the one on the right. The distance between the speakers will be around 10' or so and the seating position for critical listening will be around the same.

I am looking at Kef Q900 floorstands and it's sealed box design am hoping will to some extent help with the bad placement.

Profx - Advanced Audio Solutions

The other question that comes to mind is whether the Q900's will be too much for the space in spite of the open space in front of the left speaker which fires partially to the second seating area and the open kitchen.

I will talk of my current system and my listening and watching preferences and the electronics that I am thinking of buying in my next post as this one is already too long !!!!

Thanks and regards,

Sunil

 

[ssf]

Creating links to images for better clarity as suggested The first image below the 3D plan has been approved by the Mrs. The software used to create the 3D layout is called Sweet Home 3D, a free software downloaded from the net. I have removed all the furniture from the 3D drawing to keep it simpler.

 

[Raghav]

I personally prefer the second option for reasons
a) TV can be viewed from all seats
b) Less reflection
c)bookshelf intrudes into the TV and the speaker
d) it gives you wall on the left on the main door free for use as sowcase or bookshelf.

2. Just to make you think more I suggest 2 other alternates
a) Place the TV diagonally in corner of the 2 walls you are thinking about. then both front speakers are placed comfortably. Also the Subwoofer, AVR, DVD STB can be fitted into a triangle shaped unit in the corner flush with the TV.

b) Take the TV on the wall of the toilet and modify seating accordingly. What I like about this is the seating is all together and not split in 2 parts. There is also no reflection from window in this case.

 

[sarge_in]

The only disadvantage of a Plasma (as compared to LCD / LED) is that it is not good with reflections. So do what you can to minimize that (0 if possible) - as has already been recommended above), or get an LCD/LED in which case the reflections will not be an issue. There are several ways to manage reflections - placement itself (best!), blackout curtains etc.

 

[ssf]

Raghav & sarge_in,

Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

Yes the second option is ideal but for some reason, my wife does not like to be seated there while watching TV.

I tried out the TV on the bathroom wall that Raghav suggested. In this scenario, I would get about 6 feet separation between speakers which might just be ok but the pillar next to the door is playing the spoilsport. As far as seating goes, I wanted 2 separate seating. At any point in time in my flat there will be 2 people or less watching the TV in the living room, unless I am entertaining in which case, music will take precedence.

I am still leaning towards my original plan where I would have around 10 feet separation between speakers and will get a bit more freedom to tweak the positioning.

The big french window in the living room will have thick curtains to cover it. In case the glare will be a problem, I can close the curtains. I wasn't really expecting glare to be a problem as the window is around 21' from the tv but I will keep my mind on it.

A couple of pictures to get a faint idea.

TV on Bathroom wall:

TV next to door:

Thanks and regards,

Sunil

 

[manjunath.forum.all]

just curious which software u used to get this done.

 

[ssf]

just curious which software u used to get this done.

Sweet Home 3D

 

[sud98]

Is it possible in Option 1 that you can move the door to where the speaker is?

This will enable the TV to move to a more center position and the left speaker (from sitting position) to move to where the door is.

Do note that the centre speaker is best above or below the TV and equidistant from L/R speakers.

I dont like Option 2 and understand why your wife has objections to the sitting position.

Typically, its best to keep the system on the short wall and have the length of the room for the sound to travel.

 

[paritosh]

man... i can think of one more BOLDER option! bolder, because it will take a lot of convincing act

you can close the square along the kitchen with some collapsible particition of wood which would give you a dedicated area of 10x10 for your home theater. there you can set it up as you wish.....

 

[ssf]

Sud99,

I don't think the door can be moved. A good idea though. Will ask the builders. That would solve a bit of the problems.

Paritosh ,

Tried that option subtly citing another bedroom as the reason. Did not hold water with the wife and was struck down without mercy !!! :lol:

The was it looks, the following layout is what I might end up with.

Suggestions to optimise the sound for this layout is more than welcome.


*This is the dream. There is a good posibility that I might just end up with Altec Lansing as my home theatre. Money is always in short supply !!!*

KEF Q900 Floorstands and the Q600c Centre

The KEF Q500 rears

 

[ssf]

To project or not to project, that is the question.

Going through some beautifully done projection projects on the forum got me thinking. Why not project. !!! Not having a dedicated room for it should not stop me from thinking up some designs, I told myself.

And this is what I came up with. (A proposal to myself :lol

Projector : Optima HD20 ceiling mounted.
Throw distance : 15 feet.
Seating distance: 13 to 20 feet.
Screen size : 110" x 62"
Ceiling Hight: 9' 5"
Motorised screen (Preferably)
Bottom of the screen 30" from floor
Top of screen 22" from ceiling

Two problems that I can think of :

1. POP ceiling
2. Fan

Now to convince the Mrs.

