Short Album Reviews

[psychotropic]

suresh, sorry to go offtopic, and maybe i should ask you to start a new thread for this. I notice you live near churchgate. And from your statement that you've been into jazz for 50 years, I am curious to know whether you've heard any of the old bombay jazz guys, playing at (not just) jazz by the bay, or elsewhere, and if you could tell us a bit about that time.

Hi,
Listen to Bobby Watson, Spyro Gyra, Lenny White, Return To Forever.
All very very similiar to "Romantic Warrior", tight sound and enjoyable funky , foot tapping jazz.
Suresh.
I have been on the jazz scene for 50 years now.

 

[coaltrain]

I was purely talking about Zakir Hussain's Making Music, coaltrain. I have not heard 'Romantic Warrior'.

sorry mate, my bad!

you're absolutely right about making music's pacing. another indo-jazz fusion album that works for newcomers, and is faster paced, is:

i had the privilege of meeting l.subramaniam a few years ago, when we were shooting him for a charity ad campaign. i landed up at his home with my (well played) copy of conversations in my bag, and was immediately smitten by his ready smile and genuine humility. after the shoot, i hesitantly pulled out the cd and asked if he would autograph it for me. the resulting scrawl is now a cherished treasure in my cd rack

 

[coaltrain]

\
I have been on the jazz scene for 50 years now.

now, THAT"S what you call a jazz guru!

 

[moktan]

while we are on the subject of jazz just my two pence on what makes this genre different from say classical music....
(i) Dissonance: dissonance in music means two or more tones that sound harsh to the ear when played together..(play any key of the piano and one or two more keys immediately next to it at the same time..what we get is dissonance since the vibrations are so similar that they clash instead of blending harmoniously..) Dissonance accounts for the 'blues' sound of jazz.
...but when used extravagantly it is what makes some jazz sound so discordant and unpleasing to some ears ..
(ii) Syncopation: It is a kind of a rhythmic distortion in which the prominent beat is is either anticipated or delayed...traditional jazz used to be played in strict tempo, that is four bars or beats to a measure...but as the years passed ..more rhythmic sophistication was introduced..and musicians began to play in 3/4 time (used in waltz).. Dave Brubeck's Take Five is a famous example of jazz played in 5/4time...
(iii) Improvisation: what makes jazz unique however is not so much dissonance or syncopation as it is improvisation...of course improvisation in sense of variation from the main theme has always been there in classical music...but unlike there where it is worked out in advance...in jazz the musician depends on his knowledge about the harmonic structure of the original theme and a highly developed ear to produce improvisations that are spontaneous...
anyway sorry for the long post..

 

[Hiten]

Hi coaltrain

not bad for someone who claims to be a jazz newbie

Actually after joining the forum I am newbie to everything from hifi to music to technical details before joining I thought I had fare amount of knowledge, but I was wrong.
Got the chance to hear Miles davis and liked (1) So What (2) Blue in green and (3) All Blue. Other tracks must also be good but liked these three on first listen. Also dug out vinyl of "Buddy Tate and the dollar Band" and liked (1) Heyt Mazurki and (2) Dogging around
A year a back had a chance to acquire three vinyls
--Dukes Of Dixieland : Dixieland's Greatest Hits
--Eureka Brass Band Of New Orleans : Jazz At Preservation Hall
--Pete Fountain : Alive In New Orleans
but I let it pass :sad: will see if they are still available

time out by dave brubeck - is a classic example of 'cool jazz'.

Any other recommendation of "cool Jazz"
Thanks

 

[myriad]

Hi coaltrain

Actually after joining the forum I am newbie to everything from hifi to music to technical details before joining I thought I had fare amount of knowledge, but I was wrong.
Got the chance to hear Miles davis and liked (1) So What (2) Blue in green and (3) All Blue. Other tracks must also be good but liked these three on first listen. Also dug out vinyl of "Buddy Tate and the dollar Band" and liked (1) Heyt Mazurki and (2) Dogging around
A year a back had a chance to acquire three vinyls
--Dukes Of Dixieland : Dixieland's Greatest Hits
--Eureka Brass Band Of New Orleans : Jazz At Preservation Hall
--Pete Fountain : Alive In New Orleans
but I let it pass :sad: will see if they are still available

Any other recommendation of "cool Jazz"
Thanks

If you liked Dave Brubeck, sure you will like this one too.

one of my favourite album

A soulfull jazz. A great listen during late night.

