Using the Perreaux Eloquence 250 i as a power amp

[arunp]

Good day,

After reading some reviews wherein the reviewer has suggested that the 250 i was very capable as a Power Amp , I decided to give it a try. The Denon 4308 was used a a pre and I activated the " Seperate" Function on my Perreuax which effectively converted the 250 i into a Power Amp. I am very happy with the results as the quality of the bass is more smooth and controlled. The sound quality is very similar to the one using balanced connections without any loss of detail.

I plan to buy a good Pre so as to take the Denon out of the picture. I am targeting an initial budget of $ 1,000 . Kindly assist with suggestions on which Pre in this price category would pair best with the Perreuax


Thanks

Arun

 

[anm]

can you undo the "separate" function? Than you don't need a pre I guess.

 

[venkatcr]

As Anm said, the 250i is a respected integrated amplifier of it's own. You can connect it directly to your sources. Why would you need a separate pre-amp?

Cheers

 

[ravi_d]

+1^
Eloquence 250i is one of the best integrated amps available out there. They have superb built quality and are made in New Zealand. Just use its on-board pre as advised.

 

[corElement]

Wait, I'm confused, is this the same eloquence 250i Integrated Amplifier valued at $8,999 USD the OP is talking about?

If it is..How was this 4.5Lakh amp being used if not as a power amp???? Was it bought without even knowing it's potential as a power amp????

 

[arunp]

Thanks Anm , Venkat Ravi & corEle. I did use it is initially as an integrated and was vowed by its presentation especially with balanced connections. It is just that after reading some of the reviews I decided to see how it would perform as a power amp. I did this not expecting any major change in SQ but was proved to be wrong. Using the Denon & Power combo proved to be superb , far better than the " integrated " sound. Yes this is the same $ 8 K amp. I do observe a very pronounced difference between using the 250i as a integrated and a power amp. Hence i feel having a dedicated pre would be the next step

 

[corElement]

Hmm, I think im getting an idea of what youre saying now, youre saying the amp has a mode that makes the left and right channels work seperately from the control interface of the amp and lets it be driven by the pre? And this is improving the sound?

 

[venkatcr]

Why dont you audition the passive pre-amp that Perreuax's itself sells? That will make a good pairing with the 250i.

Cheers

 

[square_wave]

Hey Arun,

Can you please elaborate a bit more on the test that you actually did ?

- Rest of your setup (associated gear)
- Was the test done in a home theatre system or a dedicated stereo setup ?
- What music did you play ?
- What is your source equipment(gear)?
- What is your source quality ( flacs, cds)
- A bit more elaboration on the actual observations.
o Clarity ?
o Tonal correctness
o Nautrality
o Soundstaging
o How you are able to connect with your music (try with some classical music)

It is a technical impossibility that a preamp section of an avr will outdo the preamp in this stereo amp if the setup is technically correct . Hence the questions.

 

[arunp]

Yes cor , that is right. It has a " Seperate " function which breaks the pre and power section . After that it can be used as a pre or as a power amp.

 

[arunp]

Thanks for the suggestion Venkat . Only issue is that it is pricey( Approx INR 1.2 L). I sure will have to wait to get it . That is the long term objective.

 

[arunp]

Hi Square, Current Set-up is :
Music

Amplifier : Perreaux Eloquence 250 i
CDP : Sony XB 930 QS
DAC : Musical Fidelity M1

HT : Denon 4308
Denon DB 2012UD BLU Ray player

Monitor Audio Silver RX 6 , Front L& R , Surrounds and centre
Sub : Deftech Super Cube

Prior to using the 250 i as a power amp ,

SONY CDP connected via digital to MF M1 DAC > MI DC to 250 i using balanced connections ( Wireworld Oasis 6).playing on Monitor RX 6 Silver speakers.

In this set up , I was playing the Mark Knopfler " Shangrila - SACD . While there was nothing to complain of , after using the 250i as a power , the bass is more deep and pronounced and more rounded , room encompassing and tight to boot. While the 250i does an exceptionally good job with clean , non fatiguing presentation , I guess I prefer the more deeper bass that has resulted from the conversion to power. In fact one of the reviewers has strongly hinted that this amp should be tried as a power amp. While I am sure that its pre section would be better than the AVR ,i feel that its relative strength lies is in its power section. I did play classical music through the Linn SACD series and found it delightful. In both the set ups clarity , tonal clarity and nuetrality are common factors. The soundstage is where i could feel the most pronounced difference .Thanks

 

[corElement]

That amp is ROYAL overkill for all your other components

This is just an offtopic suggestion but if you're open to it, you should consider actually selling off all your other components except the amp and dac and investing in a pair of 8000$ speakers to bring out the true potential of the 250i. Right now as it is, you're probably getting 30% of it's true potential with those RX6's.

 

[square_wave]

Hi Square, Current Set-up is :
Music

Amplifier : Perreaux Eloquence 250 i
CDP : Sony XB 930 QS
DAC : Musical Fidelity M1

HT : Denon 4308
Denon DB 2012UD BLU Ray player

Monitor Audio Silver RX 6 , Front L& R , Surrounds and centre
Sub : Deftech Super Cube

Prior to using the 250 i as a power amp ,

SONY CDP connected via digital to MF M1 DAC > MI DC to 250 i using balanced connections ( Wireworld Oasis 6).playing on Monitor RX 6 Silver speakers.

In this set up , I was playing the Mark Knopfler " Shangrila - SACD . While there was nothing to complain of , after using the 250i as a power , the bass is more deep and pronounced and more rounded , room encompassing and tight to boot. While the 250i does an exceptionally good job with clean , non fatiguing presentation , I guess I prefer the more deeper bass that has resulted from the conversion to power. In fact one of the reviewers has strongly hinted that this amp should be tried as a power amp. While I am sure that its pre section would be better than the AVR ,i feel that its relative strength lies is in its power section. I did play classical music through the Linn SACD series and found it delightful. In both the set ups clarity , tonal clarity and nuetrality are common factors. The soundstage is where i could feel the most pronounced difference .Thanks

Hey Arun,

Thank you for putting everything in the right perspective.

Like cor-element mentioned, that amp is the best piece that you currently own. I can see that this gem is currently inserted into a home theatre system.

The expectations you mentioned can be achieved by using many tricks via DSP and / or any amply powerful amps. This is a completely non purist approach.

The intergrated amp that you own can be setup correctly to produce very natural sounding music if you set that up in a pure two channel system with the correct associated equipment.

Technically speaking, this preamp section is the best that you currently own. The possibilities are endless but it is upto you to decide how you want to use them.

 

[arunp]

Thanks Square Wave!

 

[arunp]

Thanks cor Element . You are right , I am working towards it , pre amp first , speakers in that order. In fact I checked with Perreaux on which speakers match best with the 250 i. I was suggested the speaker line from " vaessen audiodesign". However these are beyond my reach with the price being at Euro 14,500. The other cheaper alternative was the the Bowers and Wilkins ( these were from my list of suggestions to them i.e. Sonus Faber etc)

 

[spirovious]

Some pics-





Rear view-


Internal view-


another user review-
Perreaux Eloquence 250i integrated amplifier

 

[corElement]

The lcd is ghastly lol.

 

[arunp]

Hi Spiro , Do you have a 250 i ? Thanks