Whats happening in Hifi?? Dont buy avr now....read on!

[Saiganesh]

Decade back got a pioneet lx57 totally happy with it.
Fast forward- want 4k , want atmos (which pioneer lx57 doesnt offer) and over time pioneer got old with some glitches (doubting firmware upgrades!)

Researched forums, read reviews, for like months and circulated on denon x4800.
The moment i opened box and connected to my speakers....total disappointment!!

Anyone who does research and buys a product is going to go 'gaga' on his decision being right but....disapointment !! To say the least.

Thought the in built amps were to blame. Added anthem mca325 for LCR and tried crown xls2502.

Then thought speakers were to blame. Now tried my old pioneer lx57 on these new speakers and 'VOLA' 'MAGIC' 'WONDERFUL'
no amps- no calibration- plain vanila 'wonderful'

Now thought i am more seasoned to pioneer signature but recently met a person who upgraded to marantz 8015 (from 7015) and he is in hunt for a better avr within a week of his purchase (8015)

All those people going gaga about these models have not seen the other side of how sound has benn splendid in the past....

Now those trying to suggest for dirac and audysy...audysy multi eq app dint help much -may be 10% , what i am talking abput here is a sky to earth difference (a day and night difference) NO calobration cant fill this difference.

Instead of spending on these dumps I have started a thread called amps avr processor swap and rental...a way not only to get to what we want but also a way to get money out of our wrong choices...please do support it and lets make a useful community here
Thanks
Sai

 

[Naturelover]

Using a Pioneer LX57 myself for a decade now.
Totally happy with it.

 

[rwnano]

Companies have the same price to invest in the amplifier. And they have to pay a lot of money to the semiconductor industry for chips and the algorithms like dirac audessy etc. So the money is less which is left behind to be invested in the electrical engineering components which actually make a huge difference in the sound. Sound quality is totally dependent on the current going into and out of the AVR amplifier. Low quality transformers and smaller electrical engineering components lead to worse than average sound quality.

 

[Saiganesh]

Using a Pioneer LX57 myself for a decade now.
Totally happy with it.

Never trade it out. Dont add external amp to it - it wont sound better

 

[Saiganesh]

Companies have the same price to invest in the amplifier. And they have to pay a lot of money to the semiconductor industry for chips and the algorithms like dirac audessy etc. So the money is less which is left behind to be invested in the electrical engineering components which actually make a huge difference in the sound. Sound quality is totally dependent on the current going into and out of the AVR amplifier. Low quality transformers and smaller electrical engineering components lead to worse than average sound quality.

Better give audysy as add on...dolby atmos as add on...dtsx another add on...but first need the perfect hardware...no use when the bottle neck (hardware dac amps) are too narrow to trade!!

 

[reignofchaos]

AVRs are not meant for HiFi. An AVR by definition is for movies not music.

 

[sandeepmohan]

A large part of the problem lies with us. We stuff our head with information from the Internet, You Tube or some Influencer. Next, we try to find the cheapest deal on whatever it it we wish to buy (Granted, that is fine), without paying heed to after sales support or the quality of the product itself. The worst part is that we are willing to put down money on something we have never heard or even seen in person! This shocks me no end.

Lets forget discounts for a moment. The listed price for a Denon 4800 on Hi Fi mart is INR 200,000. We are willing to part with this sort of money yet we are unwilling to take the effort to go and audition the equipment. Forget this Denon. I won't part with even INR 25,000 on a sub woofer if I can't audition cause its unavailable for an audition, or the dealer does not stock the equipment. I don't buy into this excuse. You can spend several lacs on equipment but we won't spend INR 10,000 on a flight to get to a dealer cause that flight fare is not justified. However, spending INR 200,000 on a blind or deaf purchase is totally fine. It ain't worth it for your wallet and your mental health.

I have a simple rule when it comes to buying equipment that I can't audition. The Dealer must be willing to take back the product if I don't like it. That simple. If there is no such dealer, then don't buy the product.

I want to ask the entire forum here. When was the last time you walked into a store to look at Audio-Video equipment? Forget buying. You are evaluating at this stage. We should try make this a poll. There are exceptions for products that are simply not available in our country. A popular and highly rated Denon 4800H sells heaps. Surely, someone must have it in store.

 

[Saiganesh]

A large part of the problem lies with us. We stuff our head with information from the Internet, You Tube or some Influencer. Next, we try to find the cheapest deal on whatever it it we wish to buy (Granted, that is fine), without paying heed to after sales support or the quality of the product itself. The worst part is that we are willing to put down money on something we have never heard or even seen in person! This shocks me no end.

Lets forget discounts for a moment. The listed price for a Denon 4800 on Hi Fi mart is INR 200,000. We are willing to part with this sort of money yet we are unwilling to take the effort to go and audition the equipment. Forget this Denon. I won't part with even INR 25,000 on a sub woofer if I can't audition cause its unavailable for an audition, or the dealer does not stock the equipment. I don't buy into this excuse. You can spend several lacs on equipment but we won't spend INR 10,000 on a flight to get to a dealer cause that flight fare is not justified. However, spending INR 200,000 on a blind or deaf purchase is totally fine. It ain't worth it for your wallet and your mental health.

I have a simple rule when it comes to buying equipment that I can't audition. The Dealer must be willing to take back the product if I don't like it. That simple. If there is no such dealer, then don't buy the product.