 

[moktan]

i think anyone who digs cool jazz should not miss out on The Modern Jazz Quartet...i have a number of friends who do not like the sound of Milt Jackson's vibraphone ...but if anyone wants to give MJQ a try their EUROPEAN CONCERT could be a good beginning.....

 

[moktan]

Sonny Rollins' 'St. Thomas' is one of the most infectious jazz standards to have every graced the genre...this is very heart warming stuff indeed...

 

[psychotropic]

yup, and it's this dissonance that i am having trouble stomaching. I am a straight up melody person, love the pentatonic scale and love 80s rock. The problem with a lot of the jazz i hear is that there's just too much of this dissonance. I am told that this is something you dislike initially and get used to, but i've not managed to get used to it. I've listened to and enjoyed a lot of jazz fusion including this band called Metro, and some stuff from Miles Davis and Thelonious Monk, but there's too much of it that I hear which is just not pleasant to my ears. Oh yes, I am not a fan of the blues either.

Is there any hope for me in this jazz world still? Or should I give up?

(i) Dissonance: dissonance in music means two or more tones that sound harsh to the ear when played together..(play any key of the piano and one or two more keys immediately next to it at the same time..what we get is dissonance since the vibrations are so similar that they clash instead of blending harmoniously..) Dissonance accounts for the 'blues' sound of jazz.
...but when used extravagantly it is what makes some jazz sound so discordant and unpleasing to some ears ..

 

[moktan]

i guess there are no easy answers to this...modern jazz after all is very much an acquired taste...(take the profligacy of 'free jazz' for instance..it seeks to take an almost nihilistic stand against all the chordal systems that have marked the beautiful music of past..their stance is one of rebellion against all known musical theory and harmony and one that will appeal only to the musically adventurous and 'informed'.. but then having said that, as in all things, with time even the most 'outrageous' practices and theories whether it be in 'fashion' or 'physics' or 'public morality' will find acceptance ...rock and roll and all that goes with it, is a case in point)....so if your idea of music is that it should be in the mold of the old school ' organization of sound towards beauty' (Spaeth) you may need to give the whole things some more time......once you get acquainted with the vocabulary of this genre you may begin to like it ...and then it will grow on you in such a way that you may perhaps begin to call it the real music...
just my two pence worth of thoughts and nothing more...

 

[psychotropic]

thanks for that reference and introducing me to spaeth and such concepts on music. Looks like there's a ton there for me to read as well. Yes, I am definitely a believer in the 'organisation of sound towards beauty' school of thought. Which is why i enjoy and sometimes love western classical music, but have never loved a piece of jazz music anywhere as much. I have enjoyed some a fair bit, but nothing has ever held a candle to a good piece of 'ordered' melody whether it's from mozart or van halen.

 

[coaltrain]

Hi coaltrain
Also dug out vinyl of "Buddy Tate and the dollar Band" and liked (1) Heyt Mazurki and (2) Dogging around
Any other recommendation of "cool Jazz"
Thanks

you're full of surprises hiten! i truly envy anyone with a turntable. i gave up on vinyl about 20 years ago, and have been trying to replicate the sound of analogue with digital ever since!

anyway, back on topic! do check out the great albums recommended by myriad, suresh and moktan. i'm not sure which of these artistes will be available here in india, but the following names will give you a taste of cool jazz:
chet baker, stan getz, gerry mulligan, lee konitz, lester young (to name a few)

having said that, and based on your likes, i strongly suspect that what you're looking for is jazz that 'swings': a finger snapping beat, a funky bassline, and lyrical solos. in which case, don't worry about genres like cool jazz. the following albums will match the feel of songs you like, such as take five and so what:
- horace silver: song for my father
- lee morgan: the sidewinder
- herbie hancock: empyrean isles
- charles mingus: mingus ah um
- stanley turrentine: easy walker
- sonny clark: cool struttin'
- big john patton: let em roll
- thelonius monk: straight, no chaser

again, i'm not sure about availability. however, as almost all these albums are from the 'blue note' label, you should definitely visit the blue note website and check out their online radio. you'll get to hear a lot of cool music and, over a period of time, be able to figure out which albums are worth purchasing.

and do keep us posted on what you've heard and liked!

