46 inch plus TV .. HX750 or HX850 or ST50

You can still see the thread in avsforum on plasma burn in/IR ,its very much active means these are still issues on a plasma http://www.avsforum.com/t/949107/master-burn-in-ir-break-in-thread-part-ii-all-posts-here-only

What i see in forums here and in AVforums uk /AVS forums USA is that plasma owners are very defensive about plasma and majority of those owners only own plasmas.

Some owners who are ex owners of high end plasma like kuro and currently own high end lcds like sharp elite and HX92 are more of neutral in their opinions.They see and accept the pros and cons of lcd and plasma.

Where as most plasma only owners just refuse to acknowledge the cons of the plasma and pros of lcds.

I have seen threads in avsforums where owners who started a thread on their plasma burn in , being treated as if they committed a Sin.

I must admit,You are very brave to post this here but seeing that this post is from a very senior member, hopefully the plasma fanboys will stop their blind plasma worship and face the reality.
 
46HX850 with bill for 1.10 lac where? Not in Pune right? :sad:

avmax... indiatimes is selling it @ 1.1 lacs (free shipping) with Sony India warranty

Buy Sony Bravia 3D TV KDL- 46 HX850 online, Sony Bravia 3D TV KDL- 46 HX850 Price, Reviews @ Indiatimes Shopping

They sell genuine products.. I have bought many products from them.. A Nikon camera, blackberry 9360 (5 months back) .. so you know that 1.1 lacs is official now... :licklips::clapping:

Infibeam is selling at 1.14 lacs

Swageo-- the MRP is 1.23.. most of the shops are quoting 1.15 or so with a l'il bit of negotiation.. if you negotiate hard you'll most probably get one at 1.1 lacs at any store..
 
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etio.. thanks for coming over & commenting.. there are people here giving judgement on the pros & cons of both.. but frankly speaking as of today.. the cons for ST50 is more than pros.. hence the balance tilts heavily towards HX850, and if you consider the brand reputation (for gen public) Sony is the Badshah.. others pales in comparison..

The only place where Pana ST50 scores is that, it offers very good PQ, along with a bigger screen at a lesser price... and if you are a movie lover like me.. then it means a lot...
 
I am not sure buying a TV from an online shopping site is a good idea. What say @manzb ?

What if there is some damage during transportation and stuff like that ?
 
avmax.. not that I am advocating buying from online site.. what I am saying is that you can take it as reference .. in any case, they give warranty and I think installation normally done by Sony people only.. so any damage, they gonna change you the display...
 
You can still see the thread in avsforum on plasma burn in/IR ,its very much active means these are still issues on a plasma http://www.avsforum.com/t/949107/master-burn-in-ir-break-in-thread-part-ii-all-posts-here-only

What i see in forums here and in AVforums uk /AVS forums USA is that plasma owners are very defensive about plasma and majority of those owners only own plasmas.

Some owners who are ex owners of high end plasma like kuro and currently own high end lcds like sharp elite and HX92 are more of neutral in their opinions.They see and accept the pros and cons of lcd and plasma.

Where as most plasma only owners just refuse to acknowledge the cons of the plasma and pros of lcds.

I have seen threads in avsforums where owners who started a thread on their plasma burn in , being treated as if they committed a Sin.

I am a plasma fan..but always acknowledge the cons like special care etc..but the main thing of a TV the picture quality......the lcd fans never acknowledge that plasma is king reagrding this.the movie mood....how people like the movie in a led....looks like a TV series....:)
anyway the argument never stops
 
I must admit,You are very brave to post this here but seeing that this post is from a very senior member, hopefully the plasma fanboys will stop their blind plasma worship and face the reality.

what reality.....movies like nat geo docu in leds......:lol:
 
avmax.. not that I am advocating buying from online site.. what I am saying is that you can take it as reference .. in any case, they give warranty and I think installation normally done by Sony people only.. so any damage, they gonna change you the display...

That's true. Let's hope the price goes down on the 46HX850 by Diwali :yahoo:
 
I am a movie lover and nothing but the best PQ mattered. I actually think that I compromised a little with ST50 and that I should have gone with GT50. But that is another story that we can reserve for the wet afternoons. :) The gist was with the 10-15k saved, I can buy many more movies and besides I have a projector at home too.

Please note - not bashing HX850. It is a very good TV indeed.
 
+1 for just4kix and prosenjit..................
somewhere in the midst of all this, we forget the primary reason to buy any tv should essentially be picture quality. People will talk about everything else but this.............all the bells and whistles that a tv should have but conveniently forget, the main essence of any tv should be PICTURE QUALITY!!!
LED/LCD might give you everything that a plasma might not but can they give you everything what a plasma can at the same price???.............something to think about!!! Maybe which is why as adder mentioned plasma is very popular with movie aficionados in UK and US.............they might appreciate and understand this simple logic.
ps : no offence to LED/LCD users and yes sony HX850 still rocks!!!
 
