Music, money and mind matters

Hiten

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Since Jenson's thread "favourit amplifier" should not be further offtopic am starting a thread where you can post as much as you like on mentioned title. Anything from music, to expensive stuff to subjective listening impressions.
My only request is respect each other and their views. Trust me I do respect everyone in the forum.
Regards
 
I was in the market for a TT and a DAC. My budget for both was pretty healthy at about 1L each. I had even made a shortlist for both products.

However, I had also purchased a house for myself about a year or so ago and was blessed with an angel six months ago.

Now stereo components are no longer on my shopping lists.

Point is, unless you make tons of cash, buy all your foundation gear before you settle down and start having babies and buying/building houses.

Please bear in mind that I'm not complaining. I would gladly sell every piece of my stereo rig for my daughter. However, with her around, our priorities have changed.

It's important to prioritize what is important and what you can live without. Carefree days of bachelorhood or pre-baby marriage days should be used to spend cash in gay abandon! ;)
 
Sorry linking from Jenson's thread as it should not be further offtopic
I would like to write something that I would have written when the thread had derailed sometime back:D, please, this is not fair, everyone had their share of rant...me too:ohyeah:

So, I am happy to see some curious questions regarding high end gears put forward by Hiten and few other members. I think technically a lot has been answered, like you cannot challenge the laws of physics, every design has its limitations no matter how much money goes in etc etc. Yes, these are all valid but I would like to put forward a different perspective to this whole game. Something that will give you an idea of what is happening in the high end circles and what you should and should'nt be expecting when you think high end.

For this discussion, I will simplify and define "high end" as any gear that costs USD 10k and above.
Any high end gear can be classified into one of these 5 major categories:

Either it is:
1. A bargain for the money
2. Good value for money
3. Worth the money (neutral)
4. Okay, not junk for the money
5. Junk

With my limited exposure to I have heard till date, IMO high end has lots of junk !! If you take into consideration all the gears that fall in category 4 & 5, you have covered 80% of high end already. Finding a piece of gear which is worth the money is serious achievement. You see so many reviewers declaring a piece of high end gear as "Bargain", here is a simple rule that if you apply to a typical review you will hit it right most of the time, whichever category the reviewer thinks a gears falls into, downgrade it two notches and you have the actual category. So, if a reviewer says it is a "Bargain", you can consider it is "Worth the money" in general, and if he says it is "Worth the money" take it as "Junk" straight away:lol:. This is high end for you! The only way to find a really good product which fits into category 1 or 2 is by auditioning or at least knowing the brand and its product well (which again takes auditioning).

So, if a Lars costing Rs.50 Lakhs even falls into Category 4, it is a huge achievement, it is "okay" even at 50 lakhs;) !!! It may not have reached level 2 or 3 that is the reason even almighty meaning 'Bhagwan' preferred to skip it.
And yes, what Srajan says is okay, he may not have liked the product. When you do not like a product every little issue seems like a big issue and exactly reversed when you like a product, you forgive sometimes much bigger issues..big deal ?

If you look at high end from this perspective a lot of your curiosity will die down automatically:). There is no magic as you go higher, just that you have more options so the chances of finding a good option increases. If you think about it, it really takes a genius to make something magical, how many geniuses do you think can exist at a point of time in a field ? Just a handful. In cars only the genius can survive, others go out of business because of the cost of running the production. In audio it is a lot cheaper so there are too many manufacturers, but the real class belongs to a handful. Rest are all category 5:D.

And I totally disagree the comparison between a Mercedes E series owner to a high end audio owner. It is very clear that those cars are owned mainly for "social status" and to make a statement but high end audio is far from it. People dont do it to show off, mostly not. What will you show off ? Most people do not even know what the hell is "Lars" even after you play it for them:D. Brand consciousness I agree but that is not the same as "show off". Audio is rather a very personal matter and hobby, most people keep it to themselves and their close circles. In Singapore, whenever I visited an audiophile with a very high end setup, at the exit I hear a disclaimer, "Please do not discuss my setup outside", it has happened thrice already. Do they say the same thing about the Porshe that was standing in their portico, nope:).
Excellent perspective Dr. Bass. Different views like this makes this hobby interesting.
Regards
 
If I had a lot of money gathering dust I will get a Gryphon amp, Ayre CDP, a couple of Kharmas, Wilsons, Focals and Tannoys. Small shopping list, isn't it? Yeah, I kept cables, ICs, power lines and sundry items out on purpose.

