THE BEST HTiB - Philips 4750

[vint]

Can you do let me know the price of HTS 3569/98? If bought in bangalore, let me also check. The 4750 is now available in Philips Arena, Bangalore.

So as one of the members written here, the TV audio out can be taken to plug in here. Is that so? Means one can watch HBO, Starmovies (and other movie channels) in 5.1 channel? Or only 5.1 channel applicable if watched through playing DVD's in this system? If naive question, do excuse. Just to get Knowledge transfer from all you experts here.

i don't know if any tv channel in india transmits 5.1 channel sound, most of them are stereo sound. So you can still connect it to dvd/ht , but you'll hear sound from only 2 speakers i guess.

 

[prakasse]

i don't know if any tv channel in india transmits 5.1 channel sound, most of them are stereo sound. So you can still connect it to dvd/ht , but you'll hear sound from only 2 speakers i guess.

If the AVR supports Dolby prologic II decoder then it will upconvert 2 cahnnel signal to 5.1 channel. This way you can watch your tv channels(stereo) in 5.1 mode.

Thanks, Prakash.

 

[Sujit]

Can you do let me know the price of HTS 3569/98? If bought in bangalore, let me also check. The 4750 is now available in Philips Arena, Bangalore.

The 3569 was picked up for 22k.

Listen to all three models - The top of the line model comes with an Active Sub!!

 

[madbullram]

If the AVR supports Dolby prologic II decoder then it will upconvert 2 cahnnel signal to 5.1 channel. This way you can watch your tv channels(stereo) in 5.1 mode.

Thanks, Prakash.

4750 model supports Prologic II . its does upconvert 2 channel to 5 but still it wont be equivalent to 5.1 but you can get sound from all 5 speakers

 

[sgmane]

4750 model supports Prologic II . its does upconvert 2 channel to 5 but still it wont be equivalent to 5.1 but you can get sound from all 5 speakers

Means, if i upconvert (making settings in 4750), i can hear 5 channel, ok!
Then if i hear music (CD), i think it willl still be 2 channel, right? So the setting will take effect only if i plug it to TV? (Ofcourse if i play DVD, it will anyway be 5.1 channel).

 

[psychotropic]

i agree that Philips makes decent HTIBS, i bought one of them for my parents a year or so back, at that time I had heard this particular system, and honestly I was not too impressed.....or let me put it this way, the slightly cheaper system that I bought, actually sounded better (that was one without HDMI, and cost about 20k)....i was actually planning to buy this one, but when I heard the two, and the cheaper one sounded better, I had no doubt in picking that one up. But neither of these can really compare with a good HT setup. Instead of spending 25k on something like this, put some more money and you can buy a much nicer system. Even the Onkyo 304 + Jamo 406 setup that is available for 30k (or less these days) outperforms this one. Add a 1080p upscaling DVD player for 5k and it's still 35k.

And before anyone points out that the Jamo is a 5.0 setup and not 5.1, let me assure you that the passive sub on the Philips sytem is not going to do much better a job with bass than the floorstanding front speakers of the 406 setup.

 

[VSG12777]

Had a detailed demo on Philips HTS 4750 !!

Hi everyone

After reading so much on this forum on the Philips HTS 4750 system, I decided to check it out and I went to Philips Arena here in Chennai last evening (Mount Road opposite Spencer Plaza). They had a demo room and this system was setup there.

I was impressed with the build quality, user interface, menu navigation etc. The subwoofer is a powered active one, but strangely no bass level / volume level control on the subwoofer itself like most active subs !! This has to be done only through the main system remote.

And the worst part - speaker volume levels, including bass adjustment for the subwoofer - can only be done after stopping and ejecting the disc !! If the DVD/CD you are playing is still in the unit, and you press the stop button and get into the system settings menu to adjust the speaker volume/bass etc, the speaker volume section itself is greyed out.

This is such a nuisance. Otherwise the system is really good and fantastic value at 22k. This one point really put me off. Different discs would require different bass levels and even with a powered active subwoofer, I am shocked that there is no external knob on the subwoofer for bass adjustment.

Otherwise the interface, features (with HDMI upscaling to 1080i and not 1080p) etc are pretty good. The main unit looks good too and very modern.