You can still see the thread in avsforum on plasma burn in/IR ,its very much active means these are still issues on a plasma http://www.avsforum.com/t/949107/master-burn-in-ir-break-in-thread-part-ii-all-posts-here-only

What i see in forums here and in AVforums uk /AVS forums USA is that plasma owners are very defensive about plasma and majority of those owners only own plasmas.

Some owners who are ex owners of high end plasma like kuro and currently own high end lcds like sharp elite and HX92 are more of neutral in their opinions.They see and accept the pros and cons of lcd and plasma.

Where as most plasma only owners just refuse to acknowledge the cons of the plasma and pros of lcds.

I have seen threads in avsforums where owners who started a thread on their plasma burn in , being treated as if they committed a Sin.

So true...
 
Well you definitely made the right choice just4kix. :)

As I mentioned already, CNET reviews are done in a pitch black room where it's no surprise the HX850 didn't perform as well as ST50 according to them. Also the fact that David is a plasma lover and that he isn't particularly good at calibrating LED sets makes it quite clear why in his review ST50 is made out to be quite a lot better than HX850.
A well calibrated HX850 will perform better than what David suggests.

Sound and Vision Mag, What HiFi, Home Theater Mag are all not just Internet tech sites like CNET but publications as well and are highly respected. They are specialists in Home Cinema equipment reviews unlike CNET which is just an Internet jack of all trades master of none tech blog/site.

I am not going to include review sites that give subjective reviews, so including only trustworthy sites that back up reviews with quantitative data both ST50 & HX850 get 5 on 5 or 10 on 10 for PQ. So for two TVs that score 10/10 it's really not fair to say that one is a notch below the other.

Color accuracy is similar, contrast ratio is similar (ST50 gets >5000:1, HX850 gets 2800:! with Local Dimming OFF, 4500:1 with Local Dimming on LOW, >5000:1 with Local Dimming on Standard)

Black Levels for the two are also similar with the HX850 Local Dimming on Standard Mode, ST50 still is slightly better.

They are both exceptional. ST50 is better in darkness and HX850 is better in daylight/bright room lighting.

Viewing angles is one area where HX850 is no match to the ST50 though. ST50 destroys the HX850 in this area.

Then it's all down to LED vs Plasma. Whether you prefer more vibrant colors or more natural colors, solid blacks most of the times and very good blacks in complete darkness, or only good black levels most of the times and excellent blacks in complete darkness, brighter picture or a more soothing not so bright picture.


I was actually seriously considering the ST50/GT50 as it would have been nice to have both a top end LCD as well a top end Plasma at home but unfortunately there were a lot of things that made me forget about that plan.

Also I must make it clear I have nothing against Panasonic, in fact I prefer Panasonic for home appliance products and I'd say they would be my brand of choice if Sony did not exist.

First, the design of both ST/GT50 is uninspiring to say the least. I really wish Panasonic spent more money on hiring better designers. I almost felt like I had gone back in time when I demoed the GT/ST50 right after spending some time with HX850.

Second, the 3D image was very impressive with very good layer separation and no crosstalk, but it was a bit too dim for my liking.

The same goes for the overall 2D PQ. Any hint of sunlight makes the picture look too dim and blacks look more grey than some mid range LED sets.

But in very low light no doubt it puts out a stunning picture. I'd personally pick the ST/GT50 over the HX850 if I watched TV in a completely dark room all the time. The brightness is perfect for a dark room, 3D is amazing, black levels are inky, colors are much more realistic and almost have a soothing feel. I really like that, but unfortunately I am buying a 40/42 inch TV to use in my room as a monitor half the time and I don't think I can live with the dim Plasma picture. Not to mention the possibilities of Image retention and burn in.

And also one area where the HX850 has an edge is in delivering an almost 3D like 2D picture depending on content. Not just HX850 but any good LED set has almost a 3D feel which Plasmas don't have. Of course that isn't particularly a plus point as some may like that and some won't. I personally enjoy that characteristic.

Also I don't mean to offend any Panasonic TV owners, but their remote controls also need to be designed better. Almost feels like a plastic toy.

But all said, ST50 is a brilliant TV and probably the best value high performance TV EVER !!!. You are and should be proud of owning the ST50. ;).



Also I think you misunderstood, nowhere in the review or did I personally say HX850 has better PQ than ST50. The reviewer has conducted a very detailed shootout with quantitative data and proof to backup his claims if you read the whole review. He picks the HX850 as its the overall better package, not that it has the best PQ possible (under certain conditions only).

P.S. I guess the post is too long now to be worth reading haha. :p.

Excellent thoughts provided.. by no means its long...good work...I really appreciate your unbiased view towards top brands. Thanks....
 