Is there anyone here lending money at zero percent interest to buy hifi?
 
A friend used to always tell me...

After marriage people double, but expenses triple.

Now after marriage I realize he was correct.

But that's not stopping me from planning my next purchase. Its more of a compromise now though. I can plan for my next toy as long as my wife gets her toys (kitchen and household related stuff).
 
i would like to add, in audiophile hobby money spent
Must Be Justified
strange is this hobby u no sortof it can put you in Double Mind and confused. So what is the right way ?? only God knows the truth, as he doesn't discriminate against rich or poor. So If fundamentals are correct does audiophile hobby discriminate ???
seeking salvation
my best regards :).
 
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expensive audiophile gear come at a price. but even then they can be bought by those who have the money. the faculty to enjoy and appreciate music, on the other hand, is priceless. and yet one can have it for free if one puts his mind to it.
so i guess that is what matters in the end.
 
expensive audiophile gear come at a price. but even then they can be bought by those who have the money. the faculty to enjoy and appreciate music, on the other hand, is priceless. and yet one can have it for free if one puts his mind to it.
so i guess that is what matters in the end.

Reminds me of a friend who has a home theater room to kill for.... but he watches crappy Hindi movies on it.

I have an uncle with some 3000+ tapes. Still plays them and enjoys them.

PS - Crappy = for the SFX... not the movies.
 
So do we call a gear "High End" only if it is highly priced? :indifferent14:

Is that mean rich (costly) has to be entered into that league and poor (VFM) are not worth of mentioning in that so called High End league? I feel, if money stashed in cupboard and that fellow is looking at so called audio gears then he/she is only helping economy by spending more. They are obsessed by money and brands. Most of the time getting ripped. I am not emotionally attached until proven by data - either High End (so called) or Low End (so called).

A rich Arab from oil rich country having gold plated taps in bathroom may give him pleasure, same way gold/silver replacing copper in audio. [I/Most do have mere SS taps in bathroom]. Basic work remains same, hygiene matters. :D

For us correct reproduction of audio matters. I agree to pay for research, meaningful patents, legitimate material cost and contribution towards invention. For that I am in no mood to do gold plating done inside my ears. I abide by laws (of nature, physics, electronics, and blah..blah) :p

edit:
PS: I understand I invited bashing for myself. ;)
 
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Omi,
Music has a great capability to bring people together.
- People like you who have technical knowledge(Cranky was another great guy, he answered every silly questions I asked),
- people like Asitda who has knowledge of finer details of music and have heard Indian classicals from great Indian artists. (What more can you ask for)
- Many who have financial capabilities are already contributing by reviewing high end systems.
There are many others in each field.
so sometimes I genuinely feel after certain time period senior members should reveal their name as they are already famous it will only bring us closer and we all should benefit.
Regards
 
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High quality reproduction of music in the home environment is a hobby just like any other. Just like any other hobby like high performance cars, wines, golf, travel and food.

Large amounts of money ?
Carefully manipulated designs targeted towards certain market segments ?
DIY which can rival or beat some of the best designs out there ?
Shiny badges ?
Lemons ?

They are all there.

Listen to unamplified live performances as often as you can. Study and experience the emotions that your mind / body experience when you listen to such performances. Buy gear that recreates the same emotions in your mind / body. Nothing else matters.
 
High quality reproduction of music in the home environment is a hobby just like any other. Just like any other hobby like high performance cars, wines, golf, travel and food.

Large amounts of money ?
Carefully manipulated designs targeted towards certain market segments ?
DIY which can rival or beat some of the best designs out there ?
Shiny badges ?
Lemons ?

They are all there.

Listen to unamplified live performances as often as you can. Study and experience the emotions that your mind / body experience when you listen to such performances. Buy gear that recreates the same emotions in your mind / body. Nothing else matters.
Thanks Bro,
my aim was to bring everyone together regardless of money/listening exposure/technical knowledge. As I see in it great potential. So when I see endless debates and cross posting in various forums on the net it saddens me. but if we unite and debate with due respect to each other, we can reach at some point. As per my knowledge India is not amongst top countries in this hobby. Mind you some can lead with great capacity and experience. If you have read my threads I always look out for contribution by us Indians. Hope I am not misunderstood.
Regarding live performance. I have heard only Parveen Sultana. That too in a playground near my hometown. Even with amplification (I dont know what it was) she was amazing to listen to.
Warm regards
 
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Since this is a hobby which involves the ear / brain, chances of arriving at common points of agreements for all matters is a tall order.

