Building a 3-way TL speaker

[square_wave]

Easily done at my place actually ... Iam using hari sirs speakers, and they mop the floor with my more expensive PMC's. Hell I even heard some 20L avalon indra speakers in a one crore system. And they were no match either. So each to his own, when it comes to judging what floats your boat sound wise.

But that said, I will post a pic of the internal wiring of my speaker.

View attachment 73151

As is evident.. A lot of effort has been expended even on the internal wiring. No noodle thin cables used here. And I have noodle thin cheap cables inside my pmc twenty 26 as well as the qacoustics concept 40's that I have.

As we say that the prrof of the pudding is in actually listening ... So let me post another pic

View attachment 73152
That is the cabling I presently have at the back, as the crossover is external to the cabinet.. But the original cabling was also done by hari sir.And that was the first time ever that I saw left and right cables being of different width. He did mention something about how the return path has to be easier for the current, But iam too dumb at these things

For a comparison, I replaced the cables from my external crossover as under mentioned :

Tweeter - high end master class - mrp 1.8L, only made on order.. And usually used for demo of ascendo speakers.

Mid range - silitech classic 550i gold / silver cables. - mrp 2.5 L

After plugging the above two.. The delta of uplift in performance, as compared to hari sirs cables was so small, that I decided to stick with the bass cables made by hari sir .

So that's my 2 cents there .... Maybe the talk of time alignment has ruffled a lot of feathers, And as I mentioned before, and as is there in my signature below, iam mostly too dumb to talk scientific knowledge. But iam over the moon with everything built by hari sir, Yes including the cabling too

We can debate endlessly based on theory, but listening is where it. matters.

And that's my blissful sounding setup below

View attachment 73153View attachment 73153

Hi, I never knew these were made by Hari. Do you have a thread elsewhere about this journey ? Thanks so much.

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

Hi, I never knew these were made by Hari. Do you have a thread elsewhere about this journey ? Thanks so much.

It should be there in the DIY section . The post was started by hari sir, and I joined in the end after receiving them. Will try to post a link here

 

[square_wave]

It should be there in the DIY section . The post was started by hari sir, and I joined in the end after receiving them. Will try to post a link here

If the speaker is so good, we should encourage Hari to bring it to one of the audio shows.

 

[mbhangui]

If the speaker is so good, we should encourage Hari to bring it to one of the audio shows.

So agree. The speakers look so top notch and premium. Lot of hard work there.

 

[jenson]

Thanks jenson ... Yeah my main reason for the build was to seek a emotional connect with the music, and I also wanted them to be a high efficiency design, as I wanted to migrate to lower powered tube amplification down the line. They really sound smooth, and emotional, yet with a detailed and slammy presentation.

Bass on Hari's speakers sound very unique. Not forced, just there, has a nice tone. If only he had someone like sadik in thane, it'd be a lethal combo.

back to the cable conundrum please. My two cents, I like to eat my pudding, don't care how it was made, never did...if hari made them available commercially, one might latch on, and if it's good, heck we have an Indian frank tchang

With all the learnings and collaboration with his mentor, enough curiosity has been generated, hope it rings true.

My only grip in this whole equation... Such an expensive cable, but, rca by MX? thoughts?

 

[square_wave]

But they are too heavy to lug around sadly . I didn't weigh them, but it takes 3 adults to lift them. Hari sir reckons they weight close to 100 kgs each. The external crossover bovex are 8 kgs each. And the speaker plinths I got from sound foundations, weigh another 30 each. So with all that weight, really difficult to package them for safe transportation. Even I would have loved to hear them in a bigger room that can do them justice. As mine is too small to allow them to open up

From what I can see, he needs help from a good industrial designer. Everything will work fine. There are so many brands out there that do multi piece heavy speakers.

 

[aeroash]

View attachment 73152

I see no wiring on the woofer sitting on the floor. Wireless?

 

[arj]

Some Threads got wrongly merged during transfer hence correcting.

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

If the speaker is so good, we should encourage Hari to bring it to one of the audio shows.

But they are too heavy to lug around sadly . I didn't weigh them, but it takes 3 adults to lift them. Hari sir reckons they weight close to 100 kgs each. The external crossover bovex are 8 kgs each. And the speaker plinths I got from sound foundations, weigh another 30 each. So with all that weight, really difficult to package them for safe transportation. Even I would have loved to hear them in a bigger room that can do them justice. As mine is too small to allow them to open up

So agree. The speakers look so top notch and premium. Lot of hard work there.

Thanks for the kind words . My colour combination of red and white doesn't do them justice actually. Iam planning on vinyl wrapping them in matte white to give a more aesthetic look.

I was lucky enough to demo these speakers @hari's just days before it was enroute to you. Amazing indeed... Soothing to the core.

Thanks jenson ... Yeah my main reason for the build was to seek a emotional connect with the music, and I also wanted them to be a high efficiency design, as I wanted to migrate to lower powered tube amplification down the line. They really sound smooth, and emotional, yet with a detailed and slammy presentation.

 

[captrajesh]

Will try to post a link here

Don't bother. I've merged both the threads. You guys can continue the discussion.

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

Don't bother. I've merged both the threads. You guys can continue the discussion.

Thanks sir

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

Guess this is a fourth anniversary update, of my speakers

And surprisingly iam still in love with them .