The subwoofer is one huge longish unit and I at first thought it was some home UPS/Inverter !!! The speakers connect to the rear of the subwoofer and a subwoofer out coaxial cable connects this sub to the main unit.

So in essence, buying this unit, you would be stuck with it and god forbid if anything does go wrong, you are in for some trouble. However as long as nothing goes wrong, it is a good system.

Just wanted to share my view on this system since I had a reasonably detailed demo on it last evening. All your comments / views on the same are welcome.

Sound quality / picture quality were very good in my opinion - I tested mp3 CDs, 2 DTS 5.1 audio CDs of Tamil movies and 2 DVDs. Did not have any DivX with me to test. The DTS 5.1 audio CDs sounded lovely. Except for the bass adjustment which I had to increase, but had to eject the CD and then adjust and play the CD again, which was a real pain in the wrong place

Warm regards,
Venkat

 

[Muthusami S]

Philips has a history of delivering great products (just lost their way of late). I remember their Powerhouse series rocked and only my Sony from Japan way back in the 80s performed better. Even now their budget DVD players perform better than most other companies (I am using one).

For connectivity I guess I will have to visit the nearest dealer/showroom and get a demo too while I am at it.

Thanks Sujit. You have been very helpful.

Moserw,

Please visit only the authorised Philips showrooms instead of a multi brand shop. Most of them do not have proper accessories to provide a demo. Recently, I went to an authorised Samsung showroom and wanted to check the audio quality of the DVD P480 DVD player. They said, audio can be checked only through the TV. I asked them to connect the player to a midi system they have, but they do not have the digital cable to connect. Even the manager of that showroom insisted me to check the sound through TV connection or I can bring my amplifier and speakers to connect!!

Regards,
Muthusami. S

 

[moserw]

Moserw,

Please visit only the authorised Philips showrooms instead of a multi brand shop. Most of them do not have proper accessories to provide a demo. Recently, I went to an authorised Samsung showroom and wanted to check the audio quality of the DVD P480 DVD player. They said, audio can be checked only through the TV. I asked them to connect the player to a midi system they have, but they do not have the digital cable to connect. Even the manager of that showroom insisted me to check the sound through TV connection or I can bring my amplifier and speakers to connect!!

Regards,
Muthusami. S

Thanks Muthu! This happened to me while I was doing the rounds for my Panasonic PV8. I was asked to carry my DVD player/USB stick and also HDMI cable. I also carried a selection of my favorite movies on DVD and in Divx formats. In fact without the HDMI I rejected the PV8 the first time around. Only on further reading and going back a 2nd time with the HDMI cable convinced me about the PV8.

Coming to the Philips, the 4750 model was not available in the 2-3 places I visited. Only the 3569 was stocked so I have not yet gotten a chance to check out the 4750 for myself.

 

[madbullram]

Re: Had a detailed demo on Philips HTS 4750 !!

Hi everyone

After reading so much on this forum on the Philips HTS 4750 system, I decided to check it out and I went to Philips Arena here in Chennai last evening (Mount Road opposite Spencer Plaza). They had a demo room and this system was setup there.

I was impressed with the build quality, user interface, menu navigation etc. The subwoofer is a powered active one, but strangely no bass level / volume level control on the subwoofer itself like most active subs !! This has to be done only through the main system remote.

And the worst part - speaker volume levels, including bass adjustment for the subwoofer - can only be done after stopping and ejecting the disc !! If the DVD/CD you are playing is still in the unit, and you press the stop button and get into the system settings menu to adjust the speaker volume/bass etc, the speaker volume section itself is greyed out.

This is such a nuisance. Otherwise the system is really good and fantastic value at 22k. This one point really put me off. Different discs would require different bass levels and even with a powered active subwoofer, I am shocked that there is no external knob on the subwoofer for bass adjustment.

Otherwise the interface, features (with HDMI upscaling to 1080i and not 1080p) etc are pretty good. The main unit looks good too and very modern.

The subwoofer is one huge longish unit and I at first thought it was some home UPS/Inverter !!! The speakers connect to the rear of the subwoofer and a subwoofer out coaxial cable connects this sub to the main unit.