Put one dozen audiophiles in a room and ask them the same questions and you will get one dozen answers !

There are of course some basic aspects which many audiophiles will agree.

Pursuing hi-end audio is pretty much a lone journey. After a certain level, ones ears and personal references / preferences take over and nothing else matters.
 
OT:

I never had been in an unamplified music performance. :(
Is there any dedicated thread where we can get to know about such events?
 
OT:

I never had been in an unamplified music performance. :(
Is there any dedicated thread where we can get to know about such events?

NCPA - Mumbai has them on a 'regular' basis - however, they are 'western' classical concerts - they have a web site too - just look it up.

I too am very interested to attend Indian Classical Music Concerts / performances [baithaks] which are without mic & amplifiers & speakers - if any FM can get me to those, I shall be truly grateful - please...Thanks !
:licklips: 24th Jan 2012 [next one you can attend] !

p.s. Santy - Go to NCPA & listen to a Piano / Violin - it will be a super experience.
 
If I had a lot of money gathering dust I will get a Gryphon amp, Ayre CDP, a couple of Kharmas, Wilsons, Focals and Tannoys. Small shopping list, isn't it? Yeah, I kept cables, ICs, power lines and sundry items out on purpose.
Is there anyone here lending money at zero percent interest to buy hifi?

Sir,
I can offer some help;
There is a GAD that I sold to someone in Pune - 2 years back - up for sale.
Pre & Power - both will go as a set - Suggested Retail is 25/- K [Power] & 15/- K [Pre] = 40K Euro [for the set]
Going @ Rs. 650/-K FOB Pune.
If you or any one else is interested - please do get in touch with me - I can get you to meet the 'seller' !! This is a 100 Watt Power Class A - 100kg Power Amplifier - truly a super SS Power Amp & a Pure DC Supply Pre to go with it - superb price - I feel !!
This was my set & I really loved it - excellent product - used with Wilson Sophia [also for sale] !! So do let me know.:clapping:
 
OT:

I never had been in an unamplified music performance. :(
Is there any dedicated thread where we can get to know about such events?



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Not what the doctor ordered - but will be a nice concert !!

Mahler Chamber Orchestra
Tue 24th January 2012 | 07:00 PM To Tue 24th January 2012 | 07:00 PM
Western Classical Music Concert
An NCPA presentation
Programme Details:

Antonin Dvo?k

Terzetto in C major, op. 74 for Two Violins and Viola

I Introduzione: Allegro ma non troppo

II Larghetto

III Scherzo: Vivace - Trio: Poco meno mosso

IV Tema con variazioni: Poco adagio - Molto allegro - Moderato (quasi recit.) - Moderato e risoluto - Molto allegro

Length: 20 min

W. A. Mozart

String Quintet in g minor KV 516

I Allegro

II Menuetto: Allegretto

III Adagio ma non troppo

IV Adagio - Allegro

Length: 30 min

Johannes Brahms

Clarinet Quintet in b minor op. 115

I Allegro

II Adagio

III Andantino

IV Con moto

Length: 35 min

Attend this for sure !!
2 concerts back to back - 24th & 25th !!

Do go !
 
OT:

I never had been in an unamplified music performance. :(
Is there any dedicated thread where we can get to know about such events?
Santy Bro,
Good thing about Marathi people is most of them send their child to learn some instrument or classical singing or other creative art. I think you are a Marathi Manoos. So you must be having friends who appreciates classical music.
I guess Indian classical music lovers session at some friends home will be more appropriate. Only condition in my opinion is the listening group should have good number of people who knows finer details of classical singing. Singers as much appreciate singing as getting a live feedback from the audience. This way you can not only appreciate classical music but with them singing in residence can give you a little more precise idea of what you are looking for.
Also don't worry about being off topic, post whatever you feel like. Let the ideas flow. You are rather on topic. :)
regards
 
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Have been reading diyAudio threads where I found this.

pix3a.gif


so ...

There are of course some basic aspects which many audiophiles will agree.

If one believes and in my humble opinion it is true that science by its own nature is progressive it doesn't makes sense that we are going back to tubes and 1% distortion. So the same basic aspects will also be in "We agree to disagree" area where most of the companies will take advantage of 'personal taste'. Subjective High Fidelity is or will be a niche hobby.
Regards
 
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