square_wave
Well-Known Member
Hi Pratima,
Congratulations. Enjoy !
Congratulations. Enjoy !
Passive pre with Ayon CD1
- Thread starter pratimbayal
- Start date
Awesome setup Pratim! Bet it sounds superb.
A small recommendation - when you can get to it:
See if you can separate the pre. on top of the amp. to a dedicated shelf and also if possible a separate amp. stand. Maybe the built in feet will serve that purpose, but I am sure a dedicated stand will only help the SQ.
Cheers
Sid
A small recommendation - when you can get to it:
See if you can separate the pre. on top of the amp. to a dedicated shelf and also if possible a separate amp. stand. Maybe the built in feet will serve that purpose, but I am sure a dedicated stand will only help the SQ.
Cheers
Sid
Last edited:
Kevian
New Member
Pratim da....excellent setup....I can only dream about such systems...enjoy Sir.
btw....I see windows behind the rail...Staircase? no echo?
cheers:clapping:
btw....I see windows behind the rail...Staircase? no echo?
cheers:clapping:
Buckle up folks, this is a long report.
Last Sunday afternoon I drove approx 20 kms north from my place in Salt Lake, Kolkata to audition Pratim's new amp. I was not 100% because the previous night we were up till about 2:30 AM after the World cup victory. I was a bit worried also about some delays on the road because of election campaign meetings or processions. However, my fears basically vanished as soon as I hit the road, because even the political party workers took it rather easy after all the involvement the previous night. There were not many on the road. People were mostly sleeping, I guess. So was Pratim, when I called him from a distance
of 10 minutes drive from his place to let him know I was almost there.
The amp is sizeable and heavy. Pratim would know the exact dimensions. But nothing unusual for an amp of its class. I suppose Pratim just powered it on immediately after I called from the road.
From my listening experience that day, this amp needs at least a solid hour or two (two is better) to properly warm up. I stayed till 7 PM, and the amp was performing much better for the last hour or so.
Initially, just after Pratim got the amp, he had a lot of doubts. Doubts about the pre-amp, if it was enough to produce the required volume levels, the desired dynamics, and if he would be able to run a TT setup through it. Initially the sound, according to Pratim, was not impressive, not dynamic with certain kinds of music, and had a bit of bass-boom. We had long discussions over the phone from changing the pre-amp to active, changing the amp to something else, and even changing his speakers. I basically asked him to keep his calm, be patient and wait for at least 100 hours to have an initial impression. Based on what I have read about the Kismet amp on the 6moons review, it at least deserved some more time. I understood from that review that while his previous amp, the Jaton Operetta, was a very good amp for its price point, the Kismet should actually belong to an absolutely different category. The option of changing the passive pre to an active (and changing the speakers) are always there. We even discussed the Leben RS-100 pre for a while (as all of you know I have immense faith in Leben products and this one has impeccable reports). But the basic message from me always was one of wait, watch and proceed. I believe one should not change too many things at one point of time, then you loose count of the actual contribution of a particular component and end up not learning anything from the exercise. All my life I had to do with a very limited amount of money, and I want to make the most of it by carefully changing one thing at a time to optimize the sonics.
After I arrived, Pratim put some female vocals on. Immediately I realized there was a problem, with sonics being a little muddy and a bit of a bass boom that Pratim was complaining about previously. His speakers were about 6.5 feet apart, and toed in appreciably so that the on-axis straight lines from the speakers met well in front of the listening position which was more than 10 feet (perhaps even 12 feet) away from plane of the systems. In addition, because of the appreciable toe-in, the back of the speakers were facing sidewalls less than 1 foot away. Pratim and I then set about to correct the speaker positioning. After a bit of experimenting, the final position we settled for had the speakers with much less toe-in angles so that they had now free space on the back of the speakers (look at the pictures put up by Pratim) and the on-axis lines from the speakers met a little bit behind the listening position where Pratim has put a very comfortable sofa. Two things were achieved with the new speaker positioning: 1) muddiness and the bass boom of the sound were gone, 2) the sweet spot had far more tolerance, that is, one had a good sense of imaging and soundstage from a wider region around the dead-center sweet spot, with better overall sonics.
