CA 640V2 VS Marantz PM7003

[psychotropic]

hey square wave....absolutely......i would never suggest that the quality of the parts is the only aspect that determines the quality of the audio output, there are certainly a plethora of other factors, but many significant factors are cost-loaded, and therefore, especially within a single manufacturer's range of products, price is a pretty reliable indicator of quality.

Dear Psychotropic,
It is not just the quality of parts that make the music. It is only one criterion. There are lots of other design criteria which make a huge difference in sound. Most of these are just not possible in an all-in-one box called AVR.

 

[gobble]

So what has the audio industry done that they should continue wanting to rake in their millions. All they give is the same 2-channel sound at 16-bit that is sampled at 44,100 Hz. Have they even tried to better/improve on this? Nah, instead the guys want to make better equipment (make that more expensive equipment) that plays the same old format and yet want to charge us more. The PC/Software industry is better with at least trying out oversampling, going with 24-bit, etc.

I couldn't agree more. DVDs have been around for 12 years now presenting a golden opportunity to restore some of the original beauty of analog recordings with higher resolution. But we are still stuck with the original format for what?

If any one asks me for my recommendation for the most cost-effective way to achieve that great sound that is immensely enjoyable and exhilarating for its 'a-liveness" to hear, I am quite confident (although I haven't paired it yet) that my budget nad c325bee paired with a turntable would beat the hell out of a lot of ultra expensive gear in cd format.

I am talking about living those simple human emotions during listening sessions, that make you simply not care if the sound is less than perfect without that $3000 player/amp/speaker combo. Vinyl is quite capable of "bringing it home" to you.

Cheers

 

[gobble]

Dear Psychotropic,
It is not just the quality of parts that make the music. It is only one criterion. There are lots of other design criteria which make a huge difference in sound. Most of these are just not possible in an all-in-one box called AVR.

IMO that most AVRs have failed to level with stereo should not prevent a manufacturer from trying to bridge the gap. Their designers are going to do their best and try it out in the market within the constraints of their research budget and time to market targets set for them. There is this endless cycle of innovation and invention we should appreciate rather than reject out right. It is for the consumer base at large to accept/reject a design or model and doom a product or make it successful.

But as individuals (and audiophiles in particular) we should approach with an open mind (and ear) and atleast audition (for free ) before we decide to rubbish it.

Just my chaar-annas. (being throwing a lot of them around lately )
Cheers

 

[Sumit]

Hi Sumit,
IMO u need a bigger amp than both these to really get the most out of your PSB 55. If u were to simply choose between the above then i would always go for the marantz. (have not heard this new marantz though) Consider some Nad too(used Nad C372 etc) for this speaker as its a decent amp for the money. Can look at some used SS power amps too. The CA is a complete NO NO for anything but small bookshelves for me.

Rgds

For the last couple of posts I have stood at the sidelines and watched the big guns exchange fire!! And, like so many other threads...this thread has been a little lost. I request people to concentrate on the problem at hand and leave the rest for another thread. No offence.

HI Dinyaar!

Dinyaar I am surprised that you think CA is not good enough for Floor Standers. I am sure you must be speaking from experience here. Can u elaborate the same.
I am insisting on this because while taking a demo of CA, I asked the sales chap to power Mordaunt Short Performance instead of the Mezzo 6. Performance is a big speaker to handle. CA 640 was able to hadle them. Although, I admit things were much better when a stereo amp of another make : CARAT was used. It was a new arrival and I had not heard the same before. But, it threw the CA out of the window. Sound was sweeeeet. The prob is that costed approx 60. And, I have not heard of this company. BUt, CA was able to drive them in a decent manner.

Secondly, don't you think the NAD 372 would be an overkill for the PSB t55. Senstivity 93db and Impedance 6ohms.

Thanks

 

[gobble]

With 92db you should be good with a 50 to 80W amp on speakers rated @100W continuous I guess.

I heard the CA 640A with the 906i and it sounded good with nothing lacking or straining. But I keep missing the extra "oomph" factor on my 50W nad 325 paired with 100W continuous rated Wharfedale 9.2s. Nothing is lacking in musicality mind you, the bass thumps and it has a sharp attack, but "oomph" is not just about bass ... its hard to explain in words. Maybe its my power chord/supply then maybe its just lack of power. Some speakers bloom and excel only when driven with lots of power.

