Advice on Pre Power Amps with Klipsch RP -8000F

[arunkvivek]

Another thing I forgot to mention, I am using bare cable connections at both the ends. I think banana plugs wont make much difference except ease of connection.

Bare cables are good.

You are right. But unfortunately no other room/space for me to move.

Constraints of equation solving! One thing can be done. Pull all the three couches away from speakers by two feet. This would leave 4 feet space behind the center couch for movement.
For sake of experiment remove the glass table, reposition speakers and test the change. It should drastically improve.
To tame reflections from glass, please put a heavy dhurrie on top ( it is still a compromise only). Best is to sell it if higher authorities approve

 

[Vivek Batra]

1. Just for testing, remove the centre table and the side couches. Pull out the speakers from the wall and increase the distance between them. Test with and without the sub.
2. Is the dealer local? Will he let you have a home demo? Try with bookshelves if that is possible. They can be placed wider and their drivers will be clear of the side couches.
3. Are your speaker cables 6 metres or 6 feet in length? 6 metres is way too long.

1. I can test moving things out of the way.
2. Yes the dealer is local but bookshelves may not be the possibility.
3. Yes the Cables are 6 meters long each.

 

[Vivek Batra]

Bare cables are good.

Constraints of equation solving! One thing can be done. Pull all the three couches away from speakers by two feet. This would leave 4 feet space behind the center couch for movement.
For sake of experiment remove the glass table, reposition speakers and test the change. It should drastically improve.
To tame reflections from glass, please put a heavy dhurrie on top ( it is still a compromise only). Best is to sell it if higher authorities approve

Sell the speakers or the furniture??

 

[Vivek Batra]

Both speakers & amplifier are good selection. Looks like some calibration issus.

Are you using default audissy EQ setup in av receiver ?. Try adjusting the settings manually and check whether it improves...

Did you adjust frequency response of the speakers and tried ?. Keep between 60hz to 80hz .

Set the size of speaker to small , Adjust Speaker distance settings according to your listening position.

Use the equalizer settings to reduce terrible - have balanced tone

I would also recommend moving the tower speakers little away from each other (keep atleast 5-6 feet gap), and move the sub out from center and keep it 2-3 feet away from corner.

Nowdays I have turned off the Audyssey. This sounds better (less harsh). The crossover setting is 80Hz and LFE+Mains both. With Audyssey turned to off, I can set tone levels.

I will give a try on your suggestion on layout of the components

 

[arunkvivek]

Sell the speakers or the furniture??

Center table alone speakers are innocent.. center table would admit it's guilty. No transactions until you are sure about what is wrong.

 

[Vivek Batra]

Center table alone speakers are innocent.. center table would admit it's guilty. No transactions until you are sure about what is wrong.

Yea. That's the problem at hand, to identify the culprit. I am trying to sell all the furniture anyways

 

[arunkvivek]

Yea. That's the problem at hand, to identify the culprit. I am trying to sell all the furniture anyways

Fat couches are decent bass traps. I have seen them being very effective in one of fthe FMs place. Probably selling off the two side couches and replacing them with single seaters would help.

Fundamental question -why did you purchase AVR? Do you intend to have any video application ( I could not see either a Tv or projector screen)?
If music is your sole interest, you can sell off AVR and go for a tubed based setup for your listening tastes. But that is after sorting the speaker positioning. The 12 feet width would cause reflections. You would need to treat first reflection points first. There is a thread my Hyderabad FM fixing room issues including moving a tread mill.. @sound_cycle.a well documented thread. Or you can seek professional help for room treatment if audio is the main goal.

 

[Vivek Batra]

Fat couches are decent bass traps. I have seen them being very effective in one of fthe FMs place. Probably selling off the two side couches and replacing them with single seaters would help.

Fundamental question -why did you purchase AVR? Do you intend to have any video application ( I could not see either a Tv or projector screen)?
If music is your sole interest, you can sell off AVR and go for a tubed based setup for your listening tastes. But that is after sorting the speaker positioning. The 12 feet width would cause reflections. You would need to treat first reflection points first. There is a thread my Hyderabad FM fixing room issues including moving a tread mill.. @sound_cycle.a well documented thread. Or you can seek professional help for room treatment if audio is the main goal.

