MY NOS Long Base Thorens 125 and SME 3012

[anilva]

I have a diametrically different take on this. Using the same components would show you differences in the table itself. But the inherent flaw in this approach is that you put both types of tables on an equal footing when they are really not by virtue of being mechanically and physically built very differently. For example the reason vintage SME arms pair so well with a Garrard is that they have a nice relaxed presentation that matches the forcefulness of the Garrard. On the other hand, relaxed airy presenters like the Linn are more found with tighter bearing tonearms. So the real purpose should be to optimise setups with tonearms and cart based on each turntables strengths and then compare presentations. Else one is doing something akin to making bruschetta with local Sunflower oil. Just won't optimise that bruschetta and give you a true taste of what the inherent dish is like, now will it?

Regards

Steven,

What makes a Garrard forceful and a Linn airy? Is it the torque or is it the decoupling/isolation or a combination of all of these? My point is that it is difficult to make comparisons and arrive at conclusions on different turntables and their associated combinations with tonearm and cartridge. I personally would use a blind test with similar levels of cartridge/phono amp sections.

Cheers.

 

[jls001]

but once you get it right its heaven...but then there are days you still lose your hair

Thanks, arj for pointing this out.

New enthusiasts should know this There will be many bad hair days. It is hardly smooth sailing till you cross your own hill, carrying your own analog cross up that hill. There are many obstacles to overcome, much knowledge to acquire along the way, some styli to break, good records to acquire, much tweaking to be done, etc. It is not only about the romance and analog warmth.

PS: this is not an attempt to discourage anyone. Just a reality check!

 

[reubensm]

Reubenism...

I feel that the SL 1200 is the last great deck that will go into the hall of fame!

It is a superb workhorse.... you can spend as much money on a TT as you like, but even a stock 1200 can bust the chops off a 1-1.5L TT....

then again, of one were to do basic mods like changing the tonearm, damping the base, and a few more, the SL1200 becomes a super unbeatable deck... It comes darn close to the 301 & 401... Overall, I feel the 301 & 401 are pretty unbeatable... but the SL1200 is a deck I will add to the chain.... i keep bringing it home from my brothers place and I know that having one in the chain is only inevitable!

so, if you are considering a 1200, GO FOR IT!

Thanks Malvai, that sure is on my list.

 

[sachu888]

Lenco sounds as good or better than 301/401,if modded right.Garrard is only superior to Lenco because of better metal plate(cast iron??)Vs pressed metal top plate IMHO.Lenco needs heavy CLD plinth with better arm and top plate tightly bolt down with wooden plinth.It surely performs at par or sometimes better than Garrards.

Regards,
Sachin

 

[kuruvilajacob]

It's really impossible to make an ideal comparison . But the charm is that each deck will have it's unique sound reproduction. If you have two identical players with same cart and playing through the same system, even then you can expect them to sound different. This is something amazing with Turntables. I have a very special deck . It's a Sony PS- 6750. It is one of the best decks I have ever heard . The low base this deck can produce cannot be matched by even the Garrards or Thorens or Technics SL 1200. So every company has it's secret weapons during the peak of Vinyl era. The PS-6750 is so special that it has a huge platter with a rubberized solution coat under the platter, oil filled rubber mat, specially coated tone arm and even an anti static coating on the dust cover. I have modded this TT for better isolation of the platter and i would like to post a few pics if any of you have not seen his deck

 

[stevieboy]

Steven,

What makes a Garrard forceful and a Linn airy? Is it the torque or is it the decoupling/isolation or a combination of all of these? My point is that it is difficult to make comparisons and arrive at conclusions on different turntables and their associated combinations with tonearm and cartridge. I personally would use a blind test with similar levels of cartridge/phono amp sections.

Cheers.

Hi Anilva,

The basic nature would be down to the mighty overdriven motor of the Garrard and the Linn's belt drive, springs and platter/motor. Plinths etc would be geared to letting each deck perform to its best. One could do the best decoupling/isolation etc for each but they'd still sound in essence Garrardy and Linny. I think Kuruvilajacob stole the words right out of my mouth when he said this "It's really impossible to make an ideal comparison. But the charm is that each deck will have it's unique sound reproduction. If you have two identical players with same cart and playing through the same system, even then you can expect them to sound different." My point was there's no need to compare, better to max each deck out to its strengths and then enjoy the differences for different music/moods.

Eg I wouldn't personally ever dream of putting the SPU on the Project that I have. It just doesn't 'fit in' for me. That's what I was meaning when I said use appropriate tonearms and carts for each so they play to their best.

Regards

Regards

 

[kuruvilajacob]

Hi Anilva,

The basic nature would be down to the mighty overdriven motor of the Garrard and the Linn's belt drive, springs and platter/motor. Plinths etc would be geared to letting each deck perform to its best. One could do the best decoupling/isolation etc for each but they'd still sound in essence Garrardy and Linny. I think Kuruvilajacob stole the words right out of my mouth when he said this "It's really impossible to make an ideal comparison. But the charm is that each deck will have it's unique sound reproduction. If you have two identical players with same cart and playing through the same system, even then you can expect them to sound different." My point was there's no need to compare, better to max each deck out to its strengths and then enjoy the differences for different music/moods.

Eg I wouldn't personally ever dream of putting the SPU on the Project that I have. It just doesn't 'fit in' for me. That's what I was meaning when I said use appropriate tonearms and carts for each so they play to their best.

Regards

Regards

I agree 100% with Steve there are some combinations which make the TTs to perform their best. For eg, A SME 3012 does best with Denon DL 103. So there are some combinations which make some players 'tick' and we can know this only by trial and error. When we identify them, we must make a note of it for future reference and for others benefit . Yes, there really should not be a comparison but human mind is inquisitive and it is only natural for us to compare. What I try to do is get the best combination for each of my decks and then try to enhance it's performance by some tweaking. Now that i have a full fledged service guy coming to work for me almost 3 to 4 days a week, I can do many tweaks I could not do earlier.