I want to ask the entire forum here. When was the last time you walked into a store to look at Audio-Video equipment? Forget buying. You are evaluating at this stage. We should try make this a poll. There are exceptions for products that are simply not available in our country. A popular and highly rated Denon 4800H sells heaps. Surely, someone must have it in store.

True!
I have travelled to bengalur to audition speakers. I will be going to mumbai to audition some speaker.
I have heard 4800 in a store or 2. They dint sound as good as it does at my place now.
Problem is that there are so many gears and combos that its literally impossible to think of all the permutation and combination to be stocked....forget demo, even the stock they want to sell is flooded to an extent that a 5 year old model can be still found in the market! (as a new product stocked for so long)
If there is a dealer to demo a productor willing to take back after sales, better listed here!

 

[sandeepmohan]

I have heard 4800 in a store or 2. They dint sound as good as it does at my place now.

I am confused. If the sound is better at your place, whats the fuss all about? or did you mean the inverse? If the inverse, call the dealer and ask them to come and sort it out. You didn't pay big money to a dealer only for a sale. There is something called post sales experience too. If they don't respond, tell the you are unhappy and you won't be recommending them in your friends circle. The idea is not the threaten. They need to own up, provide a solution.

 

[Saiganesh]

I am confused. If the sound is better at your place, whats the fuss all about? or did you mean the inverse? If the inverse, call the dealer and ask them to come and sort it out. You didn't pay big money to a dealer only for a sale. There is something called post sales experience too. If they don't respond, tell the you are unhappy and you won't be recommending them in your friends circle. The idea is not the threaten. They need to own up, provide a solution.

The sound is better than the setup in showroom. But dint mean its better than the sound from a decade old avr.
The dealer points to service. Service says everything is functional and wants to add on dirac or audysy...you know how this circle works....!!!

 

[Nitin K]

The sound is better than the setup in showroom. But dint mean its better than the sound from a decade old avr.
The dealer points to service. Service says everything is functional and wants to add on dirac or audysy...you know how this circle works....!!!

Denon comes with the basic Audyssey setup without the phone app which is extra.
I am a bit confused here since according to you, the sound of the Denon avr in the showroom was not up to your expectation and your old Pioneer avr sounded way better.
Then the next logical step would be to take a demo of the Pioneer Elite series or maybe some other brand instead of going ahead with Denon.

 

[Saiganesh]

Denon comes with the basic Audyssey setup without the phone app which is extra.
I am a bit confused here since according to you, the sound of the Denon avr in the showroom was not up to your expectation and your old Pioneer avr sounded way better.
Then the next logical step would be to take a demo of the Pioneer Elite series or maybe some other brand instead of going ahead with Denon.

Pioneer lx 305/505 or 805 dint have any accolades in the whole of all the forums and reviews searched....news about pioneer getting bankrupt and taken over along with such a face of review ...the result!

 

[Nitin K]

Pioneer lx 305/505 or 805 dint have any accolades in the whole of all the forums and reviews searched....news about pioneer getting bankrupt and taken over along with such a face of review ...the result!

Ok, but I think Pioneer is still there with Onkyo too. For movies even the slightly higher end Yamaha among the main stream avrs is good.

 

[keith_correa]

So:

You liked your old Pioneer AVR sound. OK!

You wanted new features and decided to change to a new AVR. OK!

You zeroed in on a Denon! OK!

You heard the Denon at the showroom and bought it. OK!

The Denon sounds better at your home than it sounded at the showroom. OK!

Now, you say that the old Pioneer sounds better. OK!

1. You bought the Denon after listening to it which means you liked how it sounded. So you knew what to expect. Right?

2. And the Denon sounds better at your place than your expectation. Which means it now exceeds your expectations. Right?

What exactly is the problem? You bought the Denon with your eyes (and your ears) open.

 

[sbg]

Better give audysy as add on...dolby atmos as add on...dtsx another add on...but first need the perfect hardware...no use when the bottle neck (hardware dac amps) are too narrow to trade!!

... and then complain , hey there is no sound et all.
Complain about Blu-ray media/Prime / hotstar / etc why the hell they don't give dtsx. I've just "subscribed" to dtsX only on my AVR.
....

oh, Denon was a shit 13 years back too. Marantz was recommended when I picked up.

 

[reignofchaos]

Most of these receivers are chip amps now. You can't expect much from them.

 

[Nitin K]

So:

You liked your old Pioneer AVR sound. OK!

You wanted new features and decided to change to a new AVR. OK!

You zeroed in on a Denon! OK!

You heard the Denon at the showroom and bought it. OK!

The Denon sounds better at your home than it sounded at the showroom. OK!

Now, you say that the old Pioneer sounds better. OK!

1. You bought the Denon after listening to it which means you liked how it sounded. So you knew what to expect. Right?

2. And the Denon sounds better at your place than your expectation. Which means it now exceeds your expectations. Right?

What exactly is the problem? You bought the Denon with your eyes (and your ears) open.

This kind of a logical analysis of the sequence of events can only come from an experienced programmer .

 

[kneo]

I too have an old receiver (very entry level) but need support for Atmos, 4K, etc. How does one figure that piece out without swapping the receiver

 

[Nash07]

I too have an old receiver (very entry level) but need support for Atmos, 4K, etc. How does one figure that piece out without swapping the receiver

Correct me if I'm wrong.... But I think only NAD avrs have the option of being upgraded by swapping boards.

 

[k-pad]

I too have an old receiver (very entry level) but need support for Atmos, 4K, etc. How does one figure that piece out without swapping the receiver

Separates?