TV Buying Guide - LED (LCD) or Plasma

[just4kix]

I am new to the forum and looking for your opinions on choosing a HDTV for my living room. My budget is 80 to 90k (max). The size I am looking at is 40 to 42 inch (can't go beyond that with a viewing distance of 7 ft). My requirements are

1. Mostly watching 2D content like news / movies / sports on TV / DVD - with ocassional 3D viewing
2. Not into gaming
3. Smart TV features are nice to have (as future-proof features)
4. Not much sunlight in my Living room (hv curtains) & I watch TV mostly in dim light

I am unable to decide between the two models - Sony Bravia LED HX850 (40 in) and Panasonic Viera Plasma ST50 /GT50 (42 in). As you can see, the basic question boils down to - Plasma vs. LCD/LED. Sony HX850 is arguably the best LED TV of 2012 (as per various reviews I read), I am impresssed by the overall PQ- Brightness / Black level / Contrast etc, but it's expensive now (90k).

I am yet to have a look at Pana 2012 models ST50 or GT50 but given to understand that the pricing would be somewhat closer (possible a little less than Sony's). And what I heard from the reviews that the PQ is unmatched in either of these two models (I am not considering VT50 as it's available only in bigger sizes). While pictures on Plasma sets looks more "life-like" (realistic) in compared to LEDs (super-bright and crisp) , I hv two major concerns:

1. Power consumption of Plasma Sets - 300 W (rated) for Pana ST50 vs. 115W for Sony HX850. For a daily 4 hr (average). viewing, the annual consumptiion difference works out to be 270 KWH - needing additional 2K (approx. @7.50 per KWH) on energy cost per year. For a 10 year ownership, it could be 20k (rising energy price balanced against rupee depreciation) - which is something difficult to ignore

2. With the research / technology innovation efforts drfiting towards LED/ OLED arena, I am a bit skeptical of the future of Plasma. Though big names like Panasonic, Samsung & LG (to some extent) are holding the fort for Plasma, with the rising manufacturing cost for Plasma panels and poor consumer adoption can lead to extinction of Plasma in next few years. This is particularly true for India, where we don't hv a strong user base for Plasma HDTVs and manitenance can be a nightmare in long run.

Any thoughts / opinions will be hightly appreciated.

Based on the two issues that worry and matter to you, you should go with LED.

 

[lake1988]

Yes. Very happy.

Thanks dude.hyeah:

 

[just4kix]

Thanks dude.hyeah:

My dear Sir,

It is not a question of the idiots vs. the learned. It is also not a question of "better technology". Question is "what suits your requirement?"

Both the following are "excellent" and "quality" bags:

Both have their own purposes. "Quality is conformance to requirements".

Just saying that one is good and other is bad is plain prejudice.

 

[cellar_door]

How much difference does resolution make? Lets say I was looking at a plasma that does 1024x768, would it be good for 720p and 1080p input from games (Xbox 360 and PS3) and Blu Rays?

 

[lake1988]

My dear Sir,

It is not a question of the idiots vs. the learned. It is also not a question of "better technology". Question is "what suits your requirement?"

Both the following are "excellent" and "quality" bags:

Both have their own purposes. "Quality is conformance to requirements".

Just saying that one is good and other is bad is plain prejudice.

so you don't consider solid state to be better than gas filled tube tech..

 

[aakashr]

Based on the two issues that worry and matter to you, you should go with LED.

without doubt you should go with PLASMA!!!. If your living room was flooded with bright light I might have suggested LED but thankfully you do not have that problem. Are you willing to compromise on picture quality to conserve a bit of electricity..........think about it.
I don't want to get into the Plasma vs LED debate, there are plenty of threads on that. But if you want to make a wise decision it has to be plasma. If you want to go with the masses then by all means go with LED, but remember you will be loosing on picture quality which is available at a much cheaper price compared to LED.
And I beg to differ with people who say plasma is redundant or obsolete. Maybe when LED finally manages to catch up with plasma in terms of picture quality, then perhaps, not before!!!
Have a look at the Panasonic 2012 plasma's, you will be pleasantly surprised.
For those who are not aware there was a 2012 tv shoot out to determine the BEST tv of 2012 judged by industry experts and also by consumers...........I am not going to disclose the winner here, but all LED aficionados will be shocked!!!

 

[just4kix]

so you don't consider solid state to be better than gas filled tube tech..