I usually change kit a lot faster, but surprisingly have'nt heard anything better. Bigger brands YES.....easier to sell YES.....better sounding ..NO


Ive improved sources and amplification over the years, and these speakers just scale up to show the differences.




Ive heard a few rigs and speakers over the time. But Iam yet to hear a speaker that will tempt me for a change,. Just thought I will just say Kudos to @Hari Iyer sir, for such a build.

Unknown to most, is the love and the pain he undertook for the build. Lots of hassles with importing most of the stuff that went into building these speakers. The wiring to each driver from the binding post is again custom, and is actuallly linkwitz, and it was hand wired by hari sir.himself,. And it is not just soldering a standard audiophile wire to get the job done.. We didnt use any off the shelf wiring. He infact had his brother over to do the solder with silver for the wires and terminations hari sir had built. Adding to that is the fact that each crossover was built inside a farady cage with the best wire we could source. And we imported all the caps from europe. Nothing less. Such immense attention to detail went into the build, and it shows everyday in my listening.

So even after 4 years, actually 5 i think .....Iam still delighted with these speakers. Not cheap definitely.....but worth it in the end......And i think i owe a note of thanks to the two people who made it happen ... @prem for suggesting it to begin with, and @Hari Iyer for designing and building it to my exact tastes.

Absolutely happy in the end....which is all that matters

 

[drlowmu]

I just read this entire thread for the first time, and found it fascinating to take in. Thanks.

Nice going Hari.

Hari, when you did measurements, were you using that same heavy duty shelf, under each speaker - raising it off the floor ? .............. I bet not.

If not, I would say that the speaker's present elevation - off the floor as existing now .......... is compromising overall performance, particularly now on the bottom end..

Bass is omnidirectional, and when elevating the speakers' bottoms off the floor, one is allowing the bass frequencies to NOT project forward into the room - and with full and " on-time " energy.

When the speakers were positioned ON the floor, bass energies will travel in a continuuim. It would proceed down the front of the baffle, and take a ninety degree turn, out into the room, moving towards the listener's seated position.

As it is pictured and positioned now, the omnidirectional bass wave tucks down UNDER the bottom of the stand, between the enclosure's bottom, the stand, and the floor, into that user-generated void. Each stand's void haphazardly disperses omnidirectional bass energy to the room's rear walls and side walls, in an out-of-time manner - and with a diffuse fashion.

Bass reflection times from surrounding room walls confuse the presentation, and it slightly loses some of the originally-recording's bass energy and focus.

It is not easy to optimize this aspect of room set up. But one can try !

Someone like Prem can tell you much about positioning. My purpose in posting today is to point out this " stand " problem, at least as I as I view and experience it. Perhaps the speaker's owner may get into the " mood " one day ( ......... or over a few weeks or so ) and see if they can effect a placement difference to improve that lovely red and white creation - even more so.

Jeff

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

I just read this entire thread for the first time, and found it fascinating to take in. Thanks.

Nice going Hari.

Hari, when you did measurements, were you using that same heavy duty shelf, under each speaker - raising it off the floor ? .............. I bet not.

If not, I would say that the speaker's present elevation - off the floor as existing now .......... is compromising overall performance, particularly now on the bottom end..

Bass is omnidirectional, and when elevating the speakers' bottoms off the floor, one is allowing the bass frequencies to NOT project forward into the room - and with full and " on-time " energy.

When the speakers were positioned ON the floor, bass energies will travel in a continuuim. It would proceed down the front of the baffle, and take a ninety degree turn, out into the room, moving towards the listener's seated position.

As it is pictured and positioned now, the omnidirectional bass wave tucks down UNDER the bottom of the stand, between the enclosure's bottom, the stand, and the floor, into that user-generated void. Each stand's void haphazardly disperses omnidirectional bass energy to the room's rear walls and side walls, in an out-of-time manner - and with a diffuse fashion.

Bass reflection times from surrounding room walls confuse the presentation, and it slightly loses some of the originally-recording's bass energy and focus.

It is not easy to optimize this aspect of room set up. But one can try !

Someone like Prem can tell you much about positioning. My purpose in posting today is to point out this " stand " problem, at least as I as I view and experience it. Perhaps the speaker's owner may get into the " mood " one day ( ......... or over a few weeks or so ) and see if they can effect a placement difference to improve that lovely red and white creation - even more so.

Jeff

Hello sir

Thought Id just share that the measurements when designing the crossover were done without the current speaker plinth they are presently placed on. The speakers came with spikes to sit directly on the floor. And if my memory serves me right, the measurements were done in the axis of the mid range driver. My subsequent lifting of the speakers, has not shifted the tonal balance in any way that i can notice. And infact, Iam preferring them with the mid range driver almost at ear height or maybe just a little above. But the added height to the sound stage with the present arrangement is very enjoyable. I think i got carried away in treating my room, and might have just gone a bit over board. Thus, the addition of super tweeters has added more liveliness to the sound i think. All in all, Iam very pleased.

Coming to the bass, i had big bass issues with bloated bass and reverb prior treating my room. But that existed even before and after using the plinths. The bass treatment in the room, solved that issue to a very large extent. And i cannot perceive any issues with bass at the moment. But yes in theory it is not ideal to shift the height of the bass driver, and also to add a intervening solid layer of reflecting material between the driver and the floor. But there are no audible effects that I can perceive