Recommendation for beginner Turntable

[Dr.Bass]

Pioneer PLX-1000 and Audio Technica LP120 would be my pick too. Entry level belt drives from Rega, Pro-ject, Music hall et al do not have the dynamics that these direct drives do.

 

[Fiftyfifty]

Many have recommended the AT LP120. Would like to hear more comments on this one.

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[sunder]

Many have recommended the AT LP120. Would like to hear more comments on this one.

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Many users say in their reviews that the anti skate mechanism of this player is not good and problematic. And the in-built phono preamp is annoying by producing hum & noise when the playing with external phono preamp. So some users had to remove the in-built phono preamp.

 

[drkrack]

Many have recommended the AT LP120. Would like to hear more comments on this one.

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It is a good direct drive but not a great one from Audiophile point of view, if you delve deeper into Amazon reviews you will get a better idea. This video explains it well.

https://youtu.be/J_LzV45Ha30

For the novice, Rega RP1 or Project DC seems to be the favorite choices for the beginner TT.

https://youtu.be/MuuOgT0XBK0

 

[Fiftyfifty]

I'm leaning towards the RP6 as an upgrade from RP1. Stock Exact cart or change?

 

[reubensm]

Absolutely, the quality of vintage turntables (if you find one in decent nick) is far superior. Having said that, from your thread, I gather that you are looking at top-end results with a critical ear. One lesson I have learnt over the years is with vinyl, entry level setups give one entry level sound, then with a gradual increase in the spend, the quality and enjoyment per dollar goes up....and then, there's this state of equilibrium that one would reach (this varies from person to person), after which all additional spend results in either highly marginal or no benefit.

From what I gather reading through your thread, the vintage direct drive turntables that were mass-produced, wont really work for you, except some of these semi-automatics will help return the tonearm to the tonearm stand, after playing a side of your LP.

Depending on your choice of drive approach when going the vintage route, you may hear what you expect to hear, using an AR-XA, Linn LP12, Lenco L75, Technics SP10 / SP15 or Garrard 401 with suitable high end tonearm, cart, and phonostage.

If you get some of the better Technics semi-automatic DDs in good shape, these can give you a good start. As Mr.Kuruvilla mentioned in another thread, the original selling price of a Technics DD turntable is a key factor and a good reference point for choosing a Technics TT. Usually they had models that were critically built which were more expensive and those which were mass produced, which were great and work horses, but did not match the expensive ones. A price referential can be found here

Please note that the MSRP mentioned at the site is the price of a new turntable when purchased back in the day.

 

[mpw]

fiftyfifty

RP6 is phased out.

The Planar 6 is the replacement from Rega

regards

 

[Fiftyfifty]

Yes i know, but rp6 is still available. Planar 6 price not known yet

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[Fiftyfifty]

Reubensm, very valid observations. I wouldn't want to risk buying a vintage pre owned tt, because I will not be able to maintain it should it need any repairs. I'd rather buy a good new tt that will be trouble free for a reasonable period.

You are absolutely right that i would like good sound in line with the rest of my system. Even the RP1 does a great job. Difficult to say where the equilibrium lies!

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[Naturelover]

There used to be quite a few Pune vinyl guys on the forum. Wonder why no one has come on board here. See if you can get in touch with some and get to hear their players.

 

[sandeepmohan]

Going the used way is not a problem. The problem is finding a quality used turn table. I see little reason for someone to part ways with their old turn table. Besides; if I am going to have to pay more than 10-15k for a used turntable and the good ones being almost two decades old, there is a lot that can go wrong if you are not careful with your selection. The thread starter isn't familiar with turntable setup nor is well versed with identifying a quality used table.

 

[kuruvilajacob]

Going the used way is not a problem. The problem is finding a quality used turn table. I see little reason for someone to part ways with their old turn table. Besides; if I am going to have to pay more than 10-15k for a used turntable and the good ones being almost two decades old, there is a lot that can go wrong if you are not careful with your selection. The thread starter isn't familiar with turntable setup nor is well versed with identifying a quality used table.