I deliberately let Pratim play his music initially, as the amp was gradually warming up and left my CDs (which I know very well) for more critical listening after the amp was reasonably warmed up. About an hour or so after my arrival, I put on the first CD I brought: A meeting by the River, Ry Cooder and Vishwa Mohan Bhatt, Water Lily Acoustics. This CD has very low recording level, and one of the things I wanted to check how Partim's setup with the passive pre fairs with such low recording level. At about 4 O'clock position of the volume knob of his passive pre, the sound was fairly loud. We increased it till the max (6 O'clock position) and the sound volume was nearly ear-splitting level. I just want to mention here that with the passive pre, the max volume position corresponds to zero gain from the pre, at any other position, it is actually attenuation (rather than gain in case of active pre).
The guitars sounded nearly magical (especially Bhatt's). However, I was not that satisfied with the sonics of the tabla (more on this later). The imaging was very good and the soundstage was always 3D and huge with the appropriate recordings.
I continued with 2 Chhandadhara CDs (a 2 CD album by Ravishankar, recorded in London to mark his 70 years of performance, and another CD by Ali Akbar Khan recorded in Stuttgart). Lower strings on the sitar lacked a bit of sweetness (more on it later), however, everything else was very very good including the percussion on the pakhawaj. Next, Ali Akbar's sarod was truly truly magical, the best I think I heard it sound in recent times (the sweetness, the tunefulness, yet the fullness and the impact and decay of the typical Ali Akbar sarod I have heard at least 20 times without amplification), but again Swapan Choudhury's tabla while sounding very good was not phenomenal (more on it later).
At the end I put on the tricky CD by Jasraj (again recorded in Stuttgart, the same one I used in my auditions in my long amp thread). Initially the level is extremely low, and Jasraj supported vocally by Shweta Jhaveri on his right and Durga Jasraj on his left, two tanpuras on two sides and slightly back, and a sarengi on his left and tabla on his extreme right : quite an ensemble. I looked for separation of each, tonal qualities and subtle microdynamic elements without which the initial movements of the alaap would be lost. It was all there. Later when tabla started accompanying, again it was okay, but not very special.
Overall, the experience was very very enjoyable. The sound was extremely dynamic and full with an incredible amount of detail and microdynamics. All these qualities were way above his previous amp. The thump and impact was there (as evident on the track no. 3 of the Cooder-Bhatt CD). Imaging and 3D soundstaging were also very impressive (just one observation here, the performers seemed like positioned a bit down, almost as if one was looking a bit down on the performers from the listening position. It improved a bit after the speakers' repositioning, but still was there and I did not quite understand it).
However, my comments above 'more on it later' within parentheses need further explanation. If you read carefully, my dissatisfactions were with the lower mids or perhaps upper and mid bass parts. These improved quite a lot during the course of my 2 and 1/2 hour audition, but still I would expect much better from an amp which has been compared with superlative amps. My guess is that (and reports confirm this, perhaps sridhar and other experts can comment here)) this amp needs serious burn in (I'd suspect something like 500 hours, Pratim says he has already seen vast improvements over the past 100-150 hours of listening. Remember, he was initially unhappy with the sonics). In addition, this amp also needs a couple of hours of warm up time before it can sound at its best. I know this is a bit strange for SS amps, and again I invite comments by experienced blokes on this, but I have read many reports on very long burn in and warm-up times even for the Odyssey Stratos in the Odyssey threads in audiocircle.
The upper mids and the highs were superb (perhaps they would improve even further with more burn in), and this is why Bhatt's guitar sounded better than Cooder's because the 'bottleneck' guitar (whatever it is) played by Cooder had more lower frequency elements than Bhatt's.
In any case, I already would rate this amp very highly, ahead of most SS amps I have heard in the past few years. I'd reserve the final judgemnent after another listen after a reasonably longer burn in, and perhaps if Pratim is willing to lug his amp over (I know it's heavy, but we have an elevator in our building, and my son can help), I'd love to hear it through my speakers once.