Why I bought an AVR. All I wanted initially was, that I have a huge MP3 collection in my laptop and wanted to hook it up with the AVR via casting or HDMI or bluetooth. Next reason I thought Bluetooth is a good way to play music via phone. Other reason, I like AM/FM and there is a tuner in the AVR and Stereo Amps do not have that.

All my perceptions proved wrong . When I started looking for the Amps, I started with Marantz 5006/8006, Yamaha RN-803 etc I felt the need of digital inputs. That's the point where I went wrong. The dealer I bought the stuff from was interested to sell AVR's than Stereo Amps.

I never had any intention to go with multi channel or to hook my the system with TV/project most likely this will prevail in future as well.

So to sum up, entirely wrong decision. I will be happy to sell off everything and start from scratch. Learnt so many things after the purchase .

 

[Vivek Batra]

Fat couches are decent bass traps. I have seen them being very effective in one of fthe FMs place. Probably selling off the two side couches and replacing them with single seaters would help.

Fundamental question -why did you purchase AVR? Do you intend to have any video application ( I could not see either a Tv or projector screen)?
If music is your sole interest, you can sell off AVR and go for a tubed based setup for your listening tastes. But that is after sorting the speaker positioning. The 12 feet width would cause reflections. You would need to treat first reflection points first. There is a thread my Hyderabad FM fixing room issues including moving a tread mill.. @sound_cycle.a well documented thread. Or you can seek professional help for room treatment if audio is the main goal.

How to find the thread BTW?

 

[Naturelover]

Why I bought an AVR. All I wanted initially was, that I have a huge MP3 collection in my laptop and wanted to hook it up with the AVR via casting or HDMI or bluetooth. Next reason I thought Bluetooth is a good way to play music via phone. Other reason, I like AM/FM and there is a tuner in the AVR and Stereo Amps do not have that.

All my perceptions proved wrong . When I started looking for the Amps, I started with Marantz 5006/8006, Yamaha RN-803 etc I felt the need of digital inputs. That's the point where I went wrong. The dealer I bought the stuff from was interested to sell AVR's than Stereo Amps.

I never had any intention to go with multi channel or to hook my the system with TV/project most likely this will prevail in future as well.

So to sum up, entirely wrong decision. I will be happy to sell off everything and start from scratch. Learnt so many things after the purchase .

Is the source (mp3/phone/bluetooth) the weak link here? The source has to match up to the rest of the chain.
The higher you go in amplification and speakers, the more you will need to up the source as well (the player and the music).

What about the Yamaha 803? Did you test it? It is a stereo receiver with digital inputs, tuner, bluetooth, network, etc, etc.
Marantz and Quad also offer similar products. Possibly some others do too.

 

[Vivek Batra]

Is the source (mp3/phone/bluetooth) the weak link here? The source has to match up to the rest of the chain.
The higher you go in amplification and speakers, the more you will need to up the source as well (the player and the music).

What about the Yamaha 803? Did you test it? It is a stereo receiver with digital inputs, tuner, bluetooth, network, etc, etc.
Marantz and Quad also offer similar products. Possibly some others do too.

Well I am using just Spotify now and that runs independently on the AVR so no communication issues except slow internet. I guess I enquired a lot about a Stereo amp with all the digital inputs. RN 803 has no tuner I believe nor the Marantz 5006,6006,7006 and 8006 if I am not wrong.

 

[reachkalyan.kr]

Well I am using just Spotify now and that runs independently on the AVR so no communication issues except slow internet. I guess I enquired a lot about a Stereo amp with all the digital inputs. RN 803 has no tuner I believe nor the Marantz 5006,6006,7006 and 8006 if I am not wrong.

Yamaha RN 803 has tuner .Hope u are asking about FM/AM. Google it and check the backside image there is a place for antenna connection i remember.
I was thinking to go in opposite direction like you.
In my native I own Yamaha RN 803 planning to push it for DenonX4500H mainly for its connectivity options.
Now i am confused after seeing ur comments on DenonX4500H.
I would suggest use proper audio file not MP3 and Klipsch tend to harsh and more fatigue for long listening IMHO cos of horn tweeter.Hope it has one.
Don't judge the amp by Bluetooth connectivity.
Your selection is not bad I would say.
Don't judge AVR quality with stereo mode it is is not intended for it.vise versa for stereo amp/ia
Atb.