I would still recommend pairing a 100W speaker with a 150W amp at minimum to prevent this. This way you will get an amp that completely enslaves your speaker and drives it to death (not literally!!).



Have you auditioned at low volumes? Is the sound equally fluid then or is it just a tad insipid? You may realize you are missing something if you try that.

Regards

 

[moserw]

For the last couple of posts I have stood at the sidelines and watched the big guns exchange fire!! And, like so many other threads...this thread has been a little lost. I request people to concentrate on the problem at hand and leave the rest for another thread. No offence.

My apologies Sumit... and I'm no big gun (if I've been mistaken for one that is)!

 

[Sumit]

My apologies Sumit... and I'm no big gun (if I've been mistaken for one that is)!

No Apologies required Moser.....and 'big gun' was a figure of speech.

Sumit

 

[Sumit]

I would still recommend pairing a 100W speaker with a 150W amp at minimum to prevent this.

Regards

Gobble, I am afraid, I will have to disagree. There is no hard and fast rule to support this. Case in point is companies like HK and Onkyo. While HK rates his amps modestly, Onyko gets too optimistic. A 50 watter of a particular company can sometimes beat a 100 watter of another...seriously.
This wattage has been discussed a lot. And, till date it is debatable!!!!

Sumit

 

[dinyaar]

Hi Sumit,
Firstly the Nad 372 is hardly overkill for anything. Its not the best amplifier obviously but has a better supply than these CA integrateds and has drive. Its not that bigger is always better but in SS amps bigger ends up being better.
If u are happy with the CA, since ur speakers are 93db u may be Ok. Even a Nad 320 would drive these speakers but that would not mean its an ideal amplifier for the speakers. CA has good tone in the price range but lacks drive IMO.
Have last heard a CA amp a while ago as no one i know seems to have retained their amp. Also i have a dislike for CA amps that is more than apparent so my opinion can be biased.
Rgds

 

[Sumit]

Hi!!

As per Dinyaar's suggestion, I enquired about NAD Integrated. I spoke to Priyesh from lakozy. He is friend. He can provide me both Marantz and NAD. I had bought my speakers and interconnects from him.

He is suggesting 375 ( as 372 has been discontinued). MRP of same is 85k. This is way beyond my budget. Next in line is 355. Priyesh says that this will match very well with T55. But, may not be enough (80W) in the future when I buy better speakers...Maybe. In this case I could add a power amp to this and make this as a Pre. I value his suggestions and since he is a friend he will give me honest opinion.

I would like to know your (Dinyaar) and other members take on NAD 355 with T55.

Thanks.

Hi Sumit,
Firstly the Nad 372 is hardly overkill for anything. Its not the best amplifier obviously but has a better supply than these CA integrateds and has drive. Its not that bigger is always better but in SS amps bigger ends up being better.
If u are happy with the CA, since ur speakers are 93db u may be Ok. Even a Nad 320 would drive these speakers but that would not mean its an ideal amplifier for the speakers. CA has good tone in the price range but lacks drive IMO.
Have last heard a CA amp a while ago as no one i know seems to have retained their amp. Also i have a dislike for CA amps that is more than apparent so my opinion can be biased.
Rgds

 

[square_wave]

Some thoughts:
Nad integrated for 85k is total waste of money. Nads are decent entry level amplifiers and a good entry into hifi. Nothing more. I think the C355 would be ideal. I have owned the c370 and the c350 in the past.
Forget about using the C355 pre section with any power amp. The preamp is the weakest area of the Nad Integrateds. The dealer is taking you for a ride.
When you buy better speakers, you will need a better amplifier not more nad-watts.
I would seriousely reccomend the cyclops integrated (odyssey) over these anyday. It is the etesian preamp and the khartago amp in one chassis. Far more musical and greater control of the speakers. Pure symphonic line design too.

 

[Sumit]

Some thoughts:
I think the C355 would be ideal.

I am also trying to find out more about C355. I should be able to take a decision soon.