Solid state is not necessarily better my friend. It may have other advantages. The tube valve electronics of yesterday were not failures or bad. They gave away to integrated electronics because the silicon chip was so much compact, could have complex circuits, less power hungry, efficient, etc. The earliest transistors were no better than valves. It is only after 40 years of R&D that they became better.

When it comes to plasma vs. LCD/LED, the later has still a long catching up to do in terms of picture quality, black levels, response time, colour reproduction, etc. And then light bleeding is also a big factor against LED. But this is not what I am saying; everyone is saying that including the experts. These are the basic things that matter in video regardless of the technology. Even you have not been able to provide a single decisive argument against these. This is the truth today and the truth must be acknowledged - however inconvenient.

LED have their own set of advantages. Maybe things will change in future and LED will surpass plasma in terms of PQ, Blacks, etc. Maybe both LED and plasma will be obsoleted by OLED. Maybe OLED will never take off. Or it may just happen that OLED will complete replace LCD/LED but plasma may still continue. Can anyone realistically predict?

But whatever happens in future, your EX520 will still be EX520 or someone's ST30 will still be ST30. How will either one benefit or loose whatever happens? In fact, both will be losers.

So in essence, buy what appeals to oneself today. Once again, I reiterate, I am not against LED and it may just happen that I may end up buying LED because of LED advantages mentioned.

 

[mylgcookie]

Global LCD TV Shipments Fall for the First Time Ever in Q112 - DisplaySearchPost as many as topic from cnet and avs forum but it's not gonna negate the fact that total plasma purchase will decrease...just see the plasma shipment number in the second URL..it's even below CRT shipment...lol.
2012 LCD TV Forecast Lowered to 216M Units; Solid Growth Still Expected in Key Market Segments - DisplaySearch

Dear lake1988,

As stated earlier, i am not hear to argue / compare LED & plasma technology. i just posting neutral information about LEDs & PLASMAs to clear the myth about both & educate ppl.

Thanks & Have a Nice Day!!!

 

[just4kix]

How much difference does resolution make? Lets say I was looking at a plasma that does 1024x768, would it be good for 720p and 1080p input from games (Xbox 360 and PS3) and Blu Rays?

Resolution will make a big difference at close distances. For a 42", a distance of over 12', the difference will be minimal in most cases. In fact 90% will not feel any difference at all.

But it is better to have 1080p if the budget permits - basically be (slightly) future proof (see footnote).

Note that Ultra High Definition (or UHD @ 4320p) is already out of the labs. It cannot be commerciallized yet because of costs, bandwidth requirement, etc.

 

[mylgcookie]

Solid state is not necessarily better my friend. It may have other advantages. The tube valve electronics of yesterday were not failures or bad. They gave away to integrated electronics because the silicon chip was so much compact, could have complex circuits, less power hungry, efficient, etc. The earliest transistors were no better than valves. It is only after 40 years of R&D that they became better.

When it comes to plasma vs. LCD/LED, the later has still a long catching up to do in terms of picture quality, black levels, response time, colour reproduction, etc. And then light bleeding is also a big factor against LED. But this is not what I am saying; everyone is saying that including the experts. These are the basic things that matter in video regardless of the technology. Even you have not been able to provide a single decisive argument against these. This is the truth today and the truth must be acknowledged - however inconvenient.

LED have their own set of advantages. Maybe things will change in future and LED will surpass plasma in terms of PQ, Blacks, etc. Maybe both LED and plasma will be obsoleted by OLED. Maybe OLED will never take off. Or it may just happen that OLED will complete replace LCD/LED but plasma may still continue. Can anyone realistically predict?

But whatever happens in future, your EX520 will still be EX520 or someone's ST30 will still be ST30. How will either one benefit or loose whatever happens? In fact, both will be losers.

So in essence, buy what appeals to oneself today. Once again, I reiterate, I am not against LED and it may just happen that I may end up buying LED because of LED advantages mentioned.

WELL SAID. A TRUE FACT. +1
:clapping::clapping::clapping:

 

[lake1988]

Please explain how LED gonna obsolete...OLED is a type of LED...

And most of people can google about various terms of plasma/led details..they don't need explanation on these..

 

[just4kix]

Please explain how LED gonna obsolete...OLED is a type of LED...

And most of people can google about various terms of plasma/led details..they don't need explanation on these..

My dear Sir, once more, once again you harp and comment on something without studying the technology within or understanding the concept.