Pitfalls, if any, that I should know about may be brought to my attention without hesitation or fear of repercussions

Without Projector

With Projector

 

[ssf]

Could someone help me out with the connectivity options available to connect a Projector to the rest of the system.

Envisaged systems:

AVR Denon 3311/3312 or similar
BDP Sony S470B or similar
TV Samsung Plasma or LED or similar
Projector Optima HD20 or similar
STB - Reliance Digital HD DVR

Am thinking as follows:

Blue ray player to AV receiver (HDMI)
Reliance HD STB to AV receiver (HDMI)
AV receiver to TV (Uplcaled port ?) (HDMI)
AV receiver to Projector (HDMI)

If the above method is fine, I would need to make a provision for one HDMI cable to be running from the location of my Receiver to my Projector.

Thanks and regards,

Sunil

 

[sarge_in]

Projector is almost always great to have if you can swing it. Light control is key if you want to use it during the day though.

Your connectivity options are fine. Just run an many cables as you can, you never know what you will use a few months/years down the line. E.g. Cat 6 network drops everywhere you can, 2-4 at the main loation where you will have all the equipment etc. Also, some projectors have a trigger output to make the screen come down automatically when it is switched on. If your has it, run that wire too. Run as many HDMI as the projector has inputs (preferably 2).

One note about your screen - it seems to drop in front of the speaker. Not sure if that is to scale? If yes, you would need an AT (acoustically transparent) screen. If the screen won't cover the speaker then regular screen is fine.

Your tv height also seems to be higher than optimum. Of course, it is just a sketch at this point, but when actually hanging it try to get the middle of the screen as close to horizontal eye position as possible to avoid neck strain due to looking up.

 

[ssf]

Hello Sarge_in,

After hearing of problems of reflections with Plasma from you and other members of the forum and after reading about all the problems with the current crop of plasma, I am having second thoughts. I don't have to decide anything right now but I am having second thoughts. I have seen some really bad screen reflections on plasma on some youtube video's. When I had given a casual visit to the LG show room in my town, I could see that their plasma screens were reflecting everything lit behind it. Now that I know that there are reflections, I am actually looking for them :lol: To make matters worse, I have a big glass window right behind my seating position and am sure this will make it impossible for me to watch TV with it not covered.

My plans are to scale but am not sure how accurately the software is rendering it in 3D. The line of sight is at around 4 feet from the ground which would be the eye level when seated. Now that you have mentioned it, the TV does seem a bit high. Will correct it. Edit: Now I remember. I took the TV to that level so that the speakers do not block it. I don't think I will have that problem with one speaker shifted to the far left. I can bring the TV down a bit.

The projector screen will drop in front of one speaker if not both and in front of the centre channel. Thanks for the tip on the requirement of an AT Screen.


Category 6 cables and connectivity:

Coming to Cat 6 cables, I have to say I have never thought about this. This is something new to me so my awareness about this is quite minimum.

I have a BSNL broadband connection whose modem supports wireless too. This I am thinking of placing near the TV next to the other AV equipment. I am assuming that I would need internet to use the smart TV features supported by TV's. If this is the case, then do I connect via Cat 6 or Via the wireless option. I would also need to connect my laptop to my modem which could again go either via Cat6 or wireless.

How about if I need to play my files from my laptop ? Is this where Cat6 is the only option to connect to the AVR ? Or can I again connect to the TV and then play it via the AVR ?

To simplify,

1. BSNL broadband modem to TV - Wireless
2. BSNL broadband modem to laptop - Wireless
3. BSNL broadband modem to laptop when in bedroom - Cat6 ?
4. Laptop to AVR - Cat 6 ?

Any other device which I don't know of which might require a Cat 6 connectivity ? Would I need a switch ?

Too many questions, I know

Thank you for taking the time. It's really appreciated

Regards,

Sunil

 

[sarge_in]

My problems with plasma, what problems? I am so ingrained in plasma camp I would blackout all windows and doors than get a lcd/led any day. I have a full french door with glass panes facing my plasma. I put blackout roller shades over it, as well as blackout covers for other windows. If anything, plasmas have gotten better over the past year or two (mine is more than that old). For me I would always get a plasma, and make my place work for it. But that may not hold for everyone, which is why I state the caution.

AT screens may be more expensive, so do your research and see whats the best option - the screen or playing with placement / smaller screen.