So in essence, buying this unit, you would be stuck with it and god forbid if anything does go wrong, you are in for some trouble. However as long as nothing goes wrong, it is a good system.

Just wanted to share my view on this system since I had a reasonably detailed demo on it last evening. All your comments / views on the same are welcome.

Sound quality / picture quality were very good in my opinion - I tested mp3 CDs, 2 DTS 5.1 audio CDs of Tamil movies and 2 DVDs. Did not have any DivX with me to test. The DTS 5.1 audio CDs sounded lovely. Except for the bass adjustment which I had to increase, but had to eject the CD and then adjust and play the CD again, which was a real pain in the wrong place

Warm regards,
Venkat

Venky,
Nice review, honest and straight forward. I will give my POVs:

1. Not able to control sub volume: I think I have never even noticed it. Well for me the pre-set does the trick. When I set the mode to Action, the bass is at its peak and when set to Drama its at its low with Mid and High getting more support. So generally I play with Preset settings and never touch the menu in the DVD. So for me this aint a big problem. Infact, Original DTS DVDs the bass is too much and I set the preset to Normal to enjoy. So, I would say you need to try the different pre-sets first before setting the bass.

Again, the menu in the DVD is more of a one time setup. For example, I will increase the bass only if the sub is away from my sitting position. If my sub is near by to wear I sit, then the sub would be at 0. In my old house my Sub was at 0 (it was near my sofa) and the rear speakers had a +2 to offset time delay as they were behind my dining table.

In the new house it would SUb +1 and Rears 0 (again need to listen and tune this). Thats my take on this issue.

2. 1080i vs 1080p: Seriously, not much a deal breaker. Progressive plasma wont make it a real big to make this a decision breaker as the difference is not much. Also, if you have a HDMI capable supporting higher refresh rates you should be fine in normal viewing. People usually have problem trying to run a Blue Ray output from PS3 at 1080p/60H whereas there cable doesnt support that refersh rate and shows a bad signal or flickers etc. So, for me 1080i or 1080p is not really an issue.

Again on the same point, I would try two things:
First I will upscale from my DVD and see how it looks on the Plasma.
Then, I will set my DVD player not to upscale and check how my Plasma upscales.
I will check both and decide which does the upscaling best and stick with it.

All Pana owners can tell us how the P80 handles upsclaing . Again, i might be wrong here, may be 1080i vs 1080p makes a big difference in plasma. Can some real user post answers? I can do once i am back in INdia and have bought my Pana

3. HTB no future expansion. This is a very important conscious decision one has to make. They are less expensive for this factor only. SO I would say this depends on your Budget, if you can afford a good quality receiver et all (I had it in US but cant afford in India) with better sound then go for it, for people tight on budget this is Philips HTB is VFM.

I will give you an example:
I just bought a WD TV. Now, when I play downloaded Blue Ray movies, I need to encode the .mkv to DTS format so that WD TV would pass that sound and my Philips HTB would decode. Simple? Not really, now the problem is Philips HTB does not have a HDMI input so how the hell will i pass the sound to it? bcos in current scenario both audio and video will pass through the HDMI to Pana TV

There is a simple solution. The Philips HTB has a digital audio input (optical), so I thought I can use that. But problem is my WD TV has Digital Audio out Coaxial not Optical (this again thanks to tech we have two types of digital connection, one called Optical which sends optical signal and one through coaxial copper wires). So what did I do?

1. Bought a optical cable and coxial digital cable
2. Bought a digital coaxil to optical convertor (small units that receives input from coaxial wire and outputs it as compatible one for optical)
3. Connected the Digital Coaxial cable to WD TV out, Then connected the coaxial cable to the converter IN. Then connected the converter out to the optical cable and then to my Philips HTB.
4. COnnected the HDMI from WD TV to my Pana Plasma (this is in US not yet bought my plasma in India)

Now, my Pana plays the video and my Philips HTB plays DTS sound. So there is always a work around one need to find it thats all.

Sorry if i confused you all more

 

[sgmane]

Can anyone tell me what is the THD specified in these models? Philips HTS 4750, 3569 3565.
I did see THD is 10% for the latest model HTS 9810. (Philips - Home theatre - Sound and vision)

Is this acceptable?