I have sold more than 600 used Turntables over the last 12 years. Except for a few Direct Drive turntables with speed issues, and some exceptions in the case of Turntables which are not tropicalized , I find these vintage turntables to be very dependable especially the belt drives. Earlier, many had an apprehension that belts will need to be changed often. This is not true. Only if you leave the belt in the stretched position for a long time unused, the belt can get damaged. Moreover, all replacement belts are available online. Another important factor is that when you buy a used turntable, ensure that it is taken to a service guy who knows how to service a turntable and ensure that there is no play on the tone arm bearings, the arm movements sideways is smooth and also the main bearing rotates freely. Once a good vintage turntable is fully refurbished, they can perform well and serve the buyer satisfactorily for years. I still have guys who have bought TTs from me more than 10 years happy with them. It's like buying a second hand car. If you take it to a good mechanic, he will change all the oil and grease and cables as well as spark plugs to ensure that it runs with out any problem.

 

[sandeepmohan]

Another important factor is that when you buy a used turntable, ensure that it is taken to a service guy who knows how to service a turntable and ensure that there is no play on the tone arm bearings, the arm movements sideways is smooth and also the main bearing rotates freely. Once a good vintage turntable is fully refurbished, they can perform well and serve the buyer satisfactorily for years.

Like I said, I am not averse to the idea of a used turntable. I have one myself, a Technics SL-B2. Runs flawlessly and just as good as my Rega RP1. Probably better in some ways.

My dads Akai AP D3 and Garrard Zero 100B is sitting and rotting in the attic. Why? Nobody knows how to fix them. I grew up listening to these turntables and it is sad to see them just sit there.

The availability of someone who can help fix or service your broken turntable is the point I am trying to drive. You fix your own turntable, I have access to what I like to call "AMP Uncle", who helps me fix just about anything electronics. Not everyone has this easy access to a resource that can fix these old turntables. I know no more than two people in all of Bangalore who can fix a turntable and these are not people who are open to business. They only work with people they really know.

There are only a handful of people who know component level repair. These are the kind of people you need to fix these old turntables and vintage electronic gear. Nowadays you walk in to Pro Fx saying your Denon needs to be fixed and they just swap out a board. There is hardly an attempt to diagnose the problem at the root level.

My Rega started to play wonky one day. I check whatever little I know, which is free movement of the main platter bearing or if there was some voltage fluctuation. All good. I take it to the so called Rega repair guy who says we need a new motor. I order the motor. Rega were kind enough to supply one for free well past warranty (I did have someone carry it for me from the UK). To fix it, I take it my AMP uncle and while inspecting the turn table, we discover it was not the motor but the pulley that had unglued itself from the motor shaft. Very simple problem. Something so basic could not be identified by the turn table repair guy. It was a 10 minute fix which ended up being a non working turntable for a month.

Except for the speakers and my Rega, my entire Hi Fi rig is used. I had the confidence to take the used route as it was a reliable source who sold me the gear and I have access to someone who can fix it too.

If the FM wants to take the used route, that is his call. However; we must guide him on the good and bad of taking the used route.

 

[Fiftyfifty]

Sandeepmohan, you took the words right out of my mouth! I have some used equipment too, but I would never buy a used or vintage turntable. Even if you buy from a reliable refurbisher, should a part get damaged or fail, as it can even with a new product, you will need to scrounge the markets for a replacement part. And if you are not an electronics guy or don't have access to one, there'll be one more turntable sitting in the closet.

 

[kuruvilajacob]

I agree with you guys. Getting the right person to service your Turntables is not easy these days. The experience of Sandeep in the case of a Rega is a classic example. I don't remember having to replace a motor for any turntable that has come to me. I have seen many direct drive motors with speed variations. But AC motors used in belt drive turntables are very reliable. I have also seen some beautiful turntables fully messed up by mechanics who have no idea about repairing them. But from my experience, a well serviced old turntable is more reliable than many of the new ones.