Finally, the passive pre that Pratim is using is fine in regard to producing enough volume levels and dynamics. I even listened to his TT (RPM 4) with MM Cartridge coupled to my very budget CA 640P phono pre which then goes into his passive pre. I did think initially that the TT would not work especially with a low output cartridge in his setup with the passive pre. But it does work in his set-up). The TT experience was quite decent with most of the attributes of the analogue source present. The 640P is no match for the Nighthawk that he borrowed from Vasu and is currently intending to buy. Firstly I'd expect much lower rumble with the Nighthawk when it comes to playing older records. Sonically also the Nighthawk should be a lot better (how much, I'd leave that to Pratim to comment, I did not hear the Nighthawk, because it was already returned to Vasu. I use the 640P, because there's nothing better IMO at that very-budget-price-point, suits me fine with a 21 year old Dual TT that breaks down every once in a while. If I plan to invest in a new TT, I'd think better, at least in terms of a Clearaudio Nano Phono or something like that).
Regards.
Last Sunday afternoon I drove approx 20 kms north from my place in Salt Lake, Kolkata to audition Pratim's new amp. I was not 100% because the previous night we were up till about 2:30 AM after the World cup victory. I was a bit worried also about some delays on the road because of election campaign meetings or processions. However, my fears basically vanished as soon as I hit the road, because even the political party workers took it rather easy after all the involvement the previous night. There were not many on the road. People were mostly sleeping, I guess. So was Pratim, when I called him from a distance
of 10 minutes drive from his place to let him know I was almost there.
The amp is sizeable and heavy. Pratim would know the exact dimensions. But nothing unusual for an amp of its class. I suppose Pratim just powered it on immediately after I called from the road.
From my listening experience that day, this amp needs at least a solid hour or two (two is better) to properly warm up. I stayed till 7 PM, and the amp was performing much better for the last hour or so.
Initially, just after Pratim got the amp, he had a lot of doubts. Doubts about the pre-amp, if it was enough to produce the required volume levels, the desired dynamics, and if he would be able to run a TT setup through it. Initially the sound, according to Pratim, was not impressive, not dynamic with certain kinds of music, and had a bit of bass-boom. We had long discussions over the phone from changing the pre-amp to active, changing the amp to something else, and even changing his speakers. I basically asked him to keep his calm, be patient and wait for at least 100 hours to have an initial impression. Based on what I have read about the Kismet amp on the 6moons review, it at least deserved some more time. I understood from that review that while his previous amp, the Jaton Operetta, was a very good amp for its price point, the Kismet should actually belong to an absolutely different category. The option of changing the passive pre to an active (and changing the speakers) are always there. We even discussed the Leben RS-100 pre for a while (as all of you know I have immense faith in Leben products and this one has impeccable reports). But the basic message from me always was one of wait, watch and proceed. I believe one should not change too many things at one point of time, then you loose count of the actual contribution of a particular component and end up not learning anything from the exercise. All my life I had to do with a very limited amount of money, and I want to make the most of it by carefully changing one thing at a time to optimize the sonics.
After I arrived, Pratim put some female vocals on. Immediately I realized there was a problem, with sonics being a little muddy and a bit of a bass boom that Pratim was complaining about previously. His speakers were about 6.5 feet apart, and toed in appreciably so that the on-axis straight lines from the speakers met well in front of the listening position which was more than 10 feet (perhaps even 12 feet) away from plane of the systems. In addition, because of the appreciable toe-in, the back of the speakers were facing sidewalls less than 1 foot away. Pratim and I then set about to correct the speaker positioning. After a bit of experimenting, the final position we settled for had the speakers with much less toe-in angles so that they had now free space on the back of the speakers (look at the pictures put up by Pratim) and the on-axis lines from the speakers met a little bit behind the listening position where Pratim has put a very comfortable sofa. Two things were achieved with the new speaker positioning: 1) muddiness and the bass boom of the sound were gone, 2) the sweet spot had far more tolerance, that is, one had a good sense of imaging and soundstage from a wider region around the dead-center sweet spot, with better overall sonics.
I deliberately let Pratim play his music initially, as the amp was gradually warming up and left my CDs (which I know very well) for more critical listening after the amp was reasonably warmed up. About an hour or so after my arrival, I put on the first CD I brought: A meeting by the River, Ry Cooder and Vishwa Mohan Bhatt, Water Lily Acoustics. This CD has very low recording level, and one of the things I wanted to check how Partim's setup with the passive pre fairs with such low recording level. At about 4 O'clock position of the volume knob of his passive pre, the sound was fairly loud. We increased it till the max (6 O'clock position) and the sound volume was nearly ear-splitting level. I just want to mention here that with the passive pre, the max volume position corresponds to zero gain from the pre, at any other position, it is actually attenuation (rather than gain in case of active pre).