Before one buy's such kind of products (HTIB) because of budget constraint, what are the spec's to be looked into?
Do enlighten me, because that would help me to decide the best HTIB VFM product.
Based on your input i shall decide on products for HTIB under Philips, sony or panasonic products. (I suppose LG, Onida and may be samsung too does not come into my list!)

 

[madbullram]

Can anyone tell me what is the THD specified in these models? Philips HTS 4750, 3569 3565.
I did see THD is 10% for the latest model HTS 9810. (Philips - Home theatre - Sound and vision)

Is this acceptable?

Before one buy's such kind of products (HTIB) because of budget constraint, what are the spec's to be looked into?
Do enlighten me, because that would help me to decide the best HTIB VFM product.
Based on your input i shall decide on products for HTIB under Philips, sony or panasonic products. (I suppose LG, Onida and may be samsung too does not come into my list!)

Yeap, they are 10%, in fact most of the HTB would be in that range. There is mega dabate on if Onkyo's values are reallly correct and so on. Lets not get into that. I would say 10% is okay for a HTB, I mean its VFM do all product and you need to respect that. If you are very consious about THD and what ohms the speakers are etc, then I suggest look at a proper HT setup. in fact audiophiles wont consider the 8' woofers in all HTB as Woofers at in first place so you know what it is. I would suggest, hear them first short list what you like and then do the comparison.

Trust me when it comes to electronics, what is in paper and whats in reality are 2 different things. Samsung Plasma on paper looks better but Pana in reality Pana rules PQ and we all know that. So use your ear, play your DVDs and Music and pick a system which you like the best. I liked philips for its clean sound and very good center stage but that doesnt mean you should like it

All the best

 

[psychotropic]

hey madbullram,

i compared panasonic and samsung plasmas when i bought them, and the samsung is actually is at least as good as the panasonic....i have read several user forums (like avsforums) as well that agree that for colour reproduction and overall picture quality the samsung is superior to the panasonic, whereas the panasonic has better black levels.....reignofchaos on this forum, carried out a proper comparison using his Spyder kit and concluded that the Samsung is superior for HD images (basically meaning that it is a better display per se), but the Panasnic handled SD images better (which means that it has better electronics). Anyways, i own the Samsung now and it is a splendid TV....both are great TVs with their own strengths and weaknesses, and both are great value for money.... so I'd just be careful about making sweeping statements without facts to back them up.

Yeap, they are 10%, in fact most of the HTB would be in that range. There is mega dabate on if Onkyo's values are reallly correct and so on. Lets not get into that. I would say 10% is okay for a HTB, I mean its VFM do all product and you need to respect that. If you are very consious about THD and what ohms the speakers are etc, then I suggest look at a proper HT setup. in fact audiophiles wont consider the 8' woofers in all HTB as Woofers at in first place so you know what it is. I would suggest, hear them first short list what you like and then do the comparison.

Trust me when it comes to electronics, what is in paper and whats in reality are 2 different things. Samsung Plasma on paper looks better but Pana in reality Pana rules PQ and we all know that. So use your ear, play your DVDs and Music and pick a system which you like the best. I liked philips for its clean sound and very good center stage but that doesnt mean you should like it

All the best

 

[psychotropic]

and not to forget......a Philips HTIB is probably better than a Sony or Samsung one, but are definitely inferior to the offerings from Onkyo, and Onkyo does have some compelling options at comparable (if slightly higher) price levels. The only reason you would go for the philips is if you don't want separate boxes for the DVD player and the AVR (which is a bizarre reason if you ask me). Like I said....I have heard this sytem.....and while I would slot it above comparable offerings from sony and samsung.....i would definitely slot it below comparable offerings from Onkyo.

 

[moserw]

Before one buy's such kind of products (HTIB) because of budget constraint, what are the spec's to be looked into?
Do enlighten me, because that would help me to decide the best HTIB VFM product.
Based on your input i shall decide on products for HTIB under Philips, sony or panasonic products. (I suppose LG, Onida and may be samsung too does not come into my list!)

Hmmm. Hopefully not offending anyone, but I would add Sony too to the "does not come into my list!" list at least their entry level and HTIB systems. I use Panasonic TVs (a couple of them, CRT and Plasma, and both are excellent and in my view the PQ is the best ever), but have not seen their HT systems in action so no comments there. Now coming to the Philips or even for choosing any other brand just do not go by the specs alone. Listen to it first of all for your ears are the best judge for what suits you.