@ avmaxfan Hi Sony HX850 is out of stock right now in grey market but i dont think you will get Sony HX850 55inch for less than 1.50L. Why not Sony HX850 46inch for 1.10L withbill? He is giving me the best price for Sony HX850 withbill in one hour. Sony HX750 is in stock in grey and you can get 55inch Sony HX750 for 1,05,000/- & 46inch Sony HX750 for 75k. Yes the product will be genuine but they always check the tv when they receive it.

How about 40 inch HX850. Is this available in Grey Market and what would be its approx price. I am in Bangalore and love it if someone can suggest a dealer or shop name.
 
You can still see the thread in avsforum on plasma burn in/IR ,its very much active means these are still issues on a plasma http://www.avsforum.com/t/949107/master-burn-in-ir-break-in-thread-part-ii-all-posts-here-only

What i see in forums here and in AVforums uk /AVS forums USA is that plasma owners are very defensive about plasma and majority of those owners only own plasmas.

Some owners who are ex owners of high end plasma like kuro and currently own high end lcds like sharp elite and HX92 are more of neutral in their opinions.They see and accept the pros and cons of lcd and plasma.

Where as most plasma only owners just refuse to acknowledge the cons of the plasma and pros of lcds.

I have seen threads in avsforums where owners who started a thread on their plasma burn in , being treated as if they committed a Sin.

I will only speak for myself and I beg to differ on some points here.

  • I am not a blind plasma supporter
  • I did a survey for 2 years before taking a decision
  • I readily admit all plasma flaws
  • I never ever said that IR is not an issue but I am saying that it is overstated
  • I am totally convinced that only the top-end LEDs can come close to plasma PQ but none save Sharp Elite Pro has ever tipped it

In forums such as ours, there is bound to be majority plasma supporters. This is because such forums will be full of people who give 99% weightage to all factors that contribute to PQ. And when it comes to PQ in HD, plasma remains the king at least till OLED arrives (in realistic commercial terms). My reading tells me that LED lovers or plasma bashers are unable to digest this fact and are irked that their choice is in minority. So we get all sorts of counter arguments which are quite true but many times irrational/overstated. For instance, the IR argument is brought about in such a way that the user is led to believe that the TV will be rendered useless in no time at all. Let us looks at plasma cons:

  • Suffers from reflections
  • Not suitable for brightly lit rooms; colours appear washed out
  • Suffers from IR
  • Consumes more power
  • Technology is outdated
  • Prone to spider web cracks
  • Sales are dwindling, manufacturer will stop production and you will be out of support

All the above are true. But according to me only the first two are of real consequence while the 3rd is at best something to be careful about.

If I wanted to bash LED TVs, I will say:
  • Suffer from poor angle of viewing
  • Have poor contrast ratio
  • Suffer from light bleeding
  • Provide overstaurated/unnatural colours
  • Offer low black levels
  • Poor response time, fast action scenes appear blurred with ghosting
  • Simulated anti-judder features (that bloat the TV price further) result into "soap opera effect"
  • ... and finally, LED TV is still costlier when compared to plasma counterparts

If one wants to give a balanced view there are a few ways of doing it:
  • talk on pros as well as cons of both
  • mention only good things of your favourite TV without bashing any other model
  • talk cons of both technologies

When I purchased my own TV, I did not go into a "Which TV" thread/debate. I read quietly all the posts on the internet, listed all pros and cons of both technologies, prioritized them as per my requirements, did lot of demos and then took the decision. It took two years which is an unsually long time but I confess I was always waiting for the (non-existing) discounts to be declared.

To summarize, this bashing and counter bashing is not going to get anywhere to a clear answer. There are pros and cons on both sides.
 
kix .. how true.. u have summarised both LED & Plasma very well .... excellent post for anyone considering this two hi-performing TVs with different tech

Hey as you might be aware that I am also waiting for the (non-existent) discount ;) ... dil hain ki maanta nahin ;)

Let diwali come.. the dynamics may change a bit by then..

1. 50ST50 might hit the shelves

2. Considering that already Rupee has strengthened by 6-7% (and expected go down another 3-4%).. a discount equivalent to that can be expected (or useful freebies) . whosoever does that earlier, might be able to get a better share of Festive buyers
 
To summarize, this bashing and counter bashing is not going to get anywhere to a clear answer. There are pros and cons on both sides.

In short there are and will be fans of both technologies. Its upto indivisual to adopt it.
I would just add that for movies and blu rays plasma wins and for normal viewing DTH, broadcats lcd led wins (Considering required ambience, power for both)
 
Actually I forgot to add one more dimension to the buying process..

I am planning a family holiday next season around Apr (2013) to Thailand.;) . as we are aware that Thailand is the place for cheap TVs.. how about getting the TV from there? It will save me quite a bit.. So let's say if 46HX850 is available around 60% of the best Indian price, I think it will be great bargain (getting greedy).... wat say?

Regarding the hassles, these days I think it is too common for anyone to get TV from South Asian countries.. you'll see whole lot of people doing that.. So I think that should not be a problem..
 
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