Whats happening in Hifi?? Dont buy avr now....read on!

[k-pad]

A four-year lurker here, and a three and some owner of a Denon.
1. I think the biggest problem between when I came on over here in 2020-21, and now, is the quality of amps.
2. I think i have an hdmi problem in my cable also, and a high voltage problem in my house, by way of full disclosure.
3. All said, I truly believe companies are skimping on amps, especially in new-age AVRs.

Like, how many of us have even heard the D4800, like OP says he has?
From what i have seen on this forum, there'll be some mid-two-digits who own the 4800...
Why so quick to diss?

 

[keith_correa]

Like, how many of us have even heard the D4800, like OP says he has?

Maybe many. Maybe a few. And your point is?

From what i have seen on this forum, there'll be some mid-two-digits who own the 4800...

Let's say you're right. And your point is?

Why so quick to diss?

Who is dissing what? And where?

 

[matbhuvi]

Going for separate Amp over AVR is not going to solve the problem at least in entry/mid level models which don't have option for disabling the internal amps. What happens is, on higher volume, the amps are still driven and they put the side effects on the preout as well. Basically, the preout wont be clean and they degrade with increase in volume. In lower volume, it should be fine. So, AVR processor or higher end AVR would be needed. I used to think that Oppo bluray players were expensive. Fast forward, we don't AV Processors in that range which can give such clean output. Even without room correction, which you would need mostly for the first 500hz, you do have options like minidsp for the subs. I upgraded to a Denon from Pioneer elite avr as well when i wanted atmos. I can clearly understand OP's frustration.

 

[sandeepmohan]

Going for separate Amp over AVR is not going to solve the problem at least in entry/mid level models which don't have option for disabling the internal amps. What happens is, on higher volume, the amps are still driven and they put the side effects on the preout as well.

I'm not sure how you are helping the FM member with your response.

This part of what you've written is baseless. A Pre Out is just a pre out. It has not connection whatsoever to the internal amps. Driven or not driven, they don't come in the way. Even Stereo amplifiers have pre outs and you can't disable the Amplifier (On most amps) section when you use the pre puts.

There are cost and practical limitations to using a Pre Power set up. Thats the reason most of us opt for an all in one unit. Its a convenient one box solution that does more than just amplifying the signal input.

 

[rwnano]

Going for separate Amp over AVR is not going to solve the problem at least in entry/mid level models which don't have option for disabling the internal amps. What happens is, on higher volume, the amps are still driven and they put the side effects on the preout as well. Basically, the preout wont be clean and they degrade with increase in volume. In lower volume, it should be fine. So, AVR processor or higher end AVR would be needed. I used to think that Oppo bluray players were expensive. Fast forward, we don't AV Processors in that range which can give such clean output. Even without room correction, which you would need mostly for the first 500hz, you do have options like minidsp for the subs. I upgraded to a Denon from Pioneer elite avr as well when i wanted atmos. I can clearly understand OP's frustration.

Interesting observation

 

[DB1989]

This part of what you've written is baseless. A Pre Out is just a pre out. It has not connection whatsoever to the internal amps. Driven or not driven, they don't come in the way. Even Stereo amplifiers have pre outs and you can't disable the Amplifier (On most amps) section when you use the pre puts.

Actually, this was a well known issue in Denon and Marantz AVRs. I've time stamped the video below for a quick 20 second primer.

In fact, this problem was specifically resolved post the X3600H series after inter alia Audioholics flagged it for the umpteenth time.

 

[Amarendra]

Pioneer lx 305/505 or 805 dint have any accolades in the whole of all the forums and reviews searched....news about pioneer getting bankrupt and taken over along with such a face of review ...the result!

I run a Pioneer and a Denon in my HT. Every few days I swap the Denon out for the Pioneer because Pioneer produces a very large soundfield- the roof practically disappears in my room- bass response is crunchy and at another level. However I keep going back to the Denon as well- more cohesive sound, better dialogues, easier menus, Audyssey, etc. Each has a different flavor to offer. I prefer listening to the Denon without the carpet in the room - it makes the sound effortless and more to my liking. The room and speakers are the same but the AVR responses are different calling for changes.
Perhaps you can experiment with the room -not all room treatment may be beneficial. In fact there used to be some good listening rooms/ showrooms in South Mumbai where even crappy AVRs used to sound like million $ equipment. Bring the AVR home and I was left wondering what went wrong and I need an upgraded version/ better speakers. But the issues are also with the environment in which the equipment is kept and how the environment interacts with the system output. So do work on the room, try some DSP, use the pre-outs (now a days the amp section shuts down as mentioned by Darpan) and re-try.
In fact if AVR and other audio equipment start sounding perfect out of the box then what will most of us do in our spare time !!!!

 

[matbhuvi]

I'm not sure how you are helping the FM member with your response.

This part of what you've written is baseless. A Pre Out is just a pre out. It has not connection whatsoever to the internal amps. Driven or not driven, they don't come in the way. Even Stereo amplifiers have pre outs and you can't disable the Amplifier (On most amps) section when you use the pre puts.

There are cost and practical limitations to using a Pre Power set up. Thats the reason most of us opt for an all in one unit. Its a convenient one box solution that does more than just amplifying the signal input.

Try reading the measurement results in Audiosciencereview. Dont form opinion before understanding the facts.