 

[coaltrain]

i think anyone who digs cool jazz should not miss out on The Modern Jazz Quartet...i have a number of friends who do not like the sound of Milt Jackson's vibraphone ...but if anyone wants to give MJQ a try their EUROPEAN CONCERT could be a good beginning.....

completely with you on the vibe 'vibe' moktan!

if you're a milt jackson fan, do check out bobby hutcherson if you haven't already. he's like a thelonius monk on vibes. some of his best work:

 

[coaltrain]

yup, and it's this dissonance that i am having trouble stomaching. I am a straight up melody person, love the pentatonic scale and love 80s rock. The problem with a lot of the jazz i hear is that there's just too much of this dissonance. I am told that this is something you dislike initially and get used to, but i've not managed to get used to it. I've listened to and enjoyed a lot of jazz fusion including this band called Metro, and some stuff from Miles Davis and Thelonious Monk, but there's too much of it that I hear which is just not pleasant to my ears. Oh yes, I am not a fan of the blues either.

Is there any hope for me in this jazz world still? Or should I give up?

dissonant music? kind of an oxymoron, wouldn't you say?

yes, there is a lot of jazz that is difficult to digest. as much as i worship at the altar of st.john, i can only listen to coltrane's 'ascension' once a year. (11 guys improvising simultaneously!)

but then you listen to something like 'goodbye pork pie hat' by charles mingus, and you realise that there is breathtaking beauty in ALL forms of music. and all you have to do is keep your ears, and mind, open.

of course there's hope! you like good music. and there's plenty of good music in jazz. the fun part is finding out where it is

 

[marsilians]

dissonant music? kind of an oxymoron, wouldn't you say?

yes, there is a lot of jazz that is difficult to digest. as much as i worship at the altar of st.john, i can only listen to coltrane's 'ascension' once a year. (11 guys improvising simultaneously!)

but then you listen to something like 'goodbye pork pie hat' by charles mingus, and you realise that there is breathtaking beauty in ALL forms of music. and all you have to do is keep your ears, and mind, open.

of course there's hope! you like good music. and there's plenty of good music in jazz. the fun part is finding out where it is

Fully agree with your take. If someone wants to ease in a bit before taking on the hardcore likes of Thelonius or Miles D, or Stan Getz, then Duke Ellington/Louis Armstrong, Wynton Marsalis or Rudresh Mahantappa are excellent intro's into the genre.

 

[moktan]

another excellent way to savor the diverse offerings of jazz would be to sample some vocalese...unlike scat where the singer makes 'unintelligible' sounds, in vocalese, lyrics are sung to tunes that were initially meant for instrumental renditions...
some names that easily come to mind are MANHATTAN TRANSFER and Jon Hendricks ...
Jazz writer Leonard Feather called Jon the poet Laurette of Jazz while according to wiki, a Time magazine article called him the James Joyce of Jive..
a DVD that i treasure is of Jon and other members of his family sing in a tribute concert at Cannes to the Bird (Charlie Parker) its called Bird Men and Bird Songs and feature other contemporaries of the man such as Phil Woods ...the vocalese rendition of Billy's Bounce is especially electrifying...they even do the sublime Parkers Mood...

 

[psychotropic]

i have and love manhattan transfer...yes!

MANHATTAN TRANSFER

 

[Hiten]

sorry everyone to make this thread jazz specific

coaltrain
I gave up on vinyl about 20 years ago, and have been trying to replicate the sound of analogue with digital ever since!

Yes vinyls is what I mostly listen to infact have only few cds and saving money to buy budget hifi system. Also have noted down few albums/artist form this and other thread for future purchase.

coaltrain
having said that, and based on your likes, I strongly suspect that what you're looking for is jazz that 'swings': a finger snapping beat, a funky bassline, and lyrical solos.

I think thats what I like, thanks for understanding, will check out other artists on amazon or sites you mentioned.
BTW listened to following on you tube
@ moktan -- Modern Jazz Quartet "Django" liked it but as you said didn't like vibraphone but liked vibraphone in Bobby Hutcherson at following link in fact loved it
YouTube - Bobby Hutcherson
@ Myriad : Take Ten is equally beautiful
Was just wondering if learning more technical details/things of music takes the fun out of enjoying music or helps in enjoying music ?

 

[moktan]

could your not liking the 'vibraphone' be attributed to the absence of dissonance?? i mean did the artificial 'smoothness' of the sound turn you off???

 

[Hiten]

moktan
Now you are making me nervous. As confessed in my first post I dont know a thing about music, and listened to only few pieces of jazz after start of this thread. Only wanted to put my opinion so I can get to know more tracks which are of my liking with help of fellow members.

But If I may dare with chances of getting ridiculed...
I found sound of vibraphone didn't sound cohesive with the whole thing. or may be with the lack of experience I have preconcieved idea about jazz music
Thanks