Yes, OLED is a type of LED but it is completely different than LED of today. The LED's of today are not really LEDs but LCD's backlit or edgelit with LED's. In any LED backlit LCD, the LED provides white light, which then goes through a stack primarily consisting of a polarizer, a liquid crystal, and another polarizer. This stack basically acts like a shutter, modulating how much light comes through each individual subpixel for each frame. The light then goes through a color filter, generally red green and blue, to produce the full color image you see. LED's are thinner than fluorescent backlights and also give a wider color spectrum, which is much of what you see in the improved picture. Otherwise technically they aren't much different than traditional LCD's.

In that sense, LED TVs of today do not belong to a new class technology. As stated earlier, it is old wine in new bottle or just a new blend of a whiskey.

Meanwhile OLED is really true LED.

OLED really is a whole new large-screen technology. The flat panel is made up of millions of tiny LEDs. The O in OLED stands for organic which means there is carbon within the molecules of the emissive (light producing) layer of the panel. Large-screen OLED panels need no lamps -- they are self illuminating.

The greatest attribute of OLED is the ability to have the deepest blacks of any flat panel technology. Unlike LED backlighting, which at best can only dim the LCD image in regions, OLEDs can produce a very low luminescence level down the individual pixel. This ability coupled with bright whites is why OLEDs are expected to have the highest contrast. OLEDs are very fast devices, changing intensity faster the best plasmas and the fastest (240 Hz) LED LCDs. This means there's no risk of motion blur.

OLEDs can make more colors than CCFL or LED panels. While impressive, this may not translate to a significant asset, since HDTV itself is limited to a specific color palette, one that a number of plasmas and LED HDTV already can meet or exceed.

Source: What's the difference between OLED TVs and LED TVs? - Gadgetbox on NBCNews.com

It is precisely because of the above, that LED (read LCD) will become obsolete. At the moment, OLED panel (actually a wafer thin, bendable strip) is phenomenally expensive to manufacture in large sizes. Hence OLED TV is still some distance away.

Sir, please enlighten yourself and stop being obtuse. If you say that LED TV is best for you, no one can challenge you. But if you say that LED TV is better because it is a recent phenomenon/technology, then be happy that you have the best. After all, ignorance is bliss.

Anyway, this is my last word on the subject.

 

[lake1988]

I am talking about the light source...OLED diode is a type of LED diode...not asking about panel...

 

[Audiodoc]

oled displays are great for black levels as well as colors the only problems is the longevity of Oleds.

 

[Ashutosh78]

every on has a preference to technology and they own one piece of that technology themselves. I always thought that this forum was about discussing / enlightening ourselves from experience or expertise of other members about things that we thought we knew but we did not and then to make smarter decisions for the next time.

the above discussion feels as if we are trying to defend one technology against other while none of this technology has been invented by us.

My own experience every time read a forum or a article about plasma vs lcd got convinced that plasma is better went to the showroom the dealer showed me plasma tv's and lcd's and was convince without doubt that LCDs are better (they appeared better) on the floor. this happened two times once when i bought a 32" and then a 42 inch.

as luck may have it my uncle was selling his 53" plasma for a 3d projector at a very low price in exchange. i offered him the same money and got it home. and wow the difference is remarkable as there is no artificial brightness that will hurt eyes after long hours of watching.

watching cricket is a pleasure as there is no blur in the night sky when the ball is hit in the sky and watching HD channels the colours are so pleasing and natural.

I agree during day time the curtains are a must to just reduce the room brightness by that little bit otherwise the glare is disconcerting. however my experience is at this moment more satisfied with the old plasma than with my new 42" and 32 inch LCDs.

and trust me my friends have come over and have been cursing themselves for not getting a plasma

(though I am conscious that this does hurt the green initiative required today considering the power crisis our country is facing but very satisfied with PQ of the plasma)

 

[cellar_door]

Resolution will make a big difference at close distances. For a 42", a distance of over 12', the difference will be minimal in most cases. In fact 90% will not feel any difference at all.

But it is better to have 1080p if the budget permits - basically be (slightly) future proof (see footnote).

Note that Ultra High Definition (or UHD @ 4320p) is already out of the labs. It cannot be commerciallized yet because of costs, bandwidth requirement, etc.

Thanks. I think I will be ok with the current resolution then. My sitting distance is 10 feet and I just wanted to make sure it wont affect the picture aspect ratio or anything like that.

 

[kingfisher]

Plasma - The Cindrella of the Television World

This is not another LCD Plasma debate.It is my small attempt to appreciate the much ignored Plasma TVs. Even now there is no TV in this world is able to produce Ultimate black and almost Infinite contrast ratio produced by Pioneers kuros which are still claimed to be the worlds best HDTV since 2008.They say panasonic is nearing the pinnacle but not yet.