 

[Vivek Batra]

Yamaha RN 803 has tuner .Hope u are asking about FM/AM. Google it and check the backside image there is a place for antenna connection i remember.
I was thinking to go in opposite direction like you.
In my native I own Yamaha RN 803 planning to push it for DenonX4500H mainly for its connectivity options.
Now i am confused after seeing ur comments on DenonX4500H.
I would suggest use proper audio file not MP3 and Klipsch tend to harsh and more fatigue for long listening IMHO cos of horn tweeter.Hope it has one.
Don't judge the amp by Bluetooth connectivity.
Your selection is not bad I would say.
Don't judge AVR quality with stereo mode it is is not intended for it.vise versa for stereo amp/ia
Atb.

Thanks for the light on RN 803. Well I want to sell the AVR if you wana grab. It's has seen light for few hours only.

 

[Naturelover]

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[superczar]

You want clarity at low volume but have turned off dynamic vol correction ?
Can you please enable it and set it to low .

I know most people here will swear by direct stereo but for non critical listening at low vol levels, Audyssey on with dynamic vol should give you really good results

Don’t just do an A/B test.
Live with it for 1-2 days and see if you like it

Edit: did you do the full 8 point process for audyssey in a quiet room?
Please do check your audyssey curve and post it here if you can
For what its worth, playing music at reference level in direct stereo mode should give you best results in terms of clarity and imaging
However at -30db, audyssey plus dyn vol should trump direct stereo at -30

 

[Vivek Batra]

You want clarity at low volume but have turned off dynamic vol correction ?
Can you please enable it and set it to low .

I know most people here will swear by direct stereo but for non critical listening at low vol levels, Audyssey on with dynamic vol should give you really good results

Don’t just do an A/B test.
Live with it for 1-2 days and see if you like it

Edit: did you do the full 8 point process for audyssey in a quiet room?
Please do check your audyssey curve and post it here if you can
For what its worth, playing music at reference level in direct stereo mode should give you best results in terms of clarity and imaging
However at -30db, audyssey plus dyn vol should trump direct stereo at -30

Sure I can give it a try. As far as I understand, the dynamic volume is to keep the same volume level for all kinda music? I may be wrong at this. Yes I did all 8 positions Audyssey calibration. Now as many FMs suggested to move away the furniture and then recalibrate, that's would be my task for this Friday night.

Thanks for your inputs.

 

[superczar]

Sure I can give it a try. As far as I understand, the dynamic volume is to keep the same volume level for all kinda music? I may be wrong at this. Yes I did all 8 positions Audyssey calibration. Now as many FMs suggested to move away the furniture and then recalibrate, that's would be my task for this Friday night.

Thanks for your inputs.

No
It monitors the dynamic range to adjust it based on the volume levels.
In other words, it will broadly leave your audio unadjusted at reference levels while kick in at lower volumes to reduce the difference between the quietest and loudest passages
Thus the parts of the track that would be too soft to notice at your preferred low volume will stand out more clearly.

 

[Vivek Batra]

No
It monitors the dynamic range to adjust it based on the volume levels.
In other words, it will broadly leave your audio unadjusted at reference levels while kick in at lower volumes to reduce the difference between the quietest and loudest passages
Thus the parts of the track that would be too soft to notice at your preferred low volume will stand out more clearly.

I am getting excited now to try this setting. Frankly in my previous posts (somewhere else) people advised against Dynamic Volume. But worth trying for. Thanks for educating me on this.

 

[Vivek Batra]

No
It monitors the dynamic range to adjust it based on the volume levels.
In other words, it will broadly leave your audio unadjusted at reference levels while kick in at lower volumes to reduce the difference between the quietest and loudest passages
Thus the parts of the track that would be too soft to notice at your preferred low volume will stand out more clearly.

Hey I just turned on the dynamic volume to light and it bumped the volume level.

I was stupid not to try this before. Thanks a lot.

 

[arunkvivek]

Hey I just turned on the dynamic volume to light and it bumped the volume level.

I was stupid not to try this before. Thanks a lot.

Furnitures saved!!! Are you getting the desired separation and sound stage?