One problem I have with the Philips is that its a DVDP/Amplifier integrated unit and DVDP generally don't last long (at least the budget ones) or else a couple of years down the line you will be looking for a new DVD player because the old one does not have the required h/w or codecs required to play the latest media. Both my DVDP bought a couple of years ago don't play Divx so I had ended up getting a couple of new DVDP with Divx capability. A couple of years down the line from now it might be .mkv or H.264 or some other HD format that the present generation of DVDP with Divx capability will not play and you will be looking to upgrade at that time. With the Philips coming with a DVDP/Amplifier integrated together just upgrading the DVDP is not an option. Also, its great as long as it works, but if there is a problem then you will be left with a system that will be useless. I have had instances of friends who went for such integrated units and even a simple problem like the tray breaking left them with a unit that was not usable. I personally have a 3-in-1 CD/mp3 player from Akai that the tray does not eject that I paid 18K for and similarly a Philips DVDP with a tray that does not eject that I paid 3.5K for. Obviously the Philips is an easier hit to take and an easier option to replace too. I have connected the Akai (using it as an amplifier) to a Sony DVDP in my sister's bedroom and she listens to Audio CDs on it, but even now I think what a waste of 18K which could have been put to better use like an Oppo.

For the same budget you could go for an entry level Onkyo like 3100 or 3105 and everything about it is replaceable. I also second psychotropic here that Onkyo is much better and much better VFM. Even Yamaha has entry level systems priced at 24K available at X-Cite and much better options there too.

 

[reignofchaos]

The Philips seems to have an SPDIF in. So even if the transport stops functioning, the rest will work. Its not that hard to replace the transport anyway. You can get the standard philips/sony DVD transport for 650 rupees in any electronics market.

 

[Sujit]

and not to forget......a Philips HTIB is probably better than a Sony or Samsung one, but are definitely inferior to the offerings from Onkyo, and Onkyo does have some compelling options at comparable (if slightly higher) price levels. The only reason you would go for the philips is if you don't want separate boxes for the DVD player and the AVR (which is a bizarre reason if you ask me). Like I said....I have heard this sytem.....and while I would slot it above comparable offerings from sony and samsung.....i would definitely slot it below comparable offerings from Onkyo.

Psychtropic - I am in no way attempting to argue - just putting down my experience - that's all!

THREE of my friends accompanied me on a full day audition expedition, that took us from town to town and range to range. The day began at 10.00am with an older model Philips HTiB and concluded with a 3lac/pair Feastrex set at some 10 in the night!!

One of the models seen was the Onkyo HTS3100. Not only did all of us feel the Philips absolutely murdered this much more expensive Onkyo , but also stacked up very very favourably when we compared notes of the 'Movie experience' in the evening - in fact even better than the Wharfedale setup!! (this left us hoping against hope that it was because of a combination of bad calibration and an inexperienced store hand)

Some people like bright colour saturated images, and some like neutral tones (witch might look washed out to the former). While doing my research, I finally went by the fact that I liked Panny PV80's colour reproduction and the fact that SD looked way better on it. Now the calibration gurus ask for the colour temp to be set to 'warm' - they apparently found the grey scale and colours in that setting closest to reference levels. I however find that setting overly jaundiced - and have reverted back to the 'normal' setting after four continuous weeks of trying to get used to it! (they asked to give it two weeks and we'll grow accustomed to it- I gave it a month and still dint!)

I therefore conclude that sound is hugely subjective - As is vision! Everyone should spend their hard earned money buying things that THEY like the sound and sight of. All these reviews and opinions should only be used to narrow the options down - The final decision should be left to your own eyes and ears!

 

[sgmane]

psychotropic/moserw - As you said in the earlier post too, that one can go
for Onkyo for couple of bucks more. Yes agreed!
But the post here in "Best HTIB". So i suppose this pertains to only on
the topic specified.
Yes i too understand onkyo is on the stage of "hifi" list, and until recently started offering affordable products like (HT 3100/3105/5105) for those who cannot afford those higher priced stuff (those looking for less than 20k or 25k).