The still-unsurpassed black-level performance of Pioneer's Kuro plasmas are attributed to two technologies : MgO coating on phosphor layer( a protective layer in PDP ) and spatial discharge( used for luminous efficacy). But it is not yet known that panasonic is using these or not ( because it acquired Pioneer and most of its engineers ) , or it may reserved those for forthcoming VT models , who knows !.

What Panasonic has been trying hard is to improve luminous efficacy of its panel which is the key to produce brighter ,low power consumption and low cost panels with higher grayscale gradations.

The reasons why plasmas lost ground to LCD are plenty like cheaper and brighter LCD panels,image retention, smaller screen size of LCD. Despite all the odds,Plasma has inherent advantages like motion performance, higher contrast ratio, deeper blacks, and low cost at larger sizes.

When plasmas lost ground to LCD TVs and Pioneers net loss of around 750 millions (during 2009) ,it not only gave up Plasma but also its LCD production !.


These are some of relevant ,old but good urls for reference:

Pioneer plasmas promise deepest black levels yet

Panasonic plasma black-level loss measured in long-term test

Pioneers Kuro Killing: A Tipping Point in the Plasma Era

Panasonic TC-P54V10 Reviewed: Worthy Successor to Pioneer Kuro

Teaching plasma to follow LCD's lead

The Future Still Looks Bright for Plasma TVs

 

[aakashr]

Plasma - The Cindrella of the Television World

This is not another LCD Plasma debate.It is my small attempt to appreciate the much ignored Plasma TVs. Even now there is no TV in this world is able to produce Ultimate black and almost Infinite contrast ratio produced by Pioneers kuros which are still claimed to be the worlds best HDTV since 2008.They say panasonic is nearing the pinnacle but not yet.

The still-unsurpassed black-level performance of Pioneer's Kuro plasmas are attributed to two technologies : MgO coating on phosphor layer( a protective layer in PDP ) and spatial discharge( used for luminous efficacy). But it is not yet known that panasonic is using these or not ( because it acquired Pioneer and most of its engineers ) , or it may reserved those for forthcoming VT models , who knows !.

What Panasonic has been trying hard is to improve luminous efficacy of its panel which is the key to produce brighter ,low power consumption and low cost panels with higher grayscale gradations.

The reasons why plasmas lost ground to LCD are plenty like cheaper and brighter LCD panels,image retention, smaller screen size of LCD. Despite all the odds,Plasma has inherent advantages like motion performance, higher contrast ratio, deeper blacks, and low cost at larger sizes.

When plasmas lost ground to LCD TVs and Pioneers net loss of around 750 millions (during 2009) ,it not only gave up Plasma but also its LCD production !.


These are some of relevant ,old but good urls for reference:

Pioneer plasmas promise deepest black levels yet

Panasonic plasma black-level loss measured in long-term test

Pioneers Kuro Killing: A Tipping Point in the Plasma Era

Panasonic TC-P54V10 Reviewed: Worthy Successor to Pioneer Kuro

Teaching plasma to follow LCD's lead

The Future Still Looks Bright for Plasma TVs

Finally............I see mention of KURO, was beginning to wonder why nobody has come forward with it, having contributed so much to Plasma and even television technology in general. Happy to see it!!! It is sad when people without getting the facts or the history right are waiting to dismiss Plasma technology and are blinded by the marketing hype of LED/LCD.

 

[longshanks]

so you don't consider solid state to be better than gas filled tube tech..

Solid state electronics evolved from gas filled tube technology and now gas filled technology is superior...nice explanation...lol.

lol that was funny i guess this is a classic example of commenting without proper knowledge of both technologies or any experience in listening to them.


OLED is a type of LED, no body is going to deny that but in an OLED tv the OLED's create the pixels and it makes up for the entire panel which displays the picture.In an LED back lit LCD the Liquid crystal panel(LCD) is what displays the picture and few LED's add to the light out put in the name of back lighting, so both are totally different concepts.

OLED,PLASMA and CRT don't depend on back lighting hence they follow similar concept,they also show much better real world contrast,blacks and colors compared to LCD(specially LED back lit LCD?)

 

[lake1988]

In CRT and plasma both have phosphor coating inside of the tube and light is generated due to electron hitting that coating...but incase of LED light is directly generated from diode itself..so what's the point of laughing?