The guitars sounded nearly magical (especially Bhatt's). However, I was not that satisfied with the sonics of the tabla (more on this later). The imaging was very good and the soundstage was always 3D and huge with the appropriate recordings.
I continued with 2 Chhandadhara CDs (a 2 CD album by Ravishankar, recorded in London to mark his 70 years of performance, and another CD by Ali Akbar Khan recorded in Stuttgart). Lower strings on the sitar lacked a bit of sweetness (more on it later), however, everything else was very very good including the percussion on the pakhawaj. Next, Ali Akbar's sarod was truly truly magical, the best I think I heard it sound in recent times (the sweetness, the tunefulness, yet the fullness and the impact and decay of the typical Ali Akbar sarod I have heard at least 20 times without amplification), but again Swapan Choudhury's tabla while sounding very good was not phenomenal (more on it later).
At the end I put on the tricky CD by Jasraj (again recorded in Stuttgart, the same one I used in my auditions in my long amp thread). Initially the level is extremely low, and Jasraj supported vocally by Shweta Jhaveri on his right and Durga Jasraj on his left, two tanpuras on two sides and slightly back, and a sarengi on his left and tabla on his extreme right : quite an ensemble. I looked for separation of each, tonal qualities and subtle microdynamic elements without which the initial movements of the alaap would be lost. It was all there. Later when tabla started accompanying, again it was okay, but not very special.
Overall, the experience was very very enjoyable. The sound was extremely dynamic and full with an incredible amount of detail and microdynamics. All these qualities were way above his previous amp. The thump and impact was there (as evident on the track no. 3 of the Cooder-Bhatt CD). Imaging and 3D soundstaging were also very impressive (just one observation here, the performers seemed like positioned a bit down, almost as if one was looking a bit down on the performers from the listening position. It improved a bit after the speakers' repositioning, but still was there and I did not quite understand it).
However, my comments above 'more on it later' within parentheses need further explanation. If you read carefully, my dissatisfactions were with the lower mids or perhaps upper and mid bass parts. These improved quite a lot during the course of my 2 and 1/2 hour audition, but still I would expect much better from an amp which has been compared with superlative amps. My guess is that (and reports confirm this, perhaps sridhar and other experts can comment here)) this amp needs serious burn in (I'd suspect something like 500 hours, Pratim says he has already seen vast improvements over the past 100-150 hours of listening. Remember, he was initially unhappy with the sonics). In addition, this amp also needs a couple of hours of warm up time before it can sound at its best. I know this is a bit strange for SS amps, and again I invite comments by experienced blokes on this, but I have read many reports on very long burn in and warm-up times even for the Odyssey Stratos in the Odyssey threads in audiocircle.
The upper mids and the highs were superb (perhaps they would improve even further with more burn in), and this is why Bhatt's guitar sounded better than Cooder's because the 'bottleneck' guitar (whatever it is) played by Cooder had more lower frequency elements than Bhatt's.
In any case, I already would rate this amp very highly, ahead of most SS amps I have heard in the past few years. I'd reserve the final judgemnent after another listen after a reasonably longer burn in, and perhaps if Pratim is willing to lug his amp over (I know it's heavy, but we have an elevator in our building, and my son can help), I'd love to hear it through my speakers once.
Finally, the passive pre that Pratim is using is fine in regard to producing enough volume levels and dynamics. I even listened to his TT (RPM 4) with MM Cartridge coupled to my very budget CA 640P phono pre which then goes into his passive pre. I did think initially that the TT would not work especially with a low output cartridge in his setup with the passive pre. But it does work in his set-up). The TT experience was quite decent with most of the attributes of the analogue source present. The 640P is no match for the Nighthawk that he borrowed from Vasu and is currently intending to buy. Firstly I'd expect much lower rumble with the Nighthawk when it comes to playing older records. Sonically also the Nighthawk should be a lot better (how much, I'd leave that to Pratim to comment, I did not hear the Nighthawk, because it was already returned to Vasu. I use the 640P, because there's nothing better IMO at that very-budget-price-point, suits me fine with a 21 year old Dual TT that breaks down every once in a while. If I plan to invest in a new TT, I'd think better, at least in terms of a Clearaudio Nano Phono or something like that).
Regards.