I would seriously reccomend the cyclops integrated (odyssey) over these anyday. It is the etesian preamp and the khartago amp in one chassis. Far more musical and greater control of the speakers. Pure symphonic line design too.

Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn't khartago amp have only one input? In this case , this is not for me. What do you think would be approx price of the above in India?

Thanks.

 

[dinyaar]

Sumit,
The price of 85K for the new Nad 375 made me fall of the chair.
The last time someone i know bought the 372 he paid 52K and i presumed 55/60 to be the price for its new avatar. Please ignore at that price. Now the 355 is nothing but the newer 352 is it? In that case the 352 retailed at 27K(i bought it for 25K in 2006) so if that is now offered to u at say 45/50K i would not consider it. I dont think Nad is rubbish at all, and have had them for quite a while but then the prices were much lower. SW is correct on the preamp being the let down, the power section is pretty good.
I have heard from a few reliable sources that the marantz PM 7003 is available in the grey mkt at about 23/25K which makes it an attractive option to me. If there is a used 372 for 30/35K max then its a decent purchase.
More and more i feel the only way to get some value for your money is to be patient and buy used.
Rgds

 

[square_wave]

I am also trying to find out more about C355. I should be able to take a decision soon.





Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn't khartago amp have only one input? In this case , this is not for me. What do you think would be approx price of the above in India?

Thanks.

The khartago is a power amp. The integrated version is called cyclops. It has only one input. I think the integrated is around 60k. Not sure. You can check with sridhar.
There is no selector switch in the signal path. Best solution for people who do not have more than one source. Ussually most 2-channel audiophiles do not have more than one source unless they have an LP player.

 

[Sumit]

More and more i feel the only way to get some value for your money is to be patient and buy used.
Rgds

I am finding out the best possible prices for NAD and Marantz.
Maeanwhile, I enquired about the used market. there are quite a few amps available. I think I shall take some time off and find out more about the used market amps.

I shall than take a decision.

Thanks

 

[neo]

Nad 375=85K what the F_ _ K? stay away from it def not worth the price.How much is the 355?
All the best
Cheers.

Hi!!

As per Dinyaar's suggestion, I enquired about NAD Integrated. I spoke to Priyesh from lakozy. He is friend. He can provide me both Marantz and NAD. I had bought my speakers and interconnects from him.

He is suggesting 375 ( as 372 has been discontinued). MRP of same is 85k. This is way beyond my budget. Next in line is 355. Priyesh says that this will match very well with T55. But, may not be enough (80W) in the future when I buy better speakers...Maybe. In this case I could add a power amp to this and make this as a Pre. I value his suggestions and since he is a friend he will give me honest opinion.

I would like to know your (Dinyaar) and other members take on NAD 355 with T55.

Thanks.

 

[gobble]

The 325 which is available for 22 - 24K in India can be had for 14 - 16K on tourist visa in Singapore.

So equivalent the 355 should not be more than 10K premium on its International price @45INR per USD.

Regards

 

[spycatcher]

Have you by any chance had a look at PM 7001.. its a wonderful piece - I have the KI Signature edition... paired it with MA BR5. Very restrained but highlights the music I listen to - which is mostly Jazz and Classic Rock.

 

[saikat74]

I've got the PM7001 in mind... need to make a decision in the next month or so... Will be pairing it with a MA RS1... Any idea what the price diff between the 7001 & 7001 KI edition is (in Mumbai)? or the PM8003 (which is equivalent to7001 KI)...

 

[Sumit]

Hello All!!

With Dinyaar's help, have finally bought the amp. I have bought used ( but mint condition) NAD C160 and C 214 combo. I believe this combo should be better than NAD 375 but I cannot say for sure.


I hooked it up yesterday and I noticed the following changes over my AVR:
1. Much better dynamics.
2. Immense clarity even at lower volumes.
3. Soundstage has increased drastically.
4. Midrange is better.
5. Bass is Punchy and Treble is soothing. Earlier it used to be shrill.
Basically, it beats the hell out of the AVR sound!!!

I thank Dinyaar and all others for there help during these confusing times. :clapping:

Sumit