Sujit/ Spirovious/ madbullram - like these members have specified pointing
towards HTIB.

But again, this Phillips HT 4750 or other brands (like sony, lg, samsung), comes in with the built in tuner, dvdp/cdp. (Which is not the case with onkyo,NAD,CA or otherwise because they are different category - that's required for separate setup of HT)

So my question is (and was), as specified, this brand/model is the best
among all HTIB's (LG, Samsung, Sony, Mitashi, Panasonic etc)?
If someone wants to only look at buying HTIB's with the minimum budget available, should he or she choose this brand over the other?
May be at later stage can go in for separates (like dedicated CDP, DVDP, Blu Ray, AVR et al).

If members like you specify that a particular brand/model of HTIB (Iam not
mentioning here about hifi stuff like NAD, CA or otherwise or even onkyo higher end models) is top among other HTIB's, then people who are looking for such products can shortlist those HTIB's and good for audition and buy one they like.

 

[Sujit]

Sgmane

What is the answer you are expecting?

All this discussion was about how one person may not like the sound of something another likes, and vice versa.

Please go listen to these brands -I felt Philips was the best at that range BUT Only YOU will be able to decide what sounds good to YOUR ears!!

 

[moserw]

psychotropic/moserw - As you said in the earlier post too, that one can go
for Onkyo for couple of bucks more. Yes agreed!
But the post here in "Best HTIB". So i suppose this pertains to only on
the topic specified.
Yes i too understand onkyo is on the stage of "hifi" list, and until recently started offering affordable products like (HT 3100/3105/5105) for those who cannot afford those higher priced stuff (those looking for less than 20k or 25k).

Sujit/ Spirovious/ madbullram - like these members have specified pointing
towards HTIB.

But again, this Phillips HT 4750 or other brands (like sony, lg, samsung), comes in with the built in tuner, dvdp/cdp. (Which is not the case with onkyo,NAD,CA or otherwise because they are different category - that's required for separate setup of HT)

So my question is (and was), as specified, this brand/model is the best
among all HTIB's (LG, Samsung, Sony, Mitashi, Panasonic etc)?
If someone wants to only look at buying HTIB's with the minimum budget available, should he or she choose this brand over the other?
May be at later stage can go in for separates (like dedicated CDP, DVDP, Blu Ray, AVR et al).

If members like you specify that a particular brand/model of HTIB (Iam not
mentioning here about hifi stuff like NAD, CA or otherwise or even onkyo higher end models) is top among other HTIB's, then people who are looking for such products can shortlist those HTIB's and good for audition and buy one they like.

sgmane,

How much does the Philips cost? The Onkyo 3100 costs 17K and I don't think there is much price difference between it and the Philips. My line of reasoning was not about price, but because of the inherent problems associated with integrated DVD/Amp units because of personal past experiences.

I do agree with Sujit that sound is subjective and the best judge is the person who is spending the money. My vote goes to Onkyo because that's the best sound I have heard over many auditions (best in terms of VFM and not the best ever). Just this Sunday I went auditioning with my cousin who wanted to purchase HK 247 paired with JBL speakers costing about 1.5 lacs. I was not impressed with the sound (considering how much it cost i.e. the sound was good but not worth paying 1.5 lacs for it) and brought my cousins (there were 4 of us) home and I played The Transformers movie (a Divx rip with AC3 and not a DVD with DTS) for them on my Panasonic CRT (not the PV8) and my Onkyo 3100 and it was a blast. They thoroughly enjoyed it and all felt that my investment of the Onkyo 3100 at 20K (with a Philips DVD player) and the Panasonic CRT at 11K gave much better output in terms of VFM. I mention the TV here since the guy was using Optima HD65 and the picture sucked. I am not saying the HK 247 at 35K with the JBL at 1.5 lacs was bad, just that it did not sound like how much it costs.

I for one am not suggesting Onkyo over others because it costs less. If so any assorted HTIB costing between 3-4K will do. My vote goes for Onkyo simply because they deliver great sound and I would put Yamaha too in this league.

PS - Of course this is only for the time being. I am waiting for when I can afford and get the 40 lacs Focals home. Let's all get together for a beer party, what say?