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Hi Asit
First, let me thank you for taking the trouble of posting in a detailed manner your observations and listening experiences. The version of the amp that Pratim has is a tweaked one and ahead of the one that is mentioned on 6moons. Break-in (even though some people dont believe in it) is a factor that is commonly mentioned by Odyssey owners. In fact, if one takes the trouble of going through the Audiocircle Odyssey forums, one will realise that the recommendation is to leave the amp on all the time (not to mention the initial breakin). The best listening happens when the amps are sufficiently warmed up. I dont think this phenomenon is anything special with Odyssey but true of all audio components be it a valve amplifier or a cd player. The Kismet needs more than 300 hours of break-in to sounds its best, probably reaching near peak performance at or beyond 500 hrs. The lower and mid bass performance will definitely improve with time (although in these frequencies speaker placement is a major factor as well), how much improvement? That is something that you or Pratim will have to pen down here again
cheers
First, let me thank you for taking the trouble of posting in a detailed manner your observations and listening experiences. The version of the amp that Pratim has is a tweaked one and ahead of the one that is mentioned on 6moons. Break-in (even though some people dont believe in it) is a factor that is commonly mentioned by Odyssey owners. In fact, if one takes the trouble of going through the Audiocircle Odyssey forums, one will realise that the recommendation is to leave the amp on all the time (not to mention the initial breakin). The best listening happens when the amps are sufficiently warmed up. I dont think this phenomenon is anything special with Odyssey but true of all audio components be it a valve amplifier or a cd player. The Kismet needs more than 300 hours of break-in to sounds its best, probably reaching near peak performance at or beyond 500 hrs. The lower and mid bass performance will definitely improve with time (although in these frequencies speaker placement is a major factor as well), how much improvement? That is something that you or Pratim will have to pen down here again
cheers
pratimbayal
Active Member
Thanks for the suggestion sidvee
In fact I have already started discussion with Ali for the amp stand and separate shelf for pre and my Nakamichi tape deck . Hope there will be improvements.
Cheers
pratimbayal
Active Member
Hi Venkus,
Actually there is an open celing ( my set up is on the first floor) of around six Sq ft area between the railing and big window. I have no echo issue .
Actually there is an open celing ( my set up is on the first floor) of around six Sq ft area between the railing and big window. I have no echo issue .
pratimbayal
Active Member
Thanks Asit - for suggesting the modification in speaker position. I was listening to other CDs after you left. The sound was very much enjoying and the bass boom has been completely vanished.
I remember my waiting days ( around two and half months ) for kismet and your recomendation to keep cool. It is my good fortune to have you on the other side of the phone whenever I need some suggestion on this hobby.
And yet again it was an excellent experience with Sridhar from ARN - I called him so many times , even at odd hours - he was always helpfull.
I would like to metion one more point on the passive pre. This is playing the Nakamichi tape deck with absolutely no issue in gain or dynamics- obviously Kismet has its contribution.
Cheers
Pratim
I remember my waiting days ( around two and half months ) for kismet and your recomendation to keep cool. It is my good fortune to have you on the other side of the phone whenever I need some suggestion on this hobby.
And yet again it was an excellent experience with Sridhar from ARN - I called him so many times , even at odd hours - he was always helpfull.
I would like to metion one more point on the passive pre. This is playing the Nakamichi tape deck with absolutely no issue in gain or dynamics- obviously Kismet has its contribution.
Cheers
Pratim
square_wave
Well-Known Member
There are two things I would want to add.
1. Complementing what Sridhar said, the odyssey amp needs to some serious burn in time to sound really good and do the disappearing act. I have used a stratos and a friend of mine the odyssey khartago extremes. The observation is the same. The odyssey amp should ideally be kept on all the while. The amp sounds like a different animal after two hours of playing time.
2. About the sound: - The sound from any system is greatly influenced by the system synergy. There is a myriad variety of gear in this particular setup. Almost all of them widely reviewed and recommended. But will they make music together is something we have to see. Let the amp burn in and then if you are not satisfied, change the passive pre or the speakers to something else and see what happens.
PS: The odyssey amp never (I mean never) introduces boom to any system. They have tightest extended bass I have ever heard from any amp. In fact this is one of the strong points of odyssey amps among many others.