Cat 6 cables, well there is a lot you CAN do, the question is how much you want to do for both now and future expansion. When I recently remodeled, I put 2 Cat6 drops in every room, put in-ceiling speakers in every room and routed those to the central hub which has router, switch, NAS and other tonne of stuff. In short, you do want hard-wired connection wherever you want to stream media - it is way more reliable than wireless, and is the the only option if you ever want to stream HD. See post 17 for equipment I put in - you may or may not need all of that of course but just to give you a few ideas:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1267409

Cat6 cables can also be used for HD media distribution using HDMI baluns (that typically needs 2 HDMI drops for single balun), but again depends on how much you want and where all. Perhaps take a step back and think what all you want (now or in the future) - media streaming, cable distribtuion to other rooms, whole house audio with speakers in more rooms, tv in other rooms that may want streaming etc and then I can provide more info accordingly. EVen if you dont want it now, you may want in future, so best to put in wires now, as thats the most difficult part once the walls are done. Read this forum a bit for more ideas:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=36

Hope this helps!

 

[ssf]

Sarge,

My problems with plasma, what problems? I am so ingrained in plasma camp I would blackout all windows and doors than get a lcd/led any day. I have a full french door with glass panes facing my plasma. I put blackout roller shades over it, as well as blackout covers for other windows. If anything, plasmas have gotten better over the past year or two (mine is more than that old). For me I would always get a plasma, and make my place work for it. But that may not hold for everyone, which is why I state the caution.

Am back in the Plasma Camp. Now I just wish that Samsung would fix their screen peeling issues !!!

AT screens may be more expensive, so do your research and see whats the best option - the screen or playing with placement / smaller screen.

Good practical advice. Thanks. I have moved the screen back and the speakers forward.


Over breakfast, I casually brought up the subject of setting up a projector in the living room with the Mrs. I told her that she would then no longer need to go to malls to watch movies and that we could make the screen and the projector totally disappear from view when not in use. She told me to go get myself a projector if I wanted to but not cite her as the reason for doing so. :lol: She is used to big speakers as the ones that I have right now (custom built) are bigger than the KEF Q900s. The only thing she insists on is that there be no visible cables and wires lying around.

Home theatre Networking is quite interesting and looks very promising. Will do a bit of reading on that so as to make provisions for the future.

Thanks and regards,

Sunil


TV made lower:

Speakers moved ahead of the Projector Screen:

 

[sarge_in]

Cool...go plasma! You can consider Panasonic too, I am partial to them - not sure why!

The tv and screen surely look better now. Pulling speakers far from rear/side walls is recommended anyway, so you gain both ways.

And, how will you 'disappear' the projector? Hope you are not thinking of storing it and taking it out for use only. Too many settings (esp focus and zoom) involved to do that - place and set once and then don't touch it. Of course, you don't need to tell that to your mrs

Cheers!

Sarge,



Am back in the Plasma Camp. Now I just wish that Samsung would fix their screen peeling issues !!!



Good practical advice. Thanks. I have moved the screen back and the speakers forward.


Over breakfast, I casually brought up the subject of setting up a projector in the living room with the Mrs. I told her that she would then no longer need to go to malls to watch movies and that we could make the screen and the projector totally disappear from view when not in use. She told me to go get myself a projector if I wanted to but not cite her as the reason for doing so. :lol: She is used to big speakers as the ones that I have right now (custom built) are bigger than the KEF Q900s. The only thing she insists on is that there be no visible cables and wires lying around.

Home theatre Networking is quite interesting and looks very promising. Will do a bit of reading on that so as to make provisions for the future.

Thanks and regards,

Sunil


TV made lower:

Speakers moved ahead of the Projector Screen:

 

[ssf]

Cool...go plasma! You can consider Panasonic too, I am partial to them - not sure why!

The tv and screen surely look better now. Pulling speakers far from rear/side walls is recommended anyway, so you gain both ways.

And, how will you 'disappear' the projector? Hope you are not thinking of storing it and taking it out for use only. Too many settings (esp focus and zoom) involved to do that - place and set once and then don't touch it. Of course, you don't need to tell that to your mrs

Cheers!

I am pushing my budget with the Samsung 64" which should be around 2 Lakh or so. Panasonic 65" if I am not mistaken, is a lakh more than that and will be over my budget.

I am thinking of something like what is demonstrated in the link given below for the projector. I have no idea how much it will cost me or if I can get it done in a small town like Mangalore. These are provisions for the future really. Something that I need to tell my Interior Designer to plan for when designing the POP false ceiling.

motionlift projector lift-electric drop down digital projector lift

Regards,

Sunil

 

[ssf]

Looks like the Box type projector lift with RF remote would cost around 28000/-

The Home Theater Store

Not too expensive for the convenience that it offers

 

[sarge_in]

Cool! Shud look great when you can't see it!

Btw, if you are getting a projector, reconsider whether you really need a 65" plasma for "yeh Rishta Kya Kehlata Hai" . One option may be to go for a 60" Panasonic instead of 65" Samsung, but that's all personal preferences of course.