 

[Fiftyfifty]

Hi
Has anyone heard or used the Marantz TT15s1? It seems a strong contender against Rega RP6 and Clearaudio Concept. It is built by Clearaudio in Germany and comes witha stock Clearaudio Virtuoso Ebony Wood cartridge. I realize Marantz does not sound like an audiophile name (whatever that means), but this tt is so well specified with great reviews from actual users
Any opinions?
Cheers!

 

[sandeepmohan]

Any opinions?

It is an eyes closed purchase. You are probably better off buying the Clearaudio though. I have heard the Concept and even with the stock cartridge, it is superb. It is quite an old model now. Been in the market for well over 5 years. I guess they have not had to meddle anything cause there is nothing wrong with it.

Marantz is very much a respected name in audio and their higher end KI series are pitched against the best in the business, except that, at KI signature asking price, you start to think if you really should have a Marantz in your rig. It is more a brand name thing.

A FM picked up a Concept for under a lac. This was a few years ago. I am sure the price would have gone up a bit with our brilliant GST norms and what not.

The build quality of the Clearaudio is superb too. To be honest, it makes a Rega look like it was built in a garage. However; Rega's philosophy has been different all along. They end up with great sounding turntables even with ultra light plinths and platters. I recall reading on Stereophile or Analog Planet, it was for one of the Rega reviews, that when they placed a stethoscope on the plinth, they could hear motor rumble and music playing faintly. It was a shocking discovery. The table was highly praised for its sound quality.

Please try and audition a direct drive like the Pioneer PLX-1000 or anything else that you find.

 

[sunder]

Sandeepmohan, in the Clearaudio Concept tables, which arm is good? Magnetic Floating Verify or Satisfy Carbon tonearm? Thank you.

 

[Fiftyfifty]

Hi,

Just wanted to let you know that I'll probably pull the trigger on the Marantz TT15S1 soon.

I wasn't really able to audition many systems as dealers do not have demo pieces for this. So I had to rely on specs, reviews and recommendations from users. I did hear a few, but no side by side comparison was possible. There are so many factors including other paired equipment, room acoustics, etc., that such isolated and random listening was not relevant. Quite different from when I was selecting speakers, for e.g., I was able to lug my amp from dealer to dealer. Each dealer had 3 - 4 options and I was able to make a fair judgement. Not so with turntables! I did hear Clearaudio & Pro-Ject, a Lenco GL75 and some direct drive Technics and Pioneer tts.

I had shortlisted Rega RP6, Clearaudio Concept, VPI Traveler/Scout and Marantz TT15S1. One dealer also strongly recommended a little known Chinese brand that makes exotic turntables. But I found no reviews for this Chinese TT, no users, just great specs and a high price. Then I had to eliminate Rega and VPI due to poor response from the distributors. I do not wish to narrate what transpired with them as I do not wish to disparage their otherwise good reputation. Moreover, as I currently own a Rega RP1, I had had a taste of the Rega house sound. Wanted something different. Between Concept and Marantz, the Marantz scored on tonearm and cartridge (Clearaudio Virtuoso Wood-Ebony MM), the Concept scored on platter and motor.

Reviews of the Marantz were consistently positive, while Concept users were . sometimes disappointed, particularly with the stock cartridge. The Concept sound is described as forward, while the Marantz sound is described as laid back and warm. I prefer the latter, partly because I will pair them with solid state components and electrostatic speakers.

I am also getting the impression that the Marantz is perhaps a bit underrated because, being a mass consumer brand, some audiophiles pooh pooh it.

So maybe I'm making a bit of a blind call, but in the absence of a realistic audition, this is the best I can do.

Thanks to all for your support and suggestions, particularly sandeepmohan, jls001, mpw, prem, naturelover, your inputs really helped.

Cheers!

 

[mpw]

Fiftyfifty

Look forward to your listening experience.

Maybe sometime a listen to your system as well if OK by you.

I am floating in a different direction but will keep my thread suitably posted.

Do post pictures

Good thing is to make up ones mind and go for the best as practically possible.

Best regards