1. Complementing what Sridhar said, the odyssey amp needs to some serious burn in time to sound really good and do the disappearing act. I have used a stratos and a friend of mine the odyssey khartago extremes. The observation is the same. The odyssey amp should ideally be kept on all the while. The amp sounds like a different animal after two hours of playing time.
2. About the sound: - The sound from any system is greatly influenced by the system synergy. There is a myriad variety of gear in this particular setup. Almost all of them widely reviewed and recommended. But will they make music together is something we have to see. Let the amp burn in and then if you are not satisfied, change the passive pre or the speakers to something else and see what happens.
PS: The odyssey amp never (I mean never) introduces boom to any system. They have tightest extended bass I have ever heard from any amp. In fact this is one of the strong points of odyssey amps among many others.
ajay124
Well-Known Member
Congratulations Pratim!
Hope you will finally discover nirvana with the Kismet
Hope you will finally discover nirvana with the Kismet
ajay124
Well-Known Member
Pratim
You have very knowledgeable people to guide you.You have spared no effort in your pursuit of High Fidelity.I hope that in 2011 you can settle down with a 'fixed' set up that provides you constant pleasure.I too went through a roller coaster ride last year before discovering my small earthly paradise.When I was trying to decide on the Bryston's I went through a whole lot of confusion.There were plenty of divergent views about their sonic qualities.Having used them for roughly 6 months now,I am completely satisfied with their performance.I did have some issues with their start up circuitry earlier on,but they were completely resolved after I started using an online UPS.I discovered that the input voltage at my house was in the range of 250-280V.Can't blame any power amp for 'protesting' at such outrage.
Apart from the fact that it is neutral,accurate and renders 'grand slam' bass,I don't buy into any of the other theories regarding Bryston.Some folks find it 'bland' or 'dry' or call it a workhorse that lacks the ultimate refinement of true high end amp.Not true.Personally I feel that SQ has to be defined for your set up as a whole rather than for an individual component.Your ears,your experience in listening to music,your room,your power supply are as much a part of that whole,as your source,amp,speakers,cables and recordings.Power supply can be fixed independently from the rest of the stuff and I believe that is absolutely essential.One phase (run through an online UPS and then 4mm LAPP cable directly to the audio rack) should be dedicated only to HiFi.It should not bear any other load.Beyond that I feel the first step is to find the right speakers based on your room size and listening preferences.Personally I am completely satisfied with my speakers and amp.Things started falling in place after I got the Vienna Acoustics.Lightly used Bryston gear is fairly easily available,enjoys good support from the distributor and is very good value for money.The only amp which I may consider in the future as a replacement for Bryston is the Accuphase E450.And that too only after an audition at my home and at a price point of 200-250 K max.
Cheers
You have very knowledgeable people to guide you.You have spared no effort in your pursuit of High Fidelity.I hope that in 2011 you can settle down with a 'fixed' set up that provides you constant pleasure.I too went through a roller coaster ride last year before discovering my small earthly paradise.When I was trying to decide on the Bryston's I went through a whole lot of confusion.There were plenty of divergent views about their sonic qualities.Having used them for roughly 6 months now,I am completely satisfied with their performance.I did have some issues with their start up circuitry earlier on,but they were completely resolved after I started using an online UPS.I discovered that the input voltage at my house was in the range of 250-280V.Can't blame any power amp for 'protesting' at such outrage.
Apart from the fact that it is neutral,accurate and renders 'grand slam' bass,I don't buy into any of the other theories regarding Bryston.Some folks find it 'bland' or 'dry' or call it a workhorse that lacks the ultimate refinement of true high end amp.Not true.Personally I feel that SQ has to be defined for your set up as a whole rather than for an individual component.Your ears,your experience in listening to music,your room,your power supply are as much a part of that whole,as your source,amp,speakers,cables and recordings.Power supply can be fixed independently from the rest of the stuff and I believe that is absolutely essential.One phase (run through an online UPS and then 4mm LAPP cable directly to the audio rack) should be dedicated only to HiFi.It should not bear any other load.Beyond that I feel the first step is to find the right speakers based on your room size and listening preferences.Personally I am completely satisfied with my speakers and amp.Things started falling in place after I got the Vienna Acoustics.Lightly used Bryston gear is fairly easily available,enjoys good support from the distributor and is very good value for money.The only amp which I may consider in the future as a replacement for Bryston is the Accuphase E450.And that too only after an audition at my home and at a price point of 200-250 K max.
