Interesting Objective test on Cables

[sidvee]

Loudspeakers: Effects of amplifiers and cables - Part 5


And for those lazy to read the entire article here is one of the summarization:

"As the evidence presented in this chapter has shown, loudspeaker cables seem to be sensitive to the equipment to which they are connected, and vice versa. What is more, the entire systems seem to be sensitive to their environment, at least in electromagnetic terms. "


Cheers,
Sid

 

[krell]

the cable debate is a never ending subject.always fun and informative while reading

 

[Nikhil]

Loudspeakers: Effects of amplifiers and cables - Part 5


And for those lazy to read the entire article here is one of the summarization:

"As the evidence presented in this chapter has shown, loudspeaker cables seem to be sensitive to the equipment to which they are connected, and vice versa. What is more, the entire systems seem to be sensitive to their environment, at least in electromagnetic terms. "


Cheers,
Sid

Great reading! Have bookmarked the articles for reading later.
Thanks for sharing ...

 

[srinisundar]

It is known and proven factor that "Cable makes difference " and there is enough evidence recorded here in the meet done in Chennai.

Regards

 

[sidvee]

the cable debate is a never ending subject.

Since the article is from a respected Journal, Electronic Engineering Times, and not a fluff piece written by some non-technical reviewer or even worse non-technical, non-listening, googling, rabid anti-audiophile:lol:, I would think that it kind of brings a more scientific focus to the subject.
Cheers,
Sid

 

[arj]

have not really understood the graphs, but this interpretation seems to meet many discussions i have had and read about in forums

Given the obvious interdependence of all the parts of the circuit, the findings help to explain why such a lack of consistency exists between reports of the beneficial effects of using certain loudspeaker cables. It would appear to be the case that certain cable benefits can only be claimed for certain amplifier/loudspeaker combinations, and that any perceived audible improvement heard on any one combination may not necessarily be able to be expected when the cable is used on any other combination

 

[Nikhil]

I read the other linked articles earlier today. Have to say it was interesting.
Amplifier biasing is also an important factor - Class A vs Class D etc.

Very interesting to get an understanding of where all the distortions come from.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

From the part that I read, I got the impression that cables don't matter as such: everything matters!

But the content is way ahead of my technical level. One can only hope that such stuff filters down from those who do understand it. Event then, no doubt interpretations will differ...

 

[sidvee]

From the part that I read, I got the impression that cables don't matter as such: everything matters!
...

Even if everything matters - and one is cognizant of that - then we would probably hear less of " this or that cannot have any effect on the music, it is all in the mind, this cannot be scientifically proven, you must be crazy, bits are bits etc." After all music play back does involve a certain amount of engineering, science, design, physics etc - it is not all voodoo and snake oil.
Cheers,
Sid

 

[jls001]

After all music play back does involve a certain amount of engineering, science, design, physics etc - it is not all voodoo and snake oil.

Very well put.
The obverse is also true - it is a lot of science and engineering BUT also involves lots of art. For example, the argument that bits are bits, can seem very compelling, but anyone who has listened to half a DAC or an S/PDIF cable knows some bits are somehow more equal than others.

Unfortunately the charlatans in the industry have brought in the voodoo and the snake-skin oil.

 

[keith_correa]

Given the obvious interdependence of all the parts of the circuit, the findings help to explain why such a lack of consistency exists between reports of the beneficial effects of using certain loudspeaker cables. It would appear to be the case that certain cable benefits can only be claimed for certain amplifier/loudspeaker combinations, and that any perceived audible improvement heard on any one combination may not necessarily be able to be expected when the cable is used on any other combination

And to think that people BUY cables based on +ve reviews WITHOUT knowing how/if it will affect the sound in their rigs!!!

 

[keith_correa]

I'm particulary interested on how Figures 6.16 a thru c are to be interpreted.

6.16 a. 2.5mm2, screened, twin twisted-conductor
6.16 b. CAT-5 data cable
6.16 c. 6mm2 twin, parallel conductor

Anyone?

 

[sidvee]

And to think that people BUY cables based on +ve reviews WITHOUT knowing how/if it will affect the sound in their rigs!!!

And to also think people criticize others without understanding how these cables may react in their systems with stock statements such as "xxxx" cables cost this much/their website says "blah, blah blah", so they are all snake oil. So essentially without listening to said cables in your own system - one has absolutely zero right to say/post anything, least of all criticize/berate someone else who actually has taken the pain to listen and/or buy the cables in question.

Cheers,
Sid

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

Sid, you are right, as is jls001. There are things that make a difference, but, unfortunately there is also snake oil.

There needs to be give and take on all sides. Whilst some deny that a particular phenomenon can be even physically possible, others deny that all the psychology that is involved with listening, assessing and comparing, is possible.

There is a middle ground: that of scientific research and blind testing --- but people get upset at this too, so what to do?

 

[sidvee]

so what to do?

All I would like to say that "You are the best Judge of what you hear". No amount of Science or Religion can change that.
Cheers,
Sid

 

[ranjeetrain]

Unfortunately the charlatans in the industry have brought in the voodoo and the snake-skin oil.

I have to say that that's a major reason why cable wars are so fierce.

One kind of people are cable non-believers. The other kind is who do think they make a difference, though the price to pay for that is more often than not justifiable. And here comes the claim of snake oil and woodoo. When people can't hear the difference of a certain cable in their system that cost more than their whole system, they wouldn't be wrong in calling it snake oil. When the same cable makes a different in another system and another guy can hear it, that's where people would call it woodoo.

The people who refer to the cables as snake oil or woodoo can't be completely blamed for their views. It's a matter of perspective.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

All I would like to say that "You are the best Judge of what you hear". No amount of Science or Religion can change that.
Cheers,
Sid

The funny thing is that I used to think that ... and only in the last two to three years have I been learning the various reasons why, sometimes, I just might not be.

The middle path is the way. But Listening to and Enjoying music is the bottom line. The rest is brain exercise. But it is interesting brain exercise.

 

[sidvee]

The funny thing is that I used to think that ... and only in the last two to three years have I been learning the various reasons why, sometimes, I just might not be.

Anyways that is the only single way I judge any audio component regardless of pedigree, cost, design or materials. If I do not like the sound/improvement made by it - it is off my list, though I go into the audition with an entirely open mind. I have done this for exotic but questionable tweaks like shakti stones, marigo dots etc. and I am applying the same approach to my latest pursuit - a speaker upgrade.
Cheers,
Sid

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

I once had some fluid to wipe the power cables with. No, I didn't notice a difference, so, like you say ...I stopped doing it!

On the other hand, a successful upgrade or alteration is what makes this whole business more than just household-appliance buying.

 

[Staxxx]

Anyways that is the only single way I judge any audio component regardless of pedigree, cost, design or materials. If I do not like the sound/improvement made by it - it is off my list, though I go into the audition with an entirely open mind. I have done this for exotic but questionable tweaks like shakti stones, marigo dots etc. and I am applying the same approach to my latest pursuit - a speaker upgrade.
Cheers,
Sid

Sid, you and I think absolutely the same way! Finally someone....by the way if your Shakti stones are lying under your bed or somewhere...can I borrow them for a listen
I was thinking of trying the holographs! Now that must make some people's blood boil .....haha!