Cheers
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Asit - kudos on a nicely written piece on your listening impressions. Having lived with a roughly similar set up (stratos extreme - which is a next model below the kismet) for approximately a year or so, my humble opinion is that the lower mid range dissatisfaction is due to the speakers rather than the amp. Yes I also believe that the sound will get much better after extended breakin and hopefully it will become a non-issue. I had a similar experience while listening to my setup but could easily tell the difference when I switched speakers.
Cheers
Sid
Thanks Sid. What you said could actually be true. However, as you very well know, and the 6moons review writes quite emphatically about, these amps from Odyssey Audio need serious time for burn in. That 6moons review was written after 90 days of rigorous burn in during which the sonics went through funny cycles according to the reviewer. I also know there are some who would not believe, but I do not want to be dragged into an argument over this. All I can say is that I have witnessed it myself, more for certain things, and less or almost unnoticeable for certain other equipments. I do not know if Pratim was aware of or witnessed phenomena related to burn in before, but he is definitely noticing it now.
I know a few things for sure will improve with more running in of the amp, for example the tightness and the speed of the bass frequencies. At the moment, the bass is a bit loose, and not fast. As square-wave also mentioned, and I agree: I do not worry about these. These will improve to a phenomenal extent, if I go by other reports.
Let's wait and see. Unfortunately I believe this will take a bit of time. As I said in my earlier post, eventually I'd like to hear this amp with my speakers, if Pratim permits.
Regards.
I know a few things for sure will improve with more running in of the amp, for example the tightness and the speed of the bass frequencies. At the moment, the bass is a bit loose, and not fast. As square-wave also mentioned, and I agree: I do not worry about these. These will improve to a phenomenal extent, if I go by other reports.
Let's wait and see. Unfortunately I believe this will take a bit of time. As I said in my earlier post, eventually I'd like to hear this amp with my speakers, if Pratim permits.
Regards.
pratimbayal
Active Member
Amit,
I haven't heared RG-10, so can't compare. Definitely it will be better amp than kismet, however will be interested to know the ratio of SQ and price difference between them.
Two shelves design is to have low height unit so that the railing behind can be seen to maintain the asthetic. The shelves are of acrylic sheet - these were also sent by Ali.One side of the sheets were covered by adhesive paper to protect from scratch. The rack was sent in dissembled condition. I just need to re assemble - it was just childs play.
Sure call me to discuss in detail. You can call me on sunday - Tomorrow going to Nepal for an official gathering - will be back by Saturday.
Regards
pratimbayal
Active Member
Ajay
Not only 2011 , I want to stick to my current set up for coming few years.Want to enjoy music only. Just will be adding a phonostage and a new TT down the line to enjoy my venture into LP.
I am using a dedicated 6 mm finolex cable line direct from the main for my audio gear. Also currenty added siltech power cord with furutech plugs after Asit and myriad shown me the difference a power chord can make.
Now enjoying every bit of my audio gear.
Regards
Not only 2011 , I want to stick to my current set up for coming few years.Want to enjoy music only. Just will be adding a phonostage and a new TT down the line to enjoy my venture into LP.
I am using a dedicated 6 mm finolex cable line direct from the main for my audio gear. Also currenty added siltech power cord with furutech plugs after Asit and myriad shown me the difference a power chord can make.
Now enjoying every bit of my audio gear.
Regards
pratimbayal
Active Member
Hi Square
Now waiting to see what happens after further burn in. I took the final decision after the 6 moon review of this amp with BE-718. Hope this combo will do justice to the review.
Asit
Will definitely take my amp to your house to listen with you amp. Will try to do this by end of this month.
Regards
Now waiting to see what happens after further burn in. I took the final decision after the 6 moon review of this amp with BE-718. Hope this combo will do justice to the review.
Asit
Will definitely take my amp to your house to listen with you amp. Will try to do this by end of this month.
Regards
Without taking anything away from the Kismet, the RG-10 is in a very different league as is all gear from Symphonic Line and Klaus (Odyssey designer) admits to this as well, so no point in comparing the two. In addition, the comparison isnt apples to apples as the RG10 has a very very good active preamp, whereas the setup in question here has a passive pre. There is bound to be a world of difference between the two
cheers
anm
Well-Known Member
very nice and clean setup. I don't know how it sounds, but